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I am a single 62-year-old male full-time daddy with 2 girls who are 6 and 8. I am fit and people think I'm in my forties but I can never seem to find a date. It has been years since their mom left she had just turned 30 and was too young for me but I was never expecting children. Since this is an anonymous forum I'm thinking someone will give me their honest opinion. I'm not asking for a date I just want to know if you would probably pass on a guy if he had children.

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Since I was widowed at 53 I imagine most of the men I would have dated had children, but I would have expected them to be more or less grown. Someone becoming seriously involved with you is looking at a minimum of a twelve year commitment to raising young children. That's a big ask, indeed. If I, as a once 53-year-old woman had met you, I guess I'd be looking hard at how much planning you had done regarding their education and future, whether you are still working, comfortably retired, or looking for financial support, and whether you are really available for a relationship, or if full-time parenthood makes that a really limited concept. I guess I'd be wondering as well, if something happened to you, would *I* be raising these children. I can tell you, I don't have the money for that, I'm still working 40 hours a week at 65. Those little ones would need part-time paid caretaking. I know people think you're in your forties, but people die all the time (and I should know because - you know - widowhood.) I wouldn't *automatically pass* when I was widowed at 53, but your financial situation would definitely play a part in my decision-making. Not as in 'comfortable lifestyle makes it worthwhile' but as in "If I have to quit my job to care for these little ones, are we going to be living on food stamps?" I will say that under other circumstances, men in their early 60s were in a buyer's market. Many of the ads I read while dating were from men who refused to date women past their mid-forties. If you're looking for an age-mate, I imagine some women will not want to spend their 60s and seventies raising someone else's children. If you look younger, some may wonder if you're truly desiring a nursemaid (or free childcare). On the other hand, as we get older, the demographic is definitely in your favor, as there are fewer and fewer men available for heterosexual women. There may be women who wanted kids and never met the right man - you would be their dream come true. I did date a man who was married, but separated from his wife. And the special circumstance was she had chronic medical conditions that were expensive, he had insurance that covered those expenses, and saw no need to pull the rug out from underneath her. He was never going to be married again. I could deal with that. what I wasn't going to do was invest 10- 20- 25 years in a relationship, and have everything we accrued together go to his wife when he died. The situation with your children would be somewhat similar. As for 'never expecting children' - most of us understand how they come about. Pretending you don't know the normal outcome of sex is maybe not in your best interest. You could have been clear with your bride about your expectations, and if you didn't want a ***second*** child, could have taken precautions. I know for some men it's kind of a badge of virility to have kids, so maybe you were kind of ambivalent? That sounds better, to me anyway. YMMV

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Good points thank you. I am retired. The girls univesity is already paid. I am worth a few million but what idiot would advertise it. I drive a cady with a nice house on the water with a pool, and boat. Yes I should have gotten a vesectomy. Never thought the woman would just up and leave her girls but it happens. I have been hoping for the women who wanted kids (where do you find them?) but Im thinking they could fined someone younger than me. I go to school functions, girls ballet and gymnastics and church nice women will talk to me but they are always married. I guess I new this already but people kept telling me I would fine someone. thats why I asked for the reality check. Thank you.

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Kudos to you for stepping up to the plate. Your situation is unique. It will be difficult to find a peer looking to spend her golden years raising children, and a woman younger will (and should!) give due consideration to marrying someone much older than herself. I think you may find women your age to date - as in go out to dinner, theater, whatever, but may not be willing to take on the lifestyle of a mom. The old saying is, "It's easy to love someone you don't live with, and it's hard to live with someone you love." An ongoing relationship with someone who has her own home to go to may work out well. In my youth, I knew a woman with a 'special friend' who liked that arrangement. She said their lifestyles were so different she could never live with him. I have nothing more to offer, sorry! Except, make sure you're not coming off as desperately lonely, or desperately looking for a mother figure for the kids. That could be unsettling and off-putting to someone who might otherwise be interested.

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I'm genderless on here (and act accordingly - no gender bias on moi) - can I add my two-penneth-worth with a completely different viewing angle?

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yes you can

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Gracias! Well, I agree completely with every bit of what OldMainer says (expansive analysis avec great insight!) regarding all the potential obstacles for one in your, not uncommon position. However - Houston, we have half of the story unaccounted for and not factored-in because you're both overlooking (or underestimating?) the power of (deep, growly voiceover voice pls) CHEMISTRY physical, incorporating mental, connection). It makes you want as well as feel you have to (within reason) compromise, negotiate, compensate, or have a total rethink (bit like trying to find your dreamhouse)...all of those early teamship-seeking moves which allow the promising and enticing relationship to be, as much as possible, comfy and pleasurable experience for both partners equally/equitably long-term. ...If you can both make it happen, where both parties come out happy, you make it happen. For example, you might be the type who demands their next property have a large balcony (yes, still talking houses) (or am I?, lol), but, because you're presented with the unexpected, rare opportunity to own your own pool, the lack of a balcony of any size pales into insignificance. Happens EV....ERY day. Probably happening right now, all over the globe! Bloody chemistry, eh? LOL So how come you two biz bods forgot that picture-half, hmm, I say, HMM? PS: we don't "find dates" (your case, ladies), dates HAPPEN to us. We'll be in the right place at the right time and cross paths with the right person (with compatible chemistry). Same for "making friends" (just weaker chemistry but, fyi, people do also have to find their same-sex friends attractive and alluring by a fairly decent degree). It HAPPENS to us. Bit like being a surfer. The surfer has to be prepared to keep paddling their board back and forth between shore and sea on, even a daily basis, the serious, ambitous ones who are limbering up for some competition, so that WHEN - not If - that perfect-for-them-and-their-style wave comes in, they are there and ready to ride it. If you're not out there, you're missing lots of lovely waves (oh, the double-entendres just keep coming tonight, don't they). And PSS: online is....mmmmeeeeaaah...let's just say, not the best way to do it. Plus, the brainparts that run this here mating show still operate according to caveman programming and wiring....They didn't have the internet back then...they didn't need it (our own brains haven't caught up with new ways of doing things yet), because they got out and about a lot and whilst mingling or passing others on the could 'smell' one another's chemical mix....and then hopefully found their personalities compatible on top....Voila! No exchange of scent, no certainty of chemistry.... (Saying that, always be wary of high chemistry that hits you instantly, it's usually NOT a good sign) ...HENCE you waste an awful lot of your time being disappointed by someone whom 'on paper' or even on the phone, seemed perfect for you, but, on finally meeting in-person, is crushed to realise they're "not feeling it", not even enough to agree to be just friends. (BTW, while I'm at it, best not to email back and forth for more than 2 weeks before asking to meet or not, this guards against anything over just mild disappointment and frustration when said "whiff" is missing)f. Basically, the best recipe for success is to start of friends until the mental chemistry catches up to the physical. You've got to not only grow into feeling as if you could kiss and cuddle them for the rest of your life, but ACTUALLY RATE AND LIKE them. The latter missing, is what causes problems. PPPS: "I am worth a few million but what idiot would advertise it." Ummmm......Hate to point this out, but, you kind of just did? (Whoops)

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In my honest opinion, many people in general wouldn't want to settle with a man or woman with kids. And it could be because single parents are seen as preoccupied, or that single parents are already complete with kids and wouldn't be able to make more with someone else. Either way, you still have a chance to find someone new. Chance bigger than single mothers. But it could heavily depend on who you have a chance with. For example, you might have a bigger chance with a single mother, as she herself is already complete with her kids and can relate to you. Let me also end by saying that you are a man, especially a healthy one. Men are not on a timer like women are. If you want to have more children, you very likely could. And it's easier to find men of your age up for an intimate relationship.

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There's nothing to stop you from telling your closer friends that you're looking. The parents you meet at ballet recitals might be married, but their parents may not be. You haven't stated what you want or expect. Someone to see twice a week? If the right woman cam along, are you open to marriage? Kinda funny (now): when I was starting to date after becoming widowed, sometimes my profile got a response from someone in say, Minnesota or Michigan. Did those men think I was stupid? I wasn't going to move someplace **colder** to be wooed. Actually, I didn't see myself moving at all. There was one man who offered to move me to Florida - but he was almost 20 years older than me. There was a man living relatively close AND age-wise a peer - but I still work for a living. He didn't mention marrying me and supporting me, and obviously, I didn't ask. There was another who actually DID just want companionship - but we had zero in common AND he was old enough to be dating my mother. Another man wanted to marry me, but I realized he, too, was an alcoholic. He also tried to manipulate me by implying if we married and he passed, I'd be well off. Unfortunately he would, when he sobered up, explain that his sons wouldn't understand if he did that. I realized (having been married to an alcoholic) not being partnered would be better than picking the wrong man. I did think to myself I might not find a "Chapter Two." Oddly I did, on Craig's List personals. Craig's list no longer runs them, (too many instances of human trafficking) but I wouldn't reject the internet entirely. Of course, you'll have to winnow out the women looking for a meal ticket, no matter what. It would be reasonable to test the waters and see if after a couple dates, your prospect offers to pay for a date or two. You're old enough to figure this out. For what it's worth, Craig's List guy and I have been together for over nine years. I'm an acquired taste. If I can find somebody, there's hope for you.

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New Girl ((hi!) and OldMainer (hey again!), I've gotta ask... Have you two caught on yet, since your last posts, to what just went on up there?

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No, I haven't.

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Sorry, I couldn't understand?

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LOL! The fact neither of you took the (side-)bait...didn't bat an eyelid and just answered straight.

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"I'm not asking for a date I just want to know if you would probably pass on a guy if he had children." That? Nope I take people at their word.

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Yes, I realised - and all power to you for doing so (as then other readers can then benefit). As did I, myself, ...bar the PS...as it reminded me a little bit of this (enjoy): (Note 0:55 seconds in) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lj-9lSEBBm0

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So I changed my profile and did not mention I have kids. I kept my pictures with them. Some asked if they were my grand kids. But sure enough got a lot more responses and got a date with a 36 year old hottie. When she came over she was not upset that I had girls. Except she was embarressed about meeting them in the small bikini she wore. I was a little suprised she chose me because I'm 26 years older. we had a great time but I'm sure she is dating other men. But it did give me a much needed moral booster.

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One other thing I forgot to mention. I was so nervous I kept trying to think of reasons not to go out. Maybe some depression. But I knew that I had to go out I just can't stay home all the time. And when she showed up looking like a model in a skimpy bikini and she was so nice to me really made me feel better. My neighbor told me not to put that I had kids in my profile I guess she was right.

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Well, deciding not to date at all allows us to avoid rejection. If one doesn't mind being alone, that's a valid course of action. If one wishes to partner up, though, one needs to take that risk. As far as not mentioning the kids - well - personal choice. I wouldn't take on someone who didn't like pets. I didn't lead with that information. I also wouldn't have a first date at my home. Too many nuts out there. Be well.

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Good grief, "OBVIOUS". Seriously? I can't leave unhealthy attitudes and choices like this lot, left unchecked and uncorrected for the hoards of adolescents that visit this forum (lurkers), automatically soaking up examples of how grown adults should behave with one another and, eventually, one day, towards their own young kids - NOPE, SORRY... *************** 1. You can't hide the fact you've got kids. That's deliberately misleading the prospect, making her think there are no barriers to letting herself keep seeing you and growing more and more bonded, when, otherwise, she wouldn't. It's unacceptable dating behaviour. (Never mind how any woman herself chooses to behave, that's her business, yours is to decide to accept or reject. You just focus on building up YOUR OWN quality and you'll naturally start to attract quality.) Lying by omission or hiding, so as to ensure a Yes, is called Entrapment. Bad advice from your (mmm, nice!...flippin' not) neighbour! Deliberately withholding important info - this case, (were the woman a genuine relationship candidate) potentially life-changing - is not the behaviour of a decent/quality grown-up and has no place in a healthy, adult relationship at any point, but particularly not right from The Off, because we should start as we mean to go on - and 'you reap what you sow' is 100% TRUE. May as well just lie in job interviews or on health insurance forms as well. 2. The fact one has pets, however, is petty, you can get rid of them (if ever you really wanted/needed to). Kids are a permanent part of you for-life. The two things are not remotely comparable, and therefore, not mentioning mere pets prior to the first date is not a relationship crime/boundary smash (unless the prospect has clearly stated a dislike or allergy, of course). 3. Saying all the above - this 36-year-old woman's behaviour was/is downright iffy. Sounds like all she lacked was a pole-dancing pole! At her age, you'd think she'd know better. I mean - bikini on a first date? 'Small one' at that? TWENTY-SIX years younger than you? Didn't mind finding herself 'ambushed' with the fact you've got two kids because - suddenly, there they were, staring at her half-nakedness. WTF? (Where the heck is your Father head at, "OBVIOUS"?) This low level of adult conduct from her shows desperation as well as low standards/inadequte parental rearing/teaching come the too-late teenage years. Clearly hasn't been taught to respect, value or feel protective over herself and her body (and heart) - or not enough, since she too easily has dropped that self-standard,....clearly not Quality, clearly not even seeking an actual relationship (FYI I know too many male web daters who would have been seriously put OFF (as well as completely turned-off) by that sort of cheap, boundary-less behaviour in a woman on first meeting). Plus, and more importantly, it's the worst kind of adult female role-modelling in front of two young and impressionable Tweenies (I'll bet they were seriously embarrassed and destabilized). Do you want them to grow up, thinking it's perfectly fine to be spilling out of a skimpy bikini - to think that's acceptable behaviour on a first date with a man - to boot, willingly at a (let's be real here) complete stranger's house who, NOTE, these days could so easily turn out to be a rapist or, worse, axe-murderer? WTF? You think that's being a Daddy? So I think you mean: the event gave you a much-needed bedroom session. And one that your daughters got made privy to when they're not ready for those facts of life, shouldn't have a CLUE who you're dating or WHETHER you're dating (until such time as you and she decide you want to get Engaged), let alone bump into the woman, for the first time, half-naked! 4. I know a cure for that nagging urge of yours. It's called Salvation through your kids. Clearly not something you've heard about or tried (or you'd be more protective over them and what ADULT x-rated stuff they get to witness while their little minds are still sponging everything up, getting programmed by it, classifying it as perfectly Normal-Healthy (hardly!) "because Daddy showed us it's okay". You stay single for a good 2-5 years in order to focus before all else on rebuilding your relationship or increasing your two-way closeness, understanding and empathy with THEM, which extra attentiveness they direly NEED following their mum and dad divorcing then (I gather?) never seeing her again - and which YOU need too. The way you're thinking and behaving, even around your impressionable "babies", is painting you as some cheap Chav - sorry, but it is! (You also need this relationship strengthening so that years later they won't just plonk you in a Home as automatic payback for wholly avoidable mistakes such as this one/this date). Focus on improving your relationship with them so that this intense need of yours for a girlfriend quick-quick-quick!, rapidly shrinks back to normal proportions or disappears for a while altogether so you can get on with what's important, i.e. your BASIS for becoming a great catch (even if you had 12 kids): being a fantastic, quality Dad. Plus you have females - you're lucky. If you can keep two female Tweenies happy, you're a long way to knowing how to keep an older version likewise contented. You'll know when the magic kicks in - suddenly, spending time with your two will prove far more fun and satisfying than with anyone else...you'll be turning dates DOWN in favour of seeing that new film at the cinema you've all been gagging to see, etc., etc. They are your GUARANTEED (if you buck up) lifelong relationship. Get that set in concrete and THEN you're ready to find a new wife/live-in partner/regular girlfriend. Men can be as rich or tall or good-looking as they like. But it won't help them any if they're at worst an a-hole or at best, even just not very good at knowing how to automatically behave like a quality father (thus relationship partner) or at least start faking it until it 'takes' and becomes automatic. 5. What I want to know is, why if the cause of your marriage failing was the big age-gap, you're quite happy to keep fishing from that same pond? Especially as it's a well-known cause for relationships not lasting. Why have you not learned from that obvious mistake? Let me put it this way: how is the way you unblinkingly-unthinkingly behave been working out for ya so far your whole life? (I rest me case.) You may not have planned to have kids but - tough - you've got them and now you have to deal with them (raise them). Are you ready to step up to your life role(s)? If not - NOTHING in the history of mankind has proven worthwhile or entertaining and engrossing unless and until one finally, properly IMMERSES themself in it. You don't get the goodies from just peeking from outside of the box. You have to get IN the box and STAY in the box, until, suddenly one day, you kick yourself for having wasted years, depriving yourself of the biggest, most crucial relationships and 'treasure troves' of your life. The alternative is bitterness towards you as well as their mother and it all coming back to bite YOU on the bum (not her - she skidaddled). Consider yourself thoroughly admonished, YOUNG man (- no WAY are you behaving your age and stage!) This thread so far has just been in very poor taste....silly, immature, very tacky, and now sleazy - enough to cause concern for your children's health and welfare. Not what this place is about, sorry. So... want to self-improve, be really proud of yourself INSIDE, not just outside, get to place a really high value on yourself as attracts similarly-minded women of equally impressive calibre, thereby finally discovering the ingredients needed to have someone to share your Autumn years with and hold your hand on your deathbed, someone whom can only help ADD to those girls' senses of self-worth and, thereby, quality of future lives? Start with this - you'll be surprised at how fascinating it is: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Raising-Girls-21st-Century-Helping/dp/0008339783/ref=sr_1_1?crid=M5IXI4QHLPYV&keywords=steve+biddulph+raising+girls&qid=1662994046&sprefix=Steve+Biddulph+Raising%2Caps%2C238&sr=8-1

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I took the OP at his word in the first post as - not trolling here for a date, but asking for input. As for the follow-up: 1) an adult woman 2) travels to be in a stranger's home and 3) wears a tiny bikini for the occasion, and is embarrassed to meet the little ones; an entry for the Penthouse Forum. Not sure I'm buying it. Never had kids, but wouldn't allow a stranger know where helpless humans live without knowing more about him/her. Certainly wouldn't introduce them, and certainly not introduce them to a woman trading [whatever] for a free meal. A contract between adults is fine - not okay exchange for the children to experience. IF this actually happened, both adults are woefully lacking in adult sensibility.

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Look, I'm 24, so I can't really talk from experience, and I think what people are saying is true, that many women closer to your age aren't going to be as likely to want or be able to take care of young kids. But as someone who wants 12 kids one day, as unrealistic as that is, I think if I were in my 50's or 60's and I was single, I'd be interested. I plan on taking care of myself specifically so I can take care of kids for as long as possible, it's my main motivation for eating well and staying active. So, if I was in old and single for whatever reason, and I met someone in your position, the kids wouldn't be a problem. Most woman don't really plan to take care of kids for the rest of their life though. I've never met or heard anyone say anything remotely close to that. I guess what I'm trying to say, is that a lot of women will see the kids as a deal breaker and that's valid especially women 50+, but there's someone out there who wouldn't see it as a problem. So, yeah, it's gonna be harder to find a date, but not impossible. I don't know if this is helpful or not, but it's an honest opinion.

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Superb answers, both of you. Real quality, thank-you. And now that we three have re-raised our bar back to this gentlemanly/gentlewomanly forum's usual level - *IF this poster is genuine, and *IF that scenario actually happened, *and exactly as described - and *IF he wants a healthy nest - with delightful children that few could resist for their being a joy to be around, including highly entertaining (a product of feeling safe and relaxed) - in a safe, snug, secure, fun, family home atomosphere that few could resist, too-boot, treated like a LADY...? *(or if not - at least provides the correct instructions from the Human User Manual (on how to become contented..happy and loved-up with your mate and offspring) for any reader-lurker to benefit from) "Obvious", The above is and always has been, HOW you (YOU) greatly expand and raise your demographic! You won't even need silly websites...charismatic you and your charismatic Mini-Mes (because they can't ever be the ex-wife's, now, can they) will be at, say, a farm park/theme park/supermarket/ballpark/playground/cinema...too many places to list, frankly... where single or divorced (and late-starter) mums with their similarly-aged kids (AND their woman friends, sisters, aunties) congregate...they or their kids who genuinely aspire to your level or have managed it already and wish to maintain it, will "smell" you all and THEY OR THEIR KIDS OR FRIENDS WILL FIND A WAY, DON'T YOU WORRY, to strike up a conversation, etc., etc., etc... It is VERY....RARE.....that a man is not only is impressive, bodily, particularly 'for their age', but mainly because it's a product of what's INSIDE. You get a much better shape if it happens that way, "Obvious". All these things count as unconscious mating signalling. With ALL the elements "smelling"/looking good...you'll literally be fighting them off. ....Or "what are ya scared of". You have my full sympathy, however, for the fact that, growing up, your own romantic-relationship role-modellers taught you that all of that cheap conduct and behaviour was okay (not an ingredient to be avoided in the recipe for a happy-healthy life) because, results show, they empirically Said So by Doing So in front of you or in your home where you could pick up on it. I had various childhood friends whom, sometimes I personally witnessed, were subjected to behaviour like that. Example, arriving after school at the home of a sister and brother and (for mere want of thinking of her kids enough to lock the bedroom door ffs) finding their mother in bed with some man, no bedsheets still on the bed. *I* knew it was wrong but...they, clearly by their nonchalant reactions, were USED to this unhealthy blueprint programming (repetition=desensitisation="No big deal, everyone does it"). The results of this "parenting" came in subtly but inexorably with every year that passed (it was palpable and patent) and basically ended with, in their 20s/30s, decent folks, like myself, shuffling or running away, permanently. And, with no-one left to treat them decently and help keep THEM socially in shape by "insisting" on the same efforts back - it all, their quality of lives, just kept deteriorating from there. And don't even get me started on their custodian father... Saying that, it does depend on the kid's level and type of intelligence whether they can remain impervious to what other people do or fail to do, of course. But that's a gamble. You banking on being LUCKY. Better safe than sorry if you can too easily create your own luck. PS: 6 and 8 - there's still time if you order and start reading that book right now.

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PS: And seeing as how you aren't there yet thus probably aren't going to be receptive to the incentives up there yet, I'll appeal to what I do know you value and know how to care for... Remember that famous Athena poster of the stunning, naked hunk (whom you wouldn't ever want to piss-off), cradling "his" naked newborn baby. That model (go Google) reckons he had women throwing themselves at him. Fifteen thousand, I think he said? I'd have to check. For being a rare, ROUNDED human (still reproductive) adult male. Obviously the model wasn't the depicted alpha (immature - unripe mentally, still ripening - so still carving notches on his bedpost) so they all ended up as brief encounters, but the point stands. Recipe for health and contentment (punctuated with lots of bursts of Happy): 1. It looks and feels as good as it can on its inside 2. It looks and feels as good as it can on its outside 3. It functions as designed to 4. It costs, i.e. its currency, is time and "doing", not money (or not primarily) 5. It lasts 6. It has hidden bonus extra functions or conveniences 7. It pays for itself then saves you currency then then puts you into profit Boom. It has to feel good inside, not just look good outside. Nobody's fooled by that. Some women still select you, but that's usually because they think that's okay and fair enough considering "they..." (you now know how it goes.........The merely-physical version is called push-ups, not pull-downs. INNIT.)

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