Am I doing the right thing?
I'm going to give you fair warning and let you know that this is a bit of a long read, and that what follows is somewhat of a convoluted mess.
About 8 years ago I met the person who would become my best friend (up until recently, now I don't know). We'll call him Ronald.
Ronald and I had a simple, yet fun and effective friendship which ultimately had its flaws.
In summation, we basically had a fun, care-free friendship where we hung out, talked about interests and hobbies, played video games and went to movies and concerts. A normal friendship without anything "serious", i.e. we never really talked about our feelings or problems. Occasionally we would talk about our problems but for the most part we had fun. That's basically what our friendship was: fun. Nothing more, nothing less.
I decided it was best to keep things this way when I started realizing Ronald may have been lying. A lot. About just about anything and everything. About how his mom didn't feed him, blamed him for everything and how she got he and his father to argue.
Ronald had lots of problems with his family (according to him). But I never intervened because, well, I didn't see how he was being treated so poorly. And it wasn't my business and Ronald seemed fine to me. I wondered if he had been lying about all of it, but I was never really sure. It was more like instinct; often you just know when someone is lying to you.
My sister is a person I've been close with my whole life. She's more than just my sister, she is my best friend. Our friendship isn't like the way it was with Ronald and me. It was about more than just fun. We are family. We are blood. We have almost always been there for each other.
One problem Tiffany (we'll call my sister Tiffany) has though is how she somehow manages to ruin relationships/friendships in general.
I don't think she means to do so, at least I hope she doesn't.
And if there's one thing that's gotten in between mine and Tiffany's relationship, it's been she and her relationships with her boyfriends.
I've done the best I can to be there for her, with advice, with talking, with everything I could do to be there without getting in the middle. Because ultimately when it comes down to it my sister is an adult, and she has to make her own decisions. I'm younger than her by a couple years, but to be honest I've always felt like the older one. I used to deny it but now that I'm 22 I've come to realize I really am.
Several years ago she dated my mom's friend (whom my mom stopped talking to for years and when my sister started dating said friend, we'll call him John, my mom had only been in communication with John for about a year, after not speaking to him for several years).
Tiffany gave hints to my mother about dating John. My mom told her it was a bad idea because John wasn't mentally stable and was an alcoholic.
My sister didn't just date John, she began to manipulate everyone including him and lie. She dated John behind everyone's back and lied that she wasn't with him. And he did the same.
Arguments (which I won't get into) began to occur between my mom and her friend John and my sister. At first I didn't entirely believe it, but then one day I saw it for myself.
Eventually, John and Tiffany's relationship didn't work out. I don't really know what the specific reason was, but I think it had something to do with John's drinking problem, not to mention the lying.
My mom stopped talking to John for years. Last year she attended his wedding, hard feelings seemed to have passed, but their friendship is over. They no longer communicate. John turned his life around, gave up alcohol and is now starting a family. I am proud of him for turning his life around after I had seen where he was in the past.
My sister Tiffany has a thing for dating pieces of s**t (pardon my language) AND people who have problems. People who are lost, depressed, or are compulsive liars and manipulators. Control freaks and abusers of both other people and themselves. Mainly people who mentally abused, and 1 guy who physically (although she may not admit it) and mentally abused her. The weird thing about it is, she's not exactly mentally stable herself. She's had a history of severe depression and on and off suicidal attempts. It's as if she is drawn to people just like herself.
She has always had a way of putting her boyfriends in the middle of her family and causing problems for everyone. Problems of lying, and most of all never taking responsibility for anything. Essentially everything she blames on mostly my mom, and some on my dad.
About 2 years ago she began to date Ronald. And as I've already said, Ronald had his own problems.
My sister talked to me and basically asked for my permission to date Ronald, and I expressed my doubts, though not all of them (I didn't tell her about Ronald's lying problem at the time). Essentially I was ok with it, and I told my sister that I believe in a thing called destiny and that some things are meant to be. And I really was ok with them being together, even though I knew they were 2 broken souls, and it would never work out. I told my sister that day that I didn't think it would work out, but I didn't really tell her why. I regretted that for so long.
But, I knew that Tiffany would have dated Ronald regardless. It didn't matter what I would have said. They just would have dated and lied about not dating. I didn't care, you know? My sister was an adult, and Ronald was barely an adult. To be honest, I still can't figure out what Tiffany saw in Ronald. Tiffany has always said she's only interested in mature guys (though I would beg to differ), but Ronald has always had the personality of a 15 year old, even to this day, now that he's in his early 20s. To tell you the truth, looking back I can't help but wonder how I even became friends with such a manipulative, immature person. But, we learn from our mistakes, right?
What I should mention at this point is my sister has lived with my Aunt for around 10 years. She moved out to live with an as*h**e "boyfriend" or two for a few years but she eventually moved back in with the Aunt.
So Ronald and Tiffany have been dating for about 2 years now. The same thing that happened years earlier with John and Tiffany and my mom is now happening with Tiffany, myself and Ronald, and my Aunt and my mom too and pretty much everyone. It's actually worse. This might be the worse relationship my sister has ever been in. She's basically dating the male version of herself.
Ronald's lying and manipulation has greatly increased, and he's shown the side he hid from everyone and covered up with lies all those years I knew him.
About a year after my sister started dating Ronald a major argument occurred between my mom, my sister, and Ronald. Later that day with support from my mom and dad, and after all the arguments and lies, we decided we would have an intervention with Tiffany and in it I told her what kind of person Ronald really was. The lying, manipulating, and more. I told her I didn't want to get in between them (even though I was put in between several of their arguments), I didn't want to ruin their relationship. I just wanted to be honest with Tiffany. I was concerned about her and I was willing to ruin my friendship with Ronald to save her from the mental abuse (although she can be just as mentally abusive as him). She's my sister, you know? I had to get it off my chest. I was torn up about it that whole first year they were together. It didn't take long for them to get into their destructive ways, and it took me many months to decide if I was willing to jeopardize my friendship with Ronald for the benefit of my sister. After all, before Ronald and my sister began to date, he and I had never argued and always got along.
Tiffany took note of our intervention and decided she would stay with Ronald. After that day I decided I needed a break from Ronald and Tiffany. We stopped talking for months. I was tired of all the lying, the arguments they put me in the middle of, just sick of all their crap.
After several months Ronald confronted me in several text messages, phone calls and Facebook messages. He told me I didn't give a shit about my sister. That I wasn't being there for her.
I called him back and went off on him. Told him how I felt. How I felt he wasn't entirely honest and was always so negative. How I've always been there for my sister, as much as I possibly can. But she can only make her own decisions, it's her life. We argued, and in the end we talked it out. Weeks and months went by and things seemed to look great. My friendship with Ronald improved, my relationship with Tiffany improved and even my mom, and dad and everybody. It looked like things had turned around.
Until my sister tried to force my Aunt to allow Ronald to live with them. And my Aunt allowed him to move in.
Off and on for months they argued. Just about anything and everything they argued over, but mainly the fact that neither of them had a job, and my Aunt expected Ronald to at least be working (Ronald has never been able to hold a steady job).
My Aunt kicked Ronald out after a few weeks. He moved in with a family friend, the family friend kicked him out 2 weeks later. Did I mention Ronald was kicked out of his parents house at age 18? Not slowly eased out, but kicked out. I'm sure at this point you can guess why.
He moved back in with the Aunt and Tiffany, against my Aunt's better judgement. And more arguments occurred. Again and again, round and round they went. My Aunt would call my parents and me, and ask us for help. We would go there and help them talk it out and everything would seem fine, everybody would be ok, and then a few days later we would receive the same phone call again.
Weeks/months passed and for whatever reason my Aunt didn't kick Ronald out again, that is until my grandmother died.
The death of my grandmother might just be the catalyst as to why things are now the way they are.
This time my Aunt gave both Ronald and my sister the boot. Now, she gave my sister time to stay there and pack her stuff, but Ronald had to leave immediately. Ronald didn't want to do this at all. His only concerns were all his physical items, his tv, his gaming consoles, his clothing. He didn't give a f**k about my sister, or if they had a place to live or not. All he cared about was his tv and his gaming consoles. His true side began to show over the next few weeks.
He moved in with one of his friends and my sister went with him. Yeah, you heard right, my sister could have stayed behind and packed her stuff but instead she went with nothing but Ronald.
So, my parents and myself agreed to go to my Aunt's and pack all of my sister and her "boyfriend"/my "friend's" stuff. Just to let you know, this wasn't the first time we had helped them "move". But we did it again because we care about my sister.
My friendship with Ronald ended with a phone call about a week later. I had been at my parent's house, and my mom had been talking with my sister on the phone. Somehow my mom ends up on the phone Ronald, and he's going off on her telling her her sister (my Aunt) is going to throw all his stuff out on the street, that she better do something about it or he would call the cops on her sister, and he basically threatened my Aunt with more than just the cops. My mom went off, screamed at him about this and that, he argued back, and she held the phone out for someone, anyone to take it. I took it and I was livid. I went off. You see, my mom had enough of her own problems, not only the issues with my sister and her boyfriends over the years, but with issues in her own life that I won't get into. My mom didn't need Ronald making threats against my Aunt and going off on her. So I went off on Ronald and said we'd take care of it, get their stuff out, etc. I really went off with cursing and so much more. It had all built up after all. I handed the phone to my dad, and that was it. I haven't spoken to Ronald since. That was about 2 months ago.
A few weeks after that my mom went off on my sister and after all the years of lying, horrible boyfriends, and so much more, my mom let it all out. My sister and mom haven't spoken since.
So what's happened now you may ask? Well, I still talk to Tiffany but only in text messages. Just haven't really taken the time to talk to her. I've made a decision to leave Tiffany and Ronald alone. To let them figure their own life out. God knows, I've tried so many times to help them. I can't do anymore. I don't want to do anything anymore. They're adults and it's their life. I'm focused on my own life, and they're none of my concern now.
They're living with one of their friends. And I don't know what their plans are now, neither of them have a job.
My mother and sister's relationship is at it's lowest point. They used to be so close. My mom says she's done with my sister, she can't help her anymore.
I told my parents that Ronald is dead to me. I never want to see him again. Not after everything he's done.
After that first argument about a year ago when Ronald blamed me for not being there for my sister, and after that although things went well for awhile I couldn't help but wonder what was the point in keeping someone so negative in my life? And after the way he acted with the situation with moving out of my Aunt's? I realized that people like that just aren't worth it. I hope someday my sister sees Ronald for what he really is. But, it seems like they're 2 halves of the same whole. They're both irresponsible immature kids. I hate to say that about my sister but now I realize it's true.
And I hope their lives work out. But right now at least, I want no part of it. I'm sick of all their b*lls**t.
Believe it or not, this is the short version of the story. I cut out a lot, and tried to keep it as short as possible. There's so much more that I could have said to explain the situation(s), but I don't think it's necessary.
The whole situation has had me really depressed. I've talked with people in my life and I know their opinions on it. But still I'm unsure if I'm doing the right thing. Thus, I would like an opinion from outside of the people in my life. So I ask you, fellow strangers, am I doing the right thing? Is cutting Ronald out of my life wrong? Honestly, I do miss the way things were before all the b*lls**t began. He and I always got along, and we really did have some good times. Am I abandoning my sister? Or should I try to yet again try to help her? The way I look at it is this: you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink. I've done all I can for my sister. It's her life to figure out.
Thanks for your time,
Harold, you're not responsible for Ronald or your sister. You correct when you say, you've done all you can for them, they need to lead their lives their way.
If their lifestyle affects you in any way, then distance yourself from them.
Ronald may have become your 'best friend' because you shared some common interests, good times etc, but he never was a friend at all going by your post. True friendships rarely end and if they do, they sure don't end in frustration and angry words.
Your post uses words like lying and manipulation and depression. It's all about misery, failed relationships and conflict.
John has broken out of this cycle by, as you state, "turning his life around" and is starting a family.
You need to follow John's example and get on with your life. Look for positives rather than be weighed down by negatives. The first step is to cut negative and damaging people out of your life and put yourself in a positive environment. You've done all you can for others, now it's time to do something for you.
Thank you for your response. I have to say, putting my situation out there has really helped, especially just writing it down.
It's great to hear what you had to say, and I agree with you 100%. Since the whole drama began with Ronald and Tiffany I've been thinking about cutting them out of my life permanently. Their lifestyle has been affecting me in a negative way, and I've had enough of it.
And you're right about Ronald. He never really was much of a friend. And true friendship really doesn't end, especially like this.
I'm worrying about myself only, and moving on with my life. The only thing that still plagues me though is if my sister will get suicidal again. I can't cut my sister out of my life the way I have Ronald. But at the same time I'm not going to let her put me in the middle of her problems. The best thing I think I can do is to keep moving forward with my life, while learning from the past.
P.S. This site has been really helpful for me. I think I'll log on when I can and help give answers to other peoples' problems.