I found naked pictures of my boyfriend that he thought he deleted
My fiancé and I are due to get married in less than 4 months. Both of us have thousands of pictures on our phones that we want to keep and have put off ordering prints for years. I told him the other night I would be logging in under his account soon to upload the photos to have them printed off so that we can delete them from our phones for more storage. I'd also be doing this with my own account.
So I decided to get started last night. I logged into his google account and went to the photos. After scrolling down a little ways, there are two separate dates in which he took pictures of himself ejaculating. One time, he was in our home and the other, he was in his office bathroom.
When I questioned him, he was shocked and hesitantly said that he was going to send them to me but thought I might get mad. I have asked him before if he ever masturbates or watches porn and he has always said no. He then asked me how I found those and admitted that he thought he'd deleted them. He doesn't realize that pictures get uploaded to his google photos from his phone.
I told him it seems strange and that any man who's taking pictures of his private area has most likely sent them to someone. So I then asked him if I could see his phone. He let me look through it and after a thorough search, I did not find anything suspicious.
But I am totally suspicious because he clearly thought he deleted the photos so perhaps he deletes other items on his phone as well? Like search history maybe... to cover up porn or chat sites or who knows?
Why would my fiancé have taken pictures of himself like this? And especially if his only intent was to delete them right away afterwards? I'm not buying it but I have no other proof.
In addition to that, we have sex only once a week and I am the one who initiates it. I want more and he is always "tired" or says "it's too late" or he's "in a hurry" for work. I have always had this feeling that he was abnormal when it comes to sex, especially for his age. He's 27 and should be wanting it all the time, right? I'm in excellent shape, I have a beautiful body, and I'm always there...wanting him.....but he only obliges once a week, sometimes less. This has been going on for a couple years. He says once a week is normal and doesn't think it's a big deal. Well, now that I know he's jerking off in the bathroom, I can see why we aren't having sex very often.
I was so upset, that I slept in the guest bedroom last night.
Please help me understand this. What gives?
So, under the assumption he *hadn't* totally forgotten all about these perverted (and frankly degenerately questionable) selfies - he knew you were about to stumble on them yet didn't think to quickly delete them in time?
What is he - suicidal?
If not, what were their dates and (think back) - were you and he at that time enjoying a particularly good run of sexy togetherness whereby he felt emboldened enough to take them but not to not think twice when it came to actually sending them to you?
It does sound like he indeed DIDN'T realise they get duplicated and cached. But - wait a minute: what do you MEAN "seems strange and that any man who's taking pictures of his private area has most likely sent them to someone"? Are you saying you can tell they actually got sent to someone?
Aside from that pending answer: He let you not only look through his phone but for a considerable length of time, i.e. in every corner of it.
Not guilty of cheating, that is. But - guilty of trying to put you back on your toes??? Even subconsciously under his own normally more sensible radar? And, whilst I'm at it - he *didn't* take them knowing he would straight away do nothing but delete them again, according to him. He had a fleeting impulse to send them to you, then had second thoughts, and THEN deleted them (or thought he had).
So let's get to the REAL issue. He's tired, wants you to take the reins for a while, but that makes you feel like the relationship has suddenly become one-way. So now you're trying to find out if there's a more ominous reason because HIS reason doesn't serve to make you FEEL better about why you're this upset.
'Only' once a week. After the first year, once a week is good going (don't believe the self-flattering hype out of there).
Try this thought: his libido is lower than yours, always has been, aside from when there's artificial spice in the mix. Like during the initial flush of Honeymoon. Or from the titillation of "being naughty" with you.
He needs more fore-foreplay. His libido isn't quite high enough where bog-standard sexual rituals can do it for him.
OR.. he might feed off of YOU and YOUR excitement. But how excited are you going to be if every time it's Sex Time, you're sat there feeling rejected and resentful because he's not playing Bedroom Tarzan to your Jane? So.... You're not jumping up and down on the steamy spot, meaning, he's not jumping down on the steamy spot, meaning you're not jumping down on the steamy spot.... Got it?
Maybe he's subconsciously thought to bring in artificial excitement to wind then steam YOU up, in the form of, 'Hhhhh! Is he cheating on me?! Doesn't he want me any more?!'. A lot of women, you see, DO respond that way, i.e. start trying harder-harder-harder to make him love her again. You're obviously more the retreat and study from a distance type... which is just perpetuating the mutual distancing cycle.
I think this is a case, somewhat/mildly, of, "Call advertising standards, I've been mis-sold!" I think he lulled you into a false sense of security when first you got together, by seeming to want sex all the time and - more to the point - wanting to be the initiator all the time (which, let's face it, is really impressive). And that went on for too long whereby you got used to it and understandably assumed it was a standard, unchangeable feature. But now that life's sh*t has taken the edge off what was a lower-than-yours libido anyway, the contrast is too disquieting... enough to make you think something iffy must be going on.
But I could be talking crap about a mere illusion until you answer that question of, can you tell for 100% certain or 100% high likelihood that those two photos got SENT to somebody (that somebody not being you)?
PS: They're not degenerately questionable if they were indeed meant solely and exclusively for you, though, and, as I say, because you two had been going through a good bedroomy phase at the time. Just... a bit unsophisticated and non-romantic.
Oh, and PS - if you want to know what's REALLY going on with you, then take a look at your opening statement:
"My fiancé and I are due to get married in less than 4 months."
FOUR MONTHS. ONLY FOUR MONTHS. EEEEEK! DO I KNOW WHAT I'M DOING OR WHOM WITH?! QUICK - LAST-MINUTE CHECK HERE, LAST-MINUTE CHECK THERE, EEEEK!!!
Nice try at finding an excuse to pull out or buy more time, not nice enough. ;-)
Still, that's natural. In fact, if you WEREN'T feeling like that and behaving like it, I'd be thinking you were a couple of sandwiches short of a picnic. :-)
If you have no proof that he is sending these photos to other women, then you must believe him, huh?
After all, 4 months is not a long time far.
BTW - WHEN were these pics taken?
Are you concerned (i.e. having doubts) because sending picture of one's pecker is such a blatant act, yet he doesn't "produce" in the bedroom for you today? You are not feeling "wanted" today.
How is he on vacations or weekend trips? Does his participation ramp up?
I did not see any evidence of him having sent the pictures to anyone. The only things I found on his phone that made my eyebrow go up a notch was
a) his spam mail is flooded with singles hookup/dating chat lines begging him to participate in their website. If you check my spam mail, it's flooded with all things wedding related with vendors trying to sell me everything for my big day. These days, your google searches haunt you with facebook ads and spam mail all the time.
b)When I looked into the files on his phone, I saw evidence of 2 google hangout video calls. Of course I cant see the content and the hangouts app shows no history. I thought that bizarre too but I didn't want to jump the gun.
The dates he took these pictures on were last month, once in the beginning and once mid month. The first date was the day I was shopping for my wedding dress. He never sent it to me. 2 weeks later, he did it again on a work day mid afternoon...still he never sent them to me. I'd buy the story of him thinking he was going to send it to me except for the fact that he did it twice on two different dates and still didn't send them to me.
Before we met, he used to frequent chat sites. I found this out one day when helping him set up outlook on his new pc. All the old emails were right there...and I looked at him and asked what that was about and he said he was single so he'd chat online with girls. He did this for awhile.
All of these things make me feel like...could it be possible he's on a chat site exchanging pictures with strangers he'll never know?
As for our sex life, he just doesn't want it. I want to spice it up and when I try to, he kind of laughs me off like I'm just being silly, which is actually hurtful to me. He doesn't get it up easily for me when I initiate it. He's only super hard when he comes to me with an already built in erection saying "It's time" so to speak. He claims he just gets horny at random times and that's how he rolls. I can't get him to get into it with me otherwise. It's like pulling teeth.
He did tell me today that he used playboys when in his office. I didn't even know he kept playboys in his office, much less that he had a subscription. See how much I don't know?
It scares me. On the day to say, we have the sweetest love. He tells me I'm beautiful and how lucky he is all the time. We are a good team. I adore this man. He males me laugh constantly and is always there for me. I have always thought that the only problem we have is the sex thing. I've always been completely bewildered by his lacking sex drive.
I think what hurts is that he prefers to masturbate alone...so when I initiate sex, he's already had his fill.
I see what you mean about the targeted spam. It is the way marketing works these days so it would indicate a strong possibility that he has at some point looked at these sites. That's what makes the most sense to me. I don't think he has a "real" person he is sending these pics to. There is no evidence of that. It would make sense if he took them to put on a chat site.
Maybe he is feeling a bit inadequate as he knows your sex drive is higher?
I don't think he took them to send to you. If it was just one then yes I could see that. Took it and then thought twice. But why do the exact same thing 2 weeks later? Doesn't add up to me.
Have you and he ever sent pictures like that to each other before? Or other sexual surprises? Had you around that time expressed more strongly a desire to spice things up?
Also - how much of an issue is his lack of libido to you? If it's causing you issues before you get married they won't just disappear after you get married. I think it's quite important to be relatively closely matched on that score. I remember in my own marriage thinking "OMG I'm 28 - is this going to be my sex life forever?" Although we had numerous other problems as well so if that's the ONLY issue it may be easier to resolve.
Yyyyyeeeeaaah.... This major update of yours does seem to put a very different light on things (- wish you'd added all of that in your opening post...but, hey-ho.) Although, could the marketeers on these websites be targeting old members/viewers, just in case they manage to reel some of them back in - what with the fact that the economy isn't as healthy as it was and new potential-customer databases cost? I wouldn't know because I'm not technically that savvy when it comes to across the board. You sound like you are, though, so - is that a possibility?
Ditto to the noteworthy delay between taking but 'not sending' the two x-rated shots... agree with Super Sarah on that one.
Okay, then, so maybe it's true you've got a case of cold feet but in this instance, have actual basis for double-checking?
Susiedqq's question about whether he has more 'bounce' at the weekends is a valid one, as well.
Well, now that you mention that about the marketers maybe targeting old members, I have to say no way, not possible. He just created a new gmail account in April (which I didn't know about until recently but I didn't think anything of it). His reason for creating the new account was because the old one wasn't syncing with his phone...or so he said. But I never questioned that so not sure.
But the point is that a new gmail account would/should not target him if he indeed has not visited those types of sites. Sorry for not stating that before. My mind has been on these pictures and thinking "this alone isn't right!".
As far as me finding these pictures, he took them and didn't delete them right away. He held on to them for however long the max out time Google allows before uploading to the Google Photos app as backup. He didn't know that. There's no telling how many others he took and did delete before google uploaded them to the photos app. But that could be just me and my mind running wild.
I can live with sex once a week. That really isn't the issue. The issue is that I have to beg for it once a week. I always thought he was just different than other guys and didn't have a sex drive like he should. He used to do drugs when he was younger and I researched that it can catch up with you, but also found conflicting info on that. Anyway, I highly support his sobriety and do not ever try to make him feel bad about it in anyway, so once I felt like maybe his past with drugs was the reason, I backed off from saying anything. I'm very patient with him.
It is now that I am seeing that he jerks off alone who knows how often that it bothers me. And I have to say that it would not bother me if we did have a healthy sex life, but since we don't....you get my drift.
He has NEVER sent naughty pictures to me. I have sent him a couple in the past but didn't get any kind of response out of him so I assumed he didn't like me being that way, plus that was before I had things backup to my cloud. Kind of a skeptic about that kind of thing.
I'm just not sure what to do because I have no solid proof of him doing anything wrong past taking pictures and I'm not sure what I would do if I did find evidence of something more. I'd totally freak. I would be so hurt and sad and empty. I don't want to look the other way either though.
Another theory that I have is that chatting dirty with girls online before he met me was something he did for about three years because he was a bachelor and it was a way to get his rocks off I guess. I mean, I can see that. No hate from me on that. But now, I have read forums about guys who are secretly addicted to that kind of thing. That combined with the targeted spam is making me think that maybe he's been doing this all along. I never check his phone because well, why would I? He's also not secretive about his phone either. The only other thing I have noticed lately is that his phone is always on airplane mode at home because he says it charges faster that way.
From what I understand, notifications will not come in until airplane mode is taken off. Should I test that one night when he's asleep or should I ask first? Or should I leave it alone?
If he is indeed innocent, he'll end up resenting me for this. I haven't had a serious discussion with him yet because he went to sleep after I discovered this and has been at work all day. I'm not even sure how to handle this appropriately.
And on that note, I've taken a Xanax to calm my beating heart and anxiety so I'm going to go lay down and look forward to your help when I log back on in a bit. Thank you all. It's nice to have help.
I can imagine how you must feel, I have a similar situation (I won't go too far into depth) but I'm not getting married. My boyfriend has followed a few porn accounts on social media websites which i recently found, and he claims he didn't follow them on purpose, and that he had never seen them before. The fact is, you have minimal proof other than his word. the whole email thing may be true with the sites targeting his email, but you don't know for sure... we all get spam emails. You have to decide if you trust what he's saying or you don't - which is MUCH easier said than done, obviously. If I were you, I'd tell him straight up - that "you're going to lose me if you don't tell me the truth." Tell him that no matter what the truth is, you want to know it, because getting hurt with the truth is better than living with a lie. If he is talking to girls online and sending dirty pictures you need to get out now. Extend the engagement, or call it off if he isn't more open to you. The last thing you want to do is marry someone who you can't trust or who isn't being open to you about things. Talk to him about his sexual needs - maybe he has certain fantasies or fetishes he is too embarrassed to talk to you about, maybe that is why he is so weird about sex with you. I doubt his problem is that he is not attracted to you, he is most likely embarrassed about something or upset about something, maybe not even related to you. Sexual intimacy is affected by TONS of things psychologically related. I have OCD and depression, and I'm a lot like your guy int hat sense. I have months where I can't do anything because I'm worrying about this or that whatever. (that's probably not his case unless he has OCD or anxiety that you know of or that he is too embarrassed to admit) but his libido may just be messed up due to a stresser he's been dealing with. if this sexual intimacy distance has been going on your whole relationship, or for more than a year, I'd say you two aren't sexually compatible which is NOT a horrible thing!!! You can move through it. Just please, I advise not marrying this man until you are sure he has not been doing anything sketchy on the side. My last advice: GO TO COUPLES THERAPY. if he refuses to go with you, threaten to call off the engagement. You, yourself may not be into therapy, but believe me it will help your relationship. there is no harm in trying it, unless it's a financial issue (which it shouldn't there are plenty of therapists who take insurance and would wor with you on the cost). I hope I helped you in some sense.
So...we discussed it all tonight. According to him, he really was going to send them to me at both times and each time, he chickened out. As for the spam, he said he doesn't know because he hasn't visited a porn site in over a year and claims to truly not know what that's about. As for the google hangout calls, he really looked confused on this one and said he doesn't even know what that is.
Prior to the discussion, he brought home a dozen red roses and immediately told me how sorry he is that he hurt me and didn't mean to.
The problem now is, I'm not that easily persuaded and feel very confused where to go from here. It is my inner instinct that he is leaving something out. I asked him how often he masturbates and his response was "not that much" when remember..I didn't know it was happening at all until I saw the pictures. I asked him why he dismisses me for sex but occasionally has his own private sessions in the bathroom and how that makes me feel...and he said that sometimes he just wants to use his imagination and have privacy.
I took this to mean he is fantasizing about other women or images and he said no, that it isn't like that.
Basically, he is playing the innocent card in all of the issues at hand. I am still pissed and distant from him. I'm sleeping in the guest room again tonight. I feel torn. I don't trust him at the moment and feel like I am most likely going to be indifferent to him for awhile. I don't want to start cancelling wedding plans or including others in this dilemma I have until I feel better about sharing it with people I trust (which is really no one). I'd hate to jump the gun on wedding cancellations but at the same time, will I ever know if there's more truth to it? With less tan 4 months to the wedding, this is for sure a hard spot to be in.
And to top it off, I now feel like stalking his google search history and app activity and everything I can monitor...but I know that's unhealthy and will only lead to resentment on his part toward me. I'm so confused.
Hi Joyceln707, I feel your concerns, I agree with that he has left something out. A red flag for me is that he never responded to your sex pics that you sent him, that seem strange. Having playboys at work to masturbate to before he gets home would be a concern. I doubt very seriously that you're going to find anything now, he's on his best behavior. The question is Why would he masturbate/take self nude pic BEFORE he comes home? my guess is this is what he likes,enjoys and until you found out, was he's secret.
The flowers were because of his guilt, which means that he never intended to send the pix.Any resentment on his part because of you "checking" his goggle account would not be my concern, he gave you reason to.
1. Okay, Jocelyn, he says that both times he took the pic then chickened out, making each a half-executed act. That in itself is plausible, only, you haven't answered my question about whether this allegedly innocent act reflected a particularly romantic and sexy phase going on between the two of you at or around the time of those two calendar dates. If the pictures were intended for your benefit but represented new and uncharacteristic behaviour in him then something had to have *triggered* that break in behavioural pattern and his at least SEMI-confidence in suspecting they'd be received welcomingly by you in the spirit in which they were intended. So HAD you two had a brief re-sparking into Honeymoon feelings and behaviour at those points/that whole phase or were these two times seemingly apropos of nothing different, no change, thus completely out-of-the-Blue?
2. This next point matches SkinnyGirl's own raising: that he didn't seemingly even bat an eyelid at your sexy photos is definitely not at all what a fiancee would imagine or expect, particularly if it were the first time she'd ever done anything like that (which act would denote a recognition of new progress in mutual trust levels).
WHY zero reaction? Too mild for his taste, were they, compared to what he's used to? Or, as you suspect, a silent show of disapproval and lack of sense of humour over it all?
3. I additionally echo SG's concern at his even thinking to behave like that at work of all places. To me, going into the work loos (or any room at work) and taking those kinds of pictures suggests a seizing of the moment, a striking whilst the iron is hot. But WHOSE iron? Obviously, his, but I mean - what or whose fire heated it that rapidly to that degree?
Does he TEND to get h*rny ad-hoc on-the-spot (on the HOP, in fact) like that - inappropriateness of place and time immaterial? Or might both times have been out of a response to the nature or content of an incoming electronic message from someone? What I'm saying is, it smacks of his being suddenly made h*rny by something definite coming from outside of his own natural biorhythms or imagination. Although, saying that, I suppose taking five to look at his dirty mags might have done it? Is his work boring or feature quiet lulls?
But yes, that does prove that he's getting in the mood at times when you're neither around to trigger it nor available to do anything about it. And yes, that would feel like selfishness, insensitivity and inconsiderateness if meanwhile he's not wanting as much sex at home as you believe he should. It would feel like something that were already a little on the scarce side were being frivolously frittered away rather than kept preserved for you for later.
Have you SEEN his office set-up enough to know whether looking at personal emails/IMs or websites is even do-able? Is it an all-male office, for example, with a laddish culture?
4. And now you're saying that re-marketing isn't even viable because he had since changed the email account these sites once had him listed under in their databases. This suggests heavily - to the point of counting as evidence - that since that past time of usage, he's had to have trawled these sites anew.
But like OCDTrouble suggests, unless and until you confront him over this aspect, you're not going to know WHY a man with Chateaubriand already on his plate, would go searching for cheap, greasy and gristly sausages.
5. Is he indeed turned on to a 'useable' degree mostly only by the illicit? Does that explain his inappropriate inkling to finally dare test you out over what your reaction would be if you received these two such pictures?
Does he like to shock on that score? Almost akin to a flasher? Would that explain why he (ref silent disapproval) seemed not to like or appreciate such acts *coming* from you yet did like the idea of you being on the recipient end? Certainly, it's not far fetched to suppose that an addictive personality might, rather than be cured per se, just switch his addiction from drugs to pornographic material? And even to want to experiment with making it an acceptable feature in your relationship (considering you and he are about to join lives, making it harder and harder to keep such things hidden)? Might he then get the idea that maybe he could or should combine them by inviting you into his inner sanctum and, at times, transforming you by however much into one of his centrefolds, so to speak?
Were that the more innocent case then I imagine, it being such a sensitive topic, it's understandable he'd want to have complete and utter control over it and its rate of introduction, which attitude might explain why he's not ready to have that elephant plonked atop the table where it can be seen in all its glory, nor certainly discussed in the open.
What I'm saying I'm allowing for is this: That he wants to cheat illicitly. But with *you*.
The reason this is occurring to me is because it does not make one iota of sense that a man who were playing away even in virtual-reality fashion would - COMBINATIONALLY - not only willingly let you search every nook and cranny of his phone but think to take such overly personal and intimate, downright indecent (to a stranger) pictures. I mean, if as a man you get it into your head that some lesser- or un-known third-party woman would appreciate a picture of your todger, then, usually, that is what you send. You don't include a (cough!) action frame. Because any woman with her focus that incredibly heavily exclusively on the purely physical and purely "dirty" would have to be a 'semi professional'. And it's not usually their place to be the one to be titillated. If, on the other hand, they're accommodating a perversion (this case, a man's need to both be the giver and the shocker), then that scenario doesn't explain nor justify why the hesitation that culminated in a decision against. He'd have felt free to press Send.
Does that 'attempting to bring you peripherally into his fantasy world' hypothesis sound fruit-loopy to you or do you think it's a realistic supposition?
1- We didn't have any new romantic spiced up phase going on at the time, but the first date was the day I first went shopping for my wedding dress and during this time...up until I found the photos (so like a month now) we have been extra cute and sweet with one another because of all of the wedding planning coming together. A lot has happened in regards to our wedding in the last 6 weeks with shipments coming in and things coming together. He's been really excited and giddy about it all...almost as much as me. So nothing sexually was different at the time, but I'd say we have been on cloud 9 lately with excitement.
2- I sent him a couple of photos on the same day in the past and after not receiving a response, I texted "well..." and he responded that he was sorry, work was super busy that day. He may have said he liked them, I cant really remember but I just know it was not a response I was expecting.
3- He co-owns his office and works with other family members. I won't say what he does for a living but his company is comparable to a construction company. He deals with different clients on a weekly or monthly basis and the secretary (who is a sweet older lady) handles most of the interactions with clients. The bathroom in the picture is his own private bathroom off of his personal office. I know because I decorated it. Not sure why he suddenly became horny at such an inopportune time. He gets home around 5:30 each day like clockwork. Anytime between 5 and bedtime, he will occasionally ask me to come to the bedroom..which means he's ready for sex. This happens maybe twice a month. He's always been that way. It seems that sex happens more on his timeline than mine. I never turn him down because as I said before, once a week is not enough for me at this point in our relationship and I'll take it when I can get it. The point is...he does tend to want it sporadically when it is him who initiates it.
4- Agreed - Unless both emails are synced together on his phone whereas the new email is only synced to the tablet. I have not checked yet. I will though. Not even sure if that would mean anything.
5- I have no idea. I really don't. I think he would be afraid of opening up to me and introducing his inner desires to me because he gets a little shy when I dare do anything kinkier than usual. I think he would be afraid of my reaction...as in he may be embarrassed. But I really cant be sure.
As for an update to our talks, he still says he wanted to send it to me both times and decided not to. But he also added that he just got horny on a slow day at work, he grabbed the Playboy which he said is his father's subscription (they own the company together and I drove to their shop today and looked for myself and the magazine was addressed to his dad so I know that part is true) and that during his "session", if you will, he was really into it and decided to take pictures to send to me. He then said that after it was over, it was like a switch cut off and he was no longer into it (obviously bc he was all done) and that he decided not to send them to me. He also said he was afraid I'd get mad at him for masturbating, and especially at work.
1. Well, he sounds really eager and happy about marrying you, that's for sure. And to an especially noteworthy degree.
Excitement plus seeing it being reciprocal might well have emboldened him; I can see how one would lead to the other.
2. Imagine if he'd been 'really busy that day' and some topless model had waltzed through his office. In other words, 'too busy' my arse. It's not like you sent him a snap of you in your church-going outfit holding a newborn kitten, is it. He's a crap liar (which is a good thing, but note it anyway because it goes in his favour).
Your impression of his reaction at the time, holds. Most people may not remember what was said but they never forget how the moment made them feel.
3. I would have thought being in day-long contact would be a bit of a cold shower, lust-wise, in terms of self-arousal via the imagination using a stranger. However, I imagine his family would have been chatting away about the two of you in positive terms. Men are compartmentalisers, meaning, they can forget you exist for a while whilst busy in another, totally separate and different life arena. So maybe they triggered him into thinking about you and missing you, which, coupled with his bolder mood, is what sent him to his private loo with his phone/camera?
Twice a month isn't bad, given today's over-busy lives, assuming the quality makes up for the lack of quality (which clearly it does or you wouldn't be here saying you wanted a greater frequency).
(The one with the lowest libido *does* tend to be the one who calls the When shots.)
4. Okay, do.
5. "because he gets a little shy when I dare do anything kinkier than usual."
AH-HAH! Giant clue. Plus, that final para of his updated/reiterated account rings true to me. Especially the 'coming down and deciding against' part followed by worrying about your reaction about the fact he was self-serving.
How many LONG-TERM relationships has he had? Or how many that lasted over 18 months/2 years?
I ask that because I'm now thinking he feels not only less libidinous than you but less experienced and daring, and that those past e-forays were him to trying to get himself more up to speed generally, and then recently again with you (not least, aided by the pressure of a laddish and posturing work culture). Is this pinging in your head?
If it is, or even if it isn't, I still can't ignore the fact that he let you in-depth search his phone despite he'd had zero warning or tip-off of your being about to ask to search in it.
Trust me on this, I can usually 'smell' cheaters and cheating behaviour a mile off, even from typed snippets of data, and I'm just not getting anything in this case. I'm not saying there haven't been triggers for this anxiety of yours that warranted closer examining, but I really do think you're naturally getting cold feet syndrome, but that, because it's not a conscious thing, you're trying to explain these background worries by searching for a reason outside of your own head.
"He's been really excited and giddy about it all...almost as much as me."
Don't be fooled. Men grow up learning to flash just an emotional ankle whereas women feel free to let the whole amount out. If even that ankle is noticably excited and giddy then he must have an even greater portion hidden under a very tight lid inside his head.
I'm getting the impression that he's very sweet but very trusting and naive (and a little bit clueless) with it. Is that right?
It's amazing how much has evolved in one day. This whole thing has torn me up really bad. It's one of those things where I just can't shake it. This is so out of character for him. "Something's gotta give" has been my mentality. So, the other night, I downloaded an app on his phone that would start backing up all of his text messages each hour to his Google drive. I turned the notifications off in the app. Then I hid the app from his display screen. Took me forever to figure this out but he gave me his phone to look through and I set it up to spy on him. I know it sounds terrible but keep following me...
I logged into his account from my computer last night to see what texts were on his phone from the day. I saw all the messages between he and I, he and his dad, brother, and a couple of his buddies. One of his friends was asking for him to come help him after work with something. His response was that it's not a good time. His friend (who is a mutual friend and is a really good person) asked if everything was okay. My fiancé told him he's having a rough time because he messed up big time with me. He told him he didn't really want to talk about it and that he just needed to be at home.
Well this made me feel better because he was acknowledging that he messed up and didn't cast any blame on me or show any resentment or anger over it. But the question still remains...Did he do anything with those pictures? After all he did say he messed up. It made me wonder again if there was more to it than just taking those pictures and deleting them.
So after I read that, I went to talk to him and I asked him if I could see his phone again. He reached over and handed it to me. I looked through his messages and the ones between he and this friend were gone. So I told him I knew about the conversation between he and his friend. He asked me how in the world I know that and proceeded to tell me it wasn't anything bad. I told him I knew that and that I was not upset over it.
But then I told him a lie. I told him the reason I can see those messages is because I rooted his phone and installed a program that restores all deleted content from his phone and that everything is uploading to my computer now. I told him I read all of today and yesterday's messages (even though "yesterday's" wasn't possible because the app I really did download only provides future texts). Then I asked him very calmly and firmly if I was going to uncover any MMS messages exchanged on either of those two dates he took the pictures. He said no. I asked him if he was looking at porn, chatting online or uploading pics online and he said no. I really grilled him and he persistently said no, that I have nothing to worry about. I kept telling him that I would be able to see everything he had done once the report was finished downloading and that this was his chance to come forward and asked him to please not lie to me. After he continued to say no even though I had solid evidence of uncovering that day's texts he had deleted, I finally believed him. I apologized to him for being so hard on him. We both cried. I told him what I really did to his phone and then I uninstalled the app and deleted the files in his google drive. He was actually impressed at what I had done to his phone without him noticing it. We stayed up late and talked and by the end of the night, we were laughing and back to being loving. And I felt really bad.
Well today, when he got home, he told me that he went out to the Verizon store and bought a flip phone.
What? I wasn't sure if I heard him right.
He said that he doesn't want me to ever have any concerns of him surfing the internet or uploading photos and that the only resolution he could think of was to go back to a good old fashioned flip phone. I mean this phone is basic. Of course it can take pictures on a tiny screen and it can send texts and photos, but it's not linked to anything internet related. No apps, no maps, no Facebook, none of his banking apps, nothing. As thoughtful as this was of him, I feel really bad about it. I caused this. He shouldn't deprive himself of having a smart phone in order to make me happy. He loved his phone. He still has it but it's now disconnected. I told him I wished he hadn't done that, and that it was sweet of him to try and resolve it but that it wasn't necessary and that he can switch it back out if he wants. I don't think he thought this through. He is really going to miss that phone. He manages his stocks with it and uses it for so many daily tools.
On the other hand, do you think its possible that I freaked him out when I spied on him and that maybe...just maybe he's afraid that I have the power to keep spying and therefore shut the phone down in order to not get caught with some future messages that only he knows are going to be exchanged? Or am I being too skeptical? Have I taken this too far? I feel bad for stalking him the last 3 days but I feel so much better about the outcome of the photos....I just sort of now feel like there could be other things he is trying to prevent me from seeing. I don't know. Maybe I'm crazy.
Hi J707, maybe I missed this, but did he ever explain why he never responded to your pics? YES he's afraid of what you might discover in the furture, that's the reason for shutting down the phone. Don't feel bad for" investigating" the situation. Shutting down the smart phone wasn't necessary. If he truly won't be doing of this again, why change the phone.
"On the other hand, do you think its possible that I freaked him out when I spied on him and that maybe...just maybe he's afraid that I have the power to keep spying and therefore shut the phone down in order to not get caught with some future messages that only he knows are going to be exchanged? Or am I being too skeptical? Have I taken this too far? I feel bad for stalking him the last 3 days but I feel so much better about the outcome of the photos....I just sort of now feel like there could be other things he is trying to prevent me from seeing. I don't know. Maybe I'm crazy. "
Clearly what freaks him out over and above what would normally freak most men out, including having been snooped on and/or simply having a freedom of choice (to willingly hand over their phone at any time) taken away from them was the thought of your remaining insecure and that possibly eating away at your highly promising relationship and future lifetime together.
Most guys, even when innocent, would have made a right negative production out of being snooped on like that. Whereas he made a positive one. He's obviously got that rare male quality called HUMILITY + lack of hubris.
Yes, you're being too skeptical. He's doing his level best to be completely transparent AND remove anything that is an obstacle for you from your joint path. He clearly cares more about your giddy-making relationship than having a phone that's all-singing-all-dancing. I mean, what a gesture! First the letting you SEE his 'giddiness', then not showing any resistance out of purely negative egotism when you ask to search his phone, then the Sorry flowers, then the very upstanding message to his friend, then being more impressed with your techy savviness than the fact you snooped, and now this.
If he were trying to dupe you THEN WHY *TELL* YOU he's got a new phone - think about it (duh?).
Plus, he probably KNOWS that it's only a matter of time (especially the impressive way HE'S acting) before you trusted him so implicitly you'd say, 'F*ckit, you can stop using that dinosaur now and switch your smartphone back on. In fact I *want* you to now...because every time I see you using that thing it just makes me feel ridiculous as well as like a complete rotter'.
He knows that if he HADN'T shut down the smartphone, you'd have carried on checking. And if you'd carried on checking then, even if Monday there'd been nothing to find and Tuesday there'd been nothing to find, etcetera Wednesday, Thursday, Friday..., nor anything FOR WEEKS/MONTHS ON END, the point is you'd still have become hooked on checking, "just in case", from having given the exercise too much power where concerns your having what you believe to be the one indisputable source of reassurance and confidence in your relationship that trumps his own honesty every single time in terms of evidence beyond all reasonable doubt'.
It may well trump it but you can't cheat like this (as in, cut corners). You have to just wait until trust keeps getting added to, naturally over time containing yet more and more of these reassuring acts and behaviours.
As far as I can see, he's a diamond. In fact, he's reminding me very heavily of Mr Soulmate, who, along with consistently leaving his bank statements openly viewable on his desk, GAVE me all his passwords despite I never even asked for them or gave him any cause whatsoever. Complete and utter transparency. So I did likewise. It is very refreshing. But for a while you can start thinking, 'Hmm, too sweet to be wholesome'. Yes, SOMETIMES they're too sweet to be wholesome. But sometimes they are simply, wholly, truly, just very sweet.
This is definitely cold feet. I know you don't believe it but, face the facts: you've never HAD pre-marital jitters before, or certainly not of THIS variety, so how would YOU know? And it *can* make you act out of character or downright fruit loopy. Why do you think they use the word 'jitters' rather than merely 'mild misgivings'?
Who CARES if he hadn't thought it through (although I bet he had). It's just a phone. You, on the other hand, are obviously his world.
So, yeah, you're crazy. But in a good and healthy way. It just doesn't always LOOK pretty, that's all.
You obviously know you've got a diamond, meaning, this isn't just marriage, is it, i.e. the type that doesn't intimidate too much because there are always solicitors at the future ready. We're talking marriage with no exit door because you'll never have cause or justification for NEEDING one. Scary stuff, huh!
Relax. It's normal. And you're obviously in very good hands. :-)
Skinnygirl - Yes you missed that part. :)
Soulmate - You are so right. And I feel so much better. I do feel I got carried away and that I need to trust him completely going forward. I asked him to switch his phone back and he has. :) I'm sure the girls at the Verizon store are like "wth?" lol
He's also taking me away for the weekend to go dancing and stay at one of our favorite hotels. He said "we need to get away after all of this". Okay!
Thank you all for helping me through this crazy emotional week!
See? Diamond! :-)
That's alright, no need to be apologetic - there's no harm in checking. In fact, that level of caution is one of the signs of intelligence. It IS a huge commitment you're about to make, after all. Only fools rush in without checking whether it's truly safe.
And Diamond-chops will, I'm sure, understand your need to do so at this Eleventh Hour, as well.