You can't have your cake and eat it too?
Hello friends. I would GRATELY appreciate any and all advice on my current love interest.
Met on Tinder. I had no expectations of hooking a boyfriend or anything serious. Just live in an area where the social seen is nothing but parting and things I don't find interesting.
I am pretty outgoing and even if my date isn't exactly what I expect, I always make the best and have a good time.
That was Mark. When he picked me up, he was much shorter than I thought (almost 3 inches shorter than me) kind of nerdy but very handsome. I truely have no physical type. I am attracted to whit, humor and passion. All of which he possessed. We had drinks and hit it off. We had plans to watch a movie after drinks but mostly made out in an innocent enough way. I really liked him and when the date was over, I went home. Declined offer to go back to his place. But we ended up talking on the phone like high school kids until the sun rose. Mind you; I am 32 and he is 36.
He called me the next afternoon to ask me out again. I had family plans and we decided to meet up for date 2, two days later. We had another 3 hour convo at a restaurant and he opened up about his childhood and we found we had so much commonality. We liked a lot of the same abstract random topics that most people avoid (quantum physics, family dynamics, certain political views ect)
Well...to speed this up and not loose your interest...we ended up going on 4 dates that week.
We both were physically attracted and agreed he would stay over after a little over a week. That's when the Sparks really happened and the chemistry between us was undeniable.
We regualrly see each other every weekend sometimes 3 nights in a row for about 3 months. Very consistent. We texted ever day. During these stay overs; he would all but profess his love for me. During pillow talk mostly but he always told me how much he was drawn to me and has never felt that way before. Just about 3 weeks ago he started mentioning love.
He was mentioning that he loved me and that he wanted to be with me. I had a feeling and created a fake tinder to see if he was still persuing other girls. He was. He flirted and elluded to a potential date later than day.
I talked to him and told him I had a feeling something was off. I organically brought up the topic of seeing other people. I said that we were getting serious and taking a lot about love and the future.
I said i wasn't on tinder with the aim to catch a husband or settle down for the sake of it. So if he is or wants to see others and still date me; that's totally fine...it is( I may have been a little hurt but mature enough to not make a big deal). He told he he didn't want to see anyone else and hadn't. I asked if he was sure because it was ok- I just wanted to have a convo so he could tell me and we could go from there. Again, he said no. I told him I knew he was. I lied and said the tinder girl was a old friend who put two & two together and told me. I said I'm sure she's not the only one. I told him that fact he's acting single and persuing others isn't really what hurts- it's that he could so easily lie to me.
He said he felt foolish and owned up to it. He said he only talked to a few girls and was doing it to test his feelings for me. He said he wasn't wanting a serious relationship and when he'd met me- he felt strongly for me right away. He said he had never felt do drawn to and connected to anyone before. And he wants to be committed to just me. He talked to those girls to see if his feelings for me could be easily waivered or go away altogether. And he said they never did, every time he always thought of me and wanted me. None of those girls held is interest. I asked him how may times do you need to do that before you be honest with yourself, are you stringing me along until you find someone better? I told him I would never wait around for him to realize what he has. I'm not plan b.
Ultimately we hung out the next day and things were great. Very affectionate and adoring of me. Next morning he said he's loved me all along, almost right away and wants to be all in with only me.
Should I believe him? Should I get out before it's too late it hurts more?
I have no idea if he's pulled a fast one on me or just did a stupid thing and is now ready to accept love in his life. Please help.
I believe he said what he had to say, and what he felt you needed to hear. Do I believe him "NO". Be mindful of "pillow talk"- his actions of seeing others to compare his feelings for you! How many dates/girls/calls was it going to take to ensure his true feelings for you? (please) His pillow talk eluding to his love for you- worked it kept you on the line. Proceed with caution, he lied knowing he was talking to girl(s).
Take your time, don't buy in so quickly, get to know this guy.
I know times have changed, sleeping with a guy within a week for me would be to soon. " He needs to back up with the "loved you all along" his actions going forward will eventually determine what his real intentions are.
I 100% agree. It's the deceptive way he went about it all doesn't sit right with me at all. I do honestly like him and he has many redeeming qualities.
Are you saying by "his actions going foward" that i should see him? I want to but def will have my guard and alerts up.
Again, thank you.
Why would you bother with a man who very actions have raised doubts? Who cares if you have just met him and that you have bonded quickly, the point is that he has shown you who and what he really is by his actions and therefore you should believe his actions rather than his words.
You went with your gut when you set up the fake Tinder ID and you should keep on going with your gut. His statement that he contacted other woman to test his feelings for you just doesn't 'sing'. Any man, who is IN love with a woman will not do anything other than love and respect her totally. He has a deep need to be with her, and most certainly wouldn't bother to contact other women for whatever reasons. When a man is in love no one else is on his radar. Forget about pillow talk, rather you should ask yourself if his actions reflect this or the obvious opposite.
I appreciate your opinion. So, the fact that we officially hadn't talked about where we stand or even discussed if we were seeing others shouldn't matter?
Well, I asked him and he actually lied about that too.
Why do men do this? Not saying I'm totally out of his league but there is an obvious difference. I adored him and the potential.
What makes a man have everything he wants but still need to persue other women? Which is fine but why do they lie.
I just can't understand the benefit for him to lead me on that way.
I'm with MANALONE, his behavior is the opposite of someone in love. His words never matched his actions.
I forgot to ask what caused you to set up the fake Tinder, what were you feeling? I agree with MANALONE- so proceed with caution.
If this guy was totally committed to you, he wouldn't have the NEED to lie to you about actions which have basically rocked a potential relationship with you. Since this has happened, you have had doubts and regardless if you guys hadn't discussed where you stood with each other, you are here on this forum feeling betrayed (and rightly so) because he lied to you.
It all comes down to your reaction to his actions and your gut warned you early on in the piece what he was doing behind your back. In any relationship trust is the foundation and if it's not there, then there is no relationship and it never was a relationship...it's that simple.
What makes a man who has everything he wants still pursue other women?..his character. This guy has showed you his character via his actions and when someone shows you who they are through their actions, then you have no choice but to believe them.
Agree with Manalone and Skinnygirl.
'Why' he's behaved like this could be down to one of three- actually, FOUR reasons:
1. He's newly divorced AND very bitter/scared of (as in, dreading) ever again committing and being beholden to any woman... DESPITE HE STILL NEEDS THEM FOR SEX: "All women are the same - they're *all* b*tches! I'll show them who's boss, HAH!. So he's post-liberation crazy and enjoying playing the field without having to be answerable to anyone. Like some kiddie faced with a line of sweet-selling market stall holders (hook-up forum respondents), seemingly unable to decide between which sweets from which stall to spend his pocket-money on, he hopes his wholly contrived impression of indecision will earn his being given a sample from every single jar belonging to every single trader in order to clinch the sale... whereupon, off he trots, now so full he doesn't even NEED to hand his cash over (and feeling very pleased with the fact he managed to fool all the traders).
2. He's divorced BECAUSE he's never liked or respected women, meaning, as Manalone said - fanciable or not, this is his normal character ("ugh!"). Pretty on the outside does NOT automatically indicate prettiness and/or lack of issues on the inside where it counts as well as lasts.
3. Whatever mixture between both 1 and 2, e.g., 1 having compounded 2.
4. Because you've been too willing to take everything at surface value, believe words and cheap, one-off acts over far more revealing long-term, sustained/repeated ones that are buildable on and *do* get built on. You may SAY you weren't really looking for a relationship, let alone a deep and meaningful one, but - those actions again (going on Tinder) - evidently, yes you were. And so much so that you were willing to behave right from the off like you and this STRANGER already had a solid track record behind you. In other words, you straight away behaved as if this guy had already earned full relationship perks and privileges.
(PS: It's downright dangerous to take a stranger back to your place or go back to his after one piddly date; you could have been lain dead in a ditch rather than posting on this forum. Please don't do it again, okay?)
One doesn't earn full perks solely with ones mouth. I mean, if you were an employer and some job applicant gave you a great interview speech about how he was going to work so hard and so impressively he'd increase your company profits by a full 25% in record time, would you not only yell 'You're hired!' but also there-and-then pre-pay him his first 6 months' salary, scrapping the usual 3-month trial period? If you did you'd go bust very quickly indeed - correct?
Hearts and flowers are great. But only when they're a true heralding of a pending action, an in-process action or a flourish to an already-executed action. Otherwise, you take on the attitude of Eliza Doolittle: "Don't tell me - SHOW ME!".
You don't have to actually SAY this, but you do have to think it. (And, I should add, it cuts both ways for both genders.) That way, you're never pre-paying, only giving cash on *delivery* or via 2-4 weeks' invoice (the weight/long-lasting value of the action dictating which).
Yes, you have a portion of trust that you give freely, but emphasis on 'portion'. Beyond that cursory amount, trust is *earned*... see it as a verb, not a noun. And that takes time featuring repeated experiences under myriad conditions. Those experiences can comprise a drip-drip amassing of small yet meaningful actions and behaviours OR a lesser string of massively weighty acts OR one gigantic act of no-return. So from now on, your attitude should be this: "I am attracted to wit, humor, passion AND SUBSTANTIABLE/CORROBORATIVE/PROVEN SINCERITY".
Manalone is absolutely correct: when a man can tell you're the one, all other women on the planet cease to exist in terms of their being entities possessing sexual/romantic potential. If the guy couldn't (in what was ample time) tell you were the real deal without seeking direct and active comparisons then all that does is prove how either you're not or that no-one would/could be (due to him, temporarily or permanently not being relationship material). And if he needs the extra challenge of your being one foot out of the door before he finds you alluring enough to want to suddenly go exclusive & committed with you, then the said same either/or conclusion applies.
Saying all of that - some people can *behave* like using t*ssers simply due to post-traumatic issues clouding their better judgement yet ordinarily/the rest of the time be decent, earnest types. So!... Do you believe his apparent turnaround? That is the burning question which - never mind hanging out the next day and things having been great (yet more blah-blahs + cheap actions) - all depends on this:
"I asked him how may times do you need to do that before you be honest with yourself, are you stringing me along until you find someone better? I told him I would never wait around for him to realize what he has. I'm not plan b."
What did he not only say in response to this statement, but *do*? Repeat - *DO*. Did he immediately insist on you and he going onto your PC so that you could watch him delete (- I repeat, delete, not put on hold) all of his online dating accounts right there and then?
That would certainly be a giant, all-in run of actions that you could take the bank, right? So did he do it or is he happy to do so the minute you suggest or insist on it (which should be the next time you're together at your place or his - with zero forewarning note!)?
Am in a similar position, with a similar time line.
The difference is we both were not looking for this relationship, both had been hurt and just were happy to chat with someone.
However we met for coffee and the connection which had built through talk was almost scary.
Its has been 7 months and we text every night and he is here once or twice a week.
he travels a lot and I know he still talks to women on Tinder. I also know it is just talk as he really did connect with a friend of mine and they discuss politics and civil rights and he refused to meet her.
She did try a a test as I said I did not believe he would turn up to a meeting.
I have not told him I know he is still using Tinder. It is innocent but I guess the reputation of the app bothers me.
He is truly a wonderful friend who makes my life that much better.
I know I can have big control issues and work to keep them under control and feel that talking about Tinder is a sign of me controlling or beginning to control. I know he would hate that, actually is very sensitive to being managed and lets me know if it feels that way. Which I appreciate.
Something feels off.How do I know it is me not being in 100% control of him ( which is not good for anyone, I know that) or that Tinder does speak of me being not enough.
I carry so much baggage from a 12 year marriage that went horribly wrong that I no longer trust my instincts.
He is very independent and likes his alone time. he reads and reserches nd makes movies on his computer. I know he is not seeing anyone else,I think the issue is that i don't feel enough..
How does one fix that?
TO: LOUY1: Do you mean you don't feel enough from him? Enough of what exactly? By fixing, you mean getting him to show more feelings towards you?
Did you guys meet on Tinder?
Basically you would prefer that he stop using Tinder due to the reputation of the APP. He passed your Tender set up, no harm to your insecurities which had to make you feel good. So after 7 months you want to know if he wants more than a "Friends with Benefits"?
From your post it would appear that he's happy with where things are. He apparently still visits the website, still enjoys your company. How do you know for sure that he's not seeing anyone else?
Remember what you said " He is truly a wonderful FRIEND who makes my life that much better" You really want a committed relationship and after 7 months most woman would want to know if the relationship is moving forward... So have the conversation.
(Ideally, LOUY1, you should have started your own thread, but I'll let you off considering this is closely related to the OP's problematic domain and might interest her(?).)
Agree with SkinnyGirl.
And no, LOUY1, it is NOT being over-controlling or insecure per se for any lover to expect their lover to be 100% faithful and fail to afford others NOT his lover anywhere near the same rights or privileges contained in any romantic union as is universally understood by that label.
What does faithful mean? Anything that traditionally passes between lovers exclusively and which is not a recognised feature/perk of mere friendship. This includes one-on-one conversations with members of the opposite sex of which ones lover is neither kept abreast nor anywhere between made privy and directly made a party to, thereby tacitly categorising it as illicit by whatever degree. I repeat - by WHATEVER degree. Faithful also means to have ones back, meaning, he behaves befittingly protectively on all levels for one who holds your highly sensitive and vulnerable heart and psyche in his hands, same as you do his.
Even were it the case that your heart bruises more easily than the next person's or even his own, so be it. That's the 'package' he 'bought'. If he doesn't like it he has the right PURELY AND ONLY to 'return you to the shop' and swap you for a model with laxer boundaries, not to try to stretch yours (and hurrah for yours, by the way!).
No-one fair-minded or healthy could claim that the value of any mere online acquaintanceship(s) could possibly trump or even come close to that of a real, live, romantic relationship with far longer-term potential. NO-ONE. So if it bothers/hurts/confuses you, and assuming he's got the intelligent foresight to appreciate how if you're unhappy, HE LIKEWISE will quickly end up unhappy, then find another source of "no big deal" amusement he will. THAT SIMPLE.
And you don't even need to spell it out to him, either. He should know it (unless he's Benny from Crossroads and you're mixing your need to do good charity works with your romantic life?).
Ergo, he's taking the p*ss and pushing the boundaries rather than doing what he already came to this relationship knowing is wrong from right.
I would simply tell him I ("duh?") didn't like it any more than the next healthy, self-assured woman, and - because you're no petty Killjoy - if he really can't do without this source of entertainment/distraction, to please switch to chatting on PURELY SOCIAL sites wherein taking virtual friendship further than the strictly platonic/arms' length isn't part and parcel of the package on offer or is even frowned upon by said community at large.
Is that rocket science? If he would by his failure of instant remedial/reassurance action try to claim it was - dump the dud and tell him you hope these "no great shakes" conversational partners will be there holding his hand on his deathbed. :-p (- sticking your tongue out at the end there is obviously optional but I find it works for me, LOL).
I'm presuming that, you make a stand like that and he'll jump-to and secretly be PLEASED you highlighted that boundary for what it signifies in terms of YOUR taking this relationship more seriously at this stage (- think about it). This could even be why he's pushing your buttons like this - probably just testing his luck in order to find out WHETHER as well as where he'd stand were you and he to make things permanent at any point in the future. That's what they tend to do at the 7th-9th month stage.