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First time called crazy

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Relationship advice My bf and i have an year and few month relation now.THough there are several times that we are being loud at each other but overall ita been great.We are loyal to each other.We exchange presents(mostly he gives expensive gifts). We do little good things for each other's families.But what happened last week has made me really worries.We were with our very close friend in university when during a joke he said in fun i am not your servant.While previously as frda we used to call each other names and i never minded. I told him its my insult now.He felt bad and left.After a while i saw him standing alone in lobby.i said now why are you making bas faces he replies u r a mental patient u need treatment.Now that we arw normal with each other i still feel pained hurt by hia those words.First time he talked like this.sometimes tears come in my eyes.Also i want to tell u that as a human he is caring affectionate senstve even helps other people. .Now yesterday i told him it is turning into an emotionally abusive relationship i.Till then he replied with 1 or 2 texts but after a while he said take care.After that we did not have any talk.I am myself not texting to make him realise. tell me what should be my next step plus have i done right by acknowledging him with this ?

First time called crazy

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He said, "u r a mental patient u need treatment." Crudely said.

But just because of just ONE incident?

You say there "are times we are being loud at each other." What does that mean?

This relationship may not be good for YOU.

Yes, talk to a counselor. Get some help in sorting out this relationship to figure out if he is healthy for you to be around each other. It helps to talk to someone.

First time called crazy

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i also want to tell somthing wich i firgot earlier.Mwhen i texted him i told him he dhould find somebody whom he respect with heart.Was it a mistake on my part?

First time called crazy

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No may be i uaed wrong word LOUD i meant to aay that we never had serious fights.The extreme was that we talked in a comparatively louder tone and then we got normal.

here goes the back story:

We were best friends in university from the stArt.We helped people.both share same kindness and worry for humanity.He talks much about women rights.We became close in friendship and he proposed me.We both are very serious in relation and i v met some of his family members as well.He plans tomarry me in an year.Right now our one semester is left.We have never called each other names in relation before however being friends we have been out of limit lol. He even paid my university fees.He paid expenses of my mother's illness. He gifted me iphone 5 recently.He was just my ideal but when he called me crazy even in anger or what i could not withstand it.(i am naturally a very sensitive girl i can not see anybody in trouble and cant bear little pain or harsh words)

First time called crazy

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Hi
You should speak with him about what he said and why he called you crazy. He should explain himselves whitout you asking hin, but u suggest ge wont explain it when you dont ask.
Dont be hurt, of course you are not ill, and when you dont like his answer you may decide to brake up for a while or for ever. Never be treated bad!
Good luck

First time called crazy

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So he's basically a diamond but satisfies the devilish streak in him AND his total conflict ineptitude by fighting dirty/childish.

So for this reason alone, I wouldn't take it literally or to-heart if I were you. It's too ridiculous. Furthermore, obviously that nasty label WOULD be guaranteed to hurt, and that's BECAUSE you know it's not how you are and because being seemingly THAT incredibly misunderstood hurts and dismays just as effectively as would negative labels that do hold any truth. So it was MEANT to hurt (and stop you in your tracks), meaning, equally he could have just yelled, POO, YOU SMELL!

I would tell him that if he had any issues with me in future, he should bring them to my attention in a more befittingly adult, civil, open and honest manner, that name-calling achieves NOTHING but adding more fuel to the fire - when what you're about is SORTING problems - and that frankly you find it a hugely unimpressive turn-off to see someone so normally upstanding acting like a 5-year-old.

It could be a Red flag, however. You imagine you and he are married, with kids, and there's some serious, pressing but valid bone of contention you needed to hash out with him (possibly about the kids) but which he felt held some criticism about him in there somewhere. Do you want someone who can continue to act rationally when under-fire or someone who starts using name-calling and playground behaviour to try to avoid the confrontation altogether? So it's just something to bear in mind and watch out for (if you saying something now doesn't put future paid to it).

First time called crazy

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No one can deny that you felt hurt by what he said, but sometimes people say things they don't mean. He might've been offended, I think you just need to speak to him about this, but ask him to answer truthfully if he missed you in this absence, and if you miss him, then try to overcome.this minor problem.

Just try and be happy that you have found each other, and maybe talk to him about the gifts, tell him you'd be happy with meaningful gifts even if they're small but that it also shows his appreciation.

He doesn't seem like a bad person and almost all relationships have arguments, but if you still miss him and care for him, and he for you, try speaking about this and setting a few boundaries for future reference

First time called crazy

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Thank u all for your concern.Now the situaton is that after i said that u shud find some girl for u whom u respect with heart۔after that talk i texted him today he is not replying my texts nor attending cols.what to do now :(

First time called crazy

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Nothing. Because you've done TOO much with that text.

If anything, you should UN-do. Just follow on text with 'Didn't mean that, ignore me, I'm still upset'.

So.... He's not the ONLY one who over-reacts when pushed past a certain degree of upset, then, is he. ;-)

First time called crazy

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Lol u r right.i think that i overreacted.right now i am quiet becoz he iz not responding me anyway ( i textd him with loads of lovely msgs so i cant text him further what u just recomwnded۔i think it would b silly n irritating if i kept on texting on the same pace)

First time called crazy

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@soulmate ... I cant say that becoz he hasnt replied to my older texts.is it ok for me to remain quiet and wait till he feels like contacting me ?

First time called crazy

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Absolutely stay quiet.

He appears to need time to sort all this out. And he may feel that you are incessantly texting him. You even call it "silly and irritating"

Take some time out and take a REAL look at this relationship. (I'm just having a difficult time why ONE incident of over emotional outburst has him closing the door.)



First time called crazy

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Yup, agree with Susie. Plus, I advised sending the above text when unaware you'd already beat me to it with a whole, positive flurry. Positivity in place of negativity was the point. Now let him chew and digest it all.

First time called crazy

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Not that I expect a yes (because men do on the whole take longer to recover from big arguments), but... Heard any peep yet or is he still holed-up in his sulk cave?

First time called crazy

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No He didnt tAlk to me۔Whenever i go online on facebook he gets offline.Wat is he showing by doing this? My frd who was first advising me to ignure him is asking me to say sory for asking him to rethink abt relation n find a new gal ( he didnt apologised me fr calling crazy bcz acc to his thinking we still r best frds so y formalities of relations) wht do u recmend in this case to me?

First time called crazy

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He's showing you he's mad at you and is punishing you. Quite possibly, this suits him because he additionally hasn't a clue what to say to you yet (about his own behaviour).

Sorry, but I disagree completely with your friends' advice. Look, this argument wasn't the first time he met and spent any time with you, was it? He does KNOW you, the normal you. He's just hurt and angry and having a giant man-sulk. Whether he has the right to be or not is not the point; he's going to have it anyway.

Mutineer his attempt. You ignore *him*. Not nastily or noisily. Just go silent and motionless. Like you've ceased to exist! It's INEVITABLE that at some point his anger will dissipate and then turn into anxiety about why you've given up trying to engage him.... "Have I gone too far?"...all of that.

Anyway, you already did say sorry, in a way. Those positive texts.

Sit on your hands, bite your lip, get on with anything possible with which to distract yourself from him and the passage of time, and you'll see. Nobody can stay mad and irrational forever. (Save for the mad and irrational, of course, LOL.)

See him as a saucepan of milk that boiled over. Don't keep turning the gas back on (or he'll only overflow again), let him go cold and grow a skin.

First time called crazy

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Got it , now one think more i usually avoid to prolong any argument or fight and usually one of us do finish it soon bcoz i strongly blv that communication gap leads to weaken the relation thats y i usually avoud this silent
Mode, what will u say on that

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Tomorrow is our firat day in uni after holidays,how shud i behav in class? I mean in front of him i shud ignore him completely ?

First time called crazy

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Yes, USUALLY prolong. I.e. all past arguments. This isn't a 'past' argument, it's a present, power struggle one ("year and few months"). New phase, new event styles, new rules. He's testing your patience to see what he can get away with, both in the foreseeable and non-foreseeable future (whether he'll have to work fairly hard to keep you purring or whether he can be one of those lazy slobby kinds of partners who whoops-forgets your birthday, "no big deal")... using this, what sounds like, VERY silly fight as his excuse. And - "Lol u r right" - so are you.

"I'm not your servant". I mean, if that's not someone purposefully (despite maybe not consciously) starting a fight or at least creating the perfect conditions for one, I don't know WHAT is - do you?! Like I said - equally he could have told you, Poo, you smelled.

It's just a fight, a necessary part of the mating dance within the entire, primitive ritual, common stuff for a couple with your tenure and (evidently) seriousness. Half the time couples don't even realise they're doing it or how, let alone why. But it is a necessary part of the whole ritual at animal level, as I say, so 'communication' can wait. Anyway, who told you this doesn't come under communication? ;-)

But anyway, back to the details and the now/tomorrow:

He was the one started it. Plus he's deliberately prolonging it. So it's not your job to end it. (Or do you tend to play hostess and clean up after other people's parties? See my point?) So don't do, as in initiate, anything or play his silly games. Just - if he catches your eye, nod a sad-looking hello. (Don't you deliberately catch his, mind.) If he snubs you in response - let him. Don't take it seriously and feel hurt, don't react, other than let yourself look like a mild mixture between confused, sad and resigned before calmly walking off (message then being: "Well, there's nothing *I* can do because I already tried and failed"). The passive, ladylike approach. By doing this you're forcing him to be the one to have to initiate any meatier interaction, conversation or olive branch proffering, and at the same time are provably demonstrating how you always remain a strong, reasonable and self-controlled person, even under negative pressure, granted, but are still a goddess, thank-you-very-much, and he should damn well remember that, NOT think he's top billing and treat you accordingly. And that's what this fight is all about, underneath it all: finding out whether you truly intrinsically rate yourself (thus 'come recommended' as long-term material) or whether underneath what is possibly all an act you're desperate, ergo NOT a goddess, ergo YOU think you smell.

Are you understanding all of this? If not, see this as an arm-wrestle (for the quality of the relationship from here on in and the amount of respect and consideration you'll be able to expect if you and he become REALLY long-term). If you give up too quickly and dramatically you'll end up "his bizc". If you beat him hands-down in two seconds' flat, he'll ugger off for thinking he'll end up yours. So the trick is to let him win ultimately but make him have to really sweat, to really earn any (so-called) victory.

Obviously equality should always be your goal in any romantic union. But some men's egos ("I'm not your servant") are still VERY fragile and can't take a woman beating them at any so-called masculine games. (I mean, shoving Feminism at them isn't going to actually re-wire their brains, is it. It's a slow process, human re-wiring.) So that's why you stop short at having come *close* to victory. (There'll be other battles you can afford to outright win, don't you worry.)

Again, is this making any sense to you?

First time called crazy

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what i understand from ur post is that i have to wait and stay silent till he contacts me,am i right?

ok, now i have to tell u 2 more things:

1) The reason behing that servant expression is a long story.Actually when i said to my frd that He ( my bf) will post my student form in another city my bf replied me with this servant typ expresn .Now there were two reasons why he said this.one is that he is asking me from many months that we should go together for that form to another city (means he want to travel with me and enjoy) 2nd is that our frd does not know abt our relation.So we behave as only frds infronta him(casual).

2) the next thing i want to discuss.Usually whenever i come or leave home/uni, he wants me to tell every bit report because he is always worried about my safety.Also many times he leaves me by home himself.Now last time when we argued on something he said to me that whatever happens between us,u shud never forget telling me when u left and reached .I had ur suggestion in mind so i didnt text him yesterday but today on first day of uni i texted him when i left home and reached uni (he was absent from class today).Now am i doing right by only telling him this report daily? should i report him today when reach back home ?





First time called crazy

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btw if u dun mind just asking are u female/ male?
u r a good counsellor ,hatss off

First time called crazy

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Despite this info/text about reaching , i m nt talking to him,is this ok?
Is it still affective ?

2ndly calling that servant expresuion wasnt an issue as i knw ,in which tone he said that ...i do reacted for time being bt i got it later that it wasnt an issue

First time called crazy

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Still no contact from his side

First time called crazy

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Until he contacts you or approaches you, yes. You can look approachable, sure, but he has to be the instigator.

But what do you mean this friend isn't aware you and he are in a relationship? AFTER AN ENTIRE YEAR-AND-A-HALF? Is it just this one, particular friend? And is he both of your friend or just his, or his originally? Can't be just that one guy, surely? He'd hear about it from other people, wouldn't he?

I'm nonplussed. What's the reason for keeping it hidden?

Sweet that he's so protective over you, btw. Not SURE what I think about you routine-texting him your leaving and arrival times, really. But if I don't have an opinion on something, usually it tends to be because it's harmless. After all, he hasn't told you it's over; nor have you; no-one's mentioned 'break'; nor has he said to you, 'And don't bother sending me your usual whereabouts texts, either!'. So fine, do that. After all, you never said YOU were in a sulk, did you. This is his and his alone. You're the calmer, more rational, more quickly back-to-normal one (goddesses are, you know. ;-))

But - back to the fight: For some reason I'm suspecting it was less about revealing your relationship and more about you letting "the great public" know how hard and enthusastically he runs around after you and possibly (his perception) in a way that made him sound in front of another man like you have him under your thumb? Men are very status orientated. That would have grated majorly, I imagine. PARTICULARLY if you'd sort-of promised you and he would go together but there you were, committing him to posting the thing instead.

Absent from class, eh? Probably ill. As in, Damp Pillow-itis.

You need to stop fretting, though, or you're liable to lose your willpower and fall straight into his hands (the ones that are watching to see if you soar or fail). You can contact him IF he doesn't try him (although they always do - because men are do-ers, not done-tos), but only after you've given him enough time to sweat, as well as enough time to calm down and think rationally again.

PS: No, I don't mind you asking, not at all!

I do mind answering, though. ;-)

First time called crazy

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Sorry, that should have been 'after you've given him enough time to sweat, as well as enough time to calm down and think rationally again, AND TO PROVE YOU'RE NO PUSHOVER'.

That's the entire point of this. Showing him you'll take HIM, but not his sh*t. And that you respect that he's in charge of this little show; you're not a pushy woman who years later has developed into an all-mouth-no-trousers harpy, the type that never reacts apart from with her helpless, naggy, whingey mouth (because that's all it took to make her parents jump-to). This is the type I call the secret doormat. They SOUND, and possibly appear superficially, like they wear the trousers but the harping never achieves anything because years earlier she taught him there were zero real consequences (aside from a bent ear) for his behaving badly towards her.

So anyway, my point is to be prepared for this to drag out for days or a week or maybe a couple of weeks. If you can be prepared for the worst, you won't panic and crack prematurely.

Men, eh?! (That's not a clue by the way. ;-))

Meantime, you might want to read a thread called Silent Break-up. Same stage production, different co-stars. There are lots more than that one, as well. LOTS.

First time called crazy

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we are a group of frds in uni, 2 boys and 2 girls .... me,my bf,and one girl and one boy.... and that boy doesnt know.... only that girl knows about our relation... and i was the one who asked him not to declare it here ( worried about reputition)


Ur reply is received a bit late,i had not texted him about reaching home and i have decided not to do. ( i have thought over it for a while and it came in my mind that he may think that this girl is so easy going that i am ignoring her and she still doesnt get offended.Fine? Moreover from our past experiences ( as frd) i know about his mood swings.He used to get moody and alone sometime and then i leave him alone he gets fine and normal the next day.


We text and call enormously normally.Whole day we are together in uni and then in evenng he calls me when i reach home.and no i didnt promise anything.


weeks?? we never had this much argument :( but it happened once before when he remained silent like this.He talked noirmally to me with frds but no separate time as bf. After about 10 days i was there weeping and then he got normal. :(

First time called crazy

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Oh- so this is a REPEAT?

You cried and he just came back, same as ever?

Clever boy, He knows how to get what he wants.

First time called crazy

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He did not come to uni today as well.. He is still in his home town ,he talked to our mutual frd on fone and told him that he wil come next week when clases will start regularly,he also asked him after the classes twice whether i came today or not? Good sign ?;)

First time called crazy

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Hmm.. IS he a clever boy who knows what buttons to push to get you to at that point instantly forgive and forget, with his then getting to escape any consequences whatsoever (because you're just too grateful to have him back)? Or does you eventually folding into tears have HIM rushing to apologise or at least willing to apologise for his part, listen to your side and get it all sorted?

I repeat: this isn't 'then/before', it's now. He's obviously racheted up this moody 'mantrum' tack of his to suit the racheted-up depth of bond *and* so that you can't get a good enough handle on this little dance of his to take control of it or yourself and how it makes you feel and react next time. It does get worse before it gets better and becomes a thing of the past, certainly.

Fair enough if you don't want to continue with the "I am here" texts. That would certainly be ONE consequence he'd be forced to undergo (worry). And yes, his enquiries of his friend is indeed a good sign. He's monitoring you to make sure you're not dealing with this by jumping into the arms of any other man or, worse, any competitor of his (hence busying his friend with PI duty as automatically sends the signal not to try his luck with you himself) and, at the same time, is trying to gain some impression of your emotional state at this further-on point so as to know what to do next: whether to wait to see if you AGAIN are 'there', weeping (chasing and begging back via tears in other words) or approach you himself. But don't think that's ALL he's asking or all this friend is reporting back to him - there will be a zillion-and-one other questions aside from whether you were present or not. Plus, he was well aware this friend would tell you the bit about his aiming to come in next week, whether he asked him to tell you or not. So that bit's encouraging as well because it's a message to ensure you don't do anything silly or premature.

It's a fine balance, this one. Because if your friend says you look perfectly happy or are even joking and flirting with all and sundry, your bf's going to conclude that underneath it all you don't give enough of a sh*t about him nor ever did, and possibly dump you, whereas if you look completely crushed and lost he'll conclude it's safe for him to keep up the Sending To Coventry act because you'll likely do the approaching (yet again) FOR him. I advise you, therefore, to look as neutral and unreadable as possible so that his dying to know one way or the other is what forces him to have to do the approaching (to find out). At that point your allure will mutineer the entire show and kill all attempts of his of resolve, meaning, talks about which of you did/appeared to do what and why and how not to in future will commence.

Moody otherwise-diamonds, eh? Still, if that's ALL they are (which, as I say, tends to lessen over time) you're not doing so badly.

First time called crazy

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What do u see tends to lessen over time???couldn't get that point

Now the wait is for monday to see how he behaves,well i am so surprised that he missed his two important classes just to show me he is ignorng me (well he is extreme at both levels,when he proposed me and i replied with a yes,he left his final paper in happiness, and never even regretted) : p

As far as about him asking our frd,my point if view is that yes i notice by fime he started to get possesive about me ( not a bad thing though i dun encourage him) but actualy he may be asking to know whether i did come to uni WITHOUT him ? ;) i did go for two reasons .One i am regular student second i dont want him to feel i am dependent over him ( i dont know if this favours or disfavours me right nw hmm )

First time called crazy

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"What do u see tends to lessen over time???"

The over-sensitivity, over-moodiness plus childish reaction of tantrum-ing and running followed by gross sulking any time the pair of you fail to see eye-to-eye ("it's the end of the wooorld, whaaaah!"). That's what they do when they care "TOO much".

And he didn't miss two important classes JUST to rub ignoring salt in the wound. Like I said - Damp Pillow-itis. He's still only human, he's undoubtedly just as upset as you or even more so (- more so, definitely more so). And embarrassed and without a clue what to say or how to start. Etcetera, etcetera... LOTS of reasons and agendas going on. Call it test-driving and going into a bit of a skid around a hairpin bend.

Think about it.. he's well aware he'd be incapable of staying mad and silent (to, he thinks, drive his point home) if he remained in the same room as "alluring You". And by the same token, with things that heated at the time, he'd also end up with his tongue in knots if he tried to argue against you. YOU may have loads of practise at having a blazing row whilst freely, outwardly showing your tears and emotion, but men flood then go into Fight or Flight mode - his case, flight. If the woman gets overly upset even beyond any level SHE'S used to, to be capable of pushing her point, then cease to push her point she will, ergo flight has become a way to fight (and stand a chance of winning).

One of his aims right now is to put your 'barrister' brain and mouth out of action, to even the playing field or even tip it slightly into his favour.

Ref his missing his exam, he sounds VERY emotional thus apt to impulsiveness. So I'm not surprised he turns to blathering, panicking jelly the minute he's up against you/that situation.

You went to school because the rest of the world doesn't come to a grinding halt just because you and your fiance have had one of possibly quite a few to-come humdingers. And that probably bothers and upsets him mightily through his taking it to mean that you can't be as fruit loopy over him as he is over you. ... in which case - good instincts ref that 'hmm' statement of yours. You're too cool, calm and controlled for a woman in love (so he mis-thinks). It's not his experience.

So here's the ultimate strategy: you make him sweat and wonder if possibly he's gone too far in order to deter him against dealing with future arguments in this fashion but then prove him wrong on that "she loves me not (eek!)" score by finally approaching and putting your foot down to insist he and you meet to discuss why the argument and ensuing OTT nonsense in the first place, and yet you still refuse to back down if the point is worth preserving, instead offering a 50/50 or takesie-turnsies COMPROMISE so that you at least both get half of what you each want or, say, you get your way over this one but he wins that other thing he'd been saying he wanted or needed so badly.

But it is just a normal, phase-related fight. And you've got lots more of them to look forward to, too! :-) That's the downside of a relationship, particularly an intense and passionate one.

First time called crazy

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:)

First time called crazy

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What abt social media like fb watsap ? During this priod (except for last 2 days) i was v activ on fb posting pics n relatinship quotes etc while he was totally quiet means he came online but no activity at all . Should i also act as if i dun exist there too ?

First time called crazy

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My condition right now:

EXTREMELY sad,depressed,missing him badly,feeling alone and the worst is worried about future ( he will continue this behaviour next time makes me worried)

First time called crazy

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Nd weeping .., :-( ( so much emotionally dependent on him,feel like dieing

First time called crazy

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You're a 'sulky mantrum' virgin, aren't you. I can tell.

Yes, of course you're emotionally dependent on him, and he you. That's what love is (think about it). If you didn't feel your emotional safety and happiness relied monumentally on each other's continued presence in your lives it would be too easy to cheat at the drop of a hat, etc., etc., and you'd never end up glued properly, certainly not enough to remain together as that solid base for your kids until they reached 17-21......or middle-aged............ er, 60?

And I know, this phase is horrible. Mr Soulmate used to do that in the beginning (until I gradually slapped it out of him ;-)), plus I've been through it vicariously loads of times with other men and women in that same boat, and with other exes. (Oh, aye, women do this too, you know, not just the men. It's whomever is the least assertive, usually.)

If you let yourself, you become too easily convinced it spells the end, whereupon your mind triggers the grieving process to RUN. Only it's not. Or certainly needn't be, unless the two of you are too busy perversely enjoying the drama to eventually sit at the re-negotiations table and end up going too far, adding more and more unnecessary but un-doable damage. In fact, when relationships are truly over the one to call the halt tends to phone and, sounding scarily unrecognisable, inform you they've got something important they need to talk to you about so can they pop round, etc., or (more usually) meet you in some neutral, crowded cafe/whatever, whereupon they (sat or stood too far away from you) quietly, calmly, and regretfully, avoiding eye-contact as much as poss., tell you that this relationship sadly just isn't working for them, yadder-yadder, etc. If they shout or sneer it's over during the heat of an argument or its aftermath or on the back of one that never got resolved, then what they're actually doing is superglue-ing a piece of elastic between you both as they basically insult and upset you enough to make you WANT to give them a wide berth for a good few days or week. And this is so that they can recover themselves a bit and not be put in a position where they might blurt something unforgivable.

Yours isn't the end - too obviously. [1] There wasn't, from what I can gather, any great, festering deal-breaker of an issue (like you or he having snogged someone else), just banked-up, petty, over-sensitivity-based resentment waving an overdue hello; [2] in with this he's clearly trying to break your defenses a bit to heat you up to his level because as he sees it, you're lagging a bit (nothing like fearing losing something to make you permanently keener from then on, both in intensity and re daring to show it more - albeit the woman *should* be slightly lagging, that's the whole point of his wooing her), in which case, you COULD say he's trying to cut corners a bit out of impatience (unless the truth is you've been decidedly slow to open up?) (which is what I suspect); and [3] YOU'VE GOT HIM MONITORING YOU, showing you how non-confident at this he is (because this is you and not some ex he loved far less)... and so on.

Someone who's gone off you and is done with you for good, doesn't appoint a "private detective" to monitor your moods and movements. Think about it. So, unless it's just because you miss him, you're weeping for nothing, complete waste of saltwater, although I appreciate this undoubtedly feels far too "dangerous" for you to be capable of placing any faith in what some complete stranger on a forum is telling you. That's why I advised you read XJTerry's thread "Silent Breakup" (- it was neither). Haven't you done it yet? Here you go: http://www.peoplesproblems.org/showtopic/7156/Silent-Break-Up

He'll only continue this behaviour in the future, or at the same strength and duration rather than winding it bit-by-bit down to nothing or barely anything (e.g. sticking his tongue out followed by 15 mins in the loo), if he too easily gets what he wants from it - or rather, what a *part* of him wants but his more sensible side doesn't - which is to see you crumble and wail, 'Anything you say, just don't dump me, whaah!'.

The rebound ex tried this nonsense on me, too. Five fecking weeks! (And he had said it was over although it was too clear he was at that point *enjoying* saying it, just to be in-the-moment sadistic.) Six is my dealbreaker, btw, which he knew, so - how "uncannily coincidental", eh? Anyway, I just got on with my biz and ignored his silly circling attempts (which included silent calls, trying to gauge my state of mind from my tone of voice as I picked up), drive-bys, then leaving pertinent love songs on my answerphone), as well ignoring any low moments and shakes in faith of mine. And then, start of week 5, he *insisted* ("urrr!!!") on my allowing him round to the house to collect something "really-really vital" - i.e. a work jacket (of which he had about 2 other exact replicas in his wardrobe through the fact they were issued free-of-charge to staff any time they wanted one, roll on floor laughing!). So I WHOOPS-wore the same top I'd worn on our first date and ensured I looked gorgeous. Fast forward to me opening the front door and saying a cool, crisp, breezy but friendly, 'Hi!'. He - at least half a stone lighter, massively dark shadows under his red eyes - nodded Hi back, stepped meekly over the threshold, 'forgot' to mention a thing about his jacket and just followed me into the living room, sat down beside me on the sofa, took one look at me and then literally flung himself at me, sobbing and snotting, 'I mished you sho mush, aaaaagh!!'. I said, all High Ground-superior, 'Yeah, weeeell, that's your OWN silly fault, isn't it'. And then - him somehow managing to refrain from kicking my shins or pinching me, lol - we talked it through.

This ex, however, was too much of a stubborn ugger, must have been using this childish tack right from childhood, meaning he never could (or never chose) to stop the habit of running off and sulking, even if he did lessen it to anywhere between 3 days and 2 weeks, meaning, I finally reached the end of my tether and dumped him for it (amongst myriad other reasons).

Ever heard the saying, Relationships are hard, hard work? Well, this is it. The work part.

Facebook. Good question. Good answer: just, whatever you do, do it properly and thoroughly, don't be inconsistent. So if you want to abstain, abstain completely. If you want to keep posting with friends, do that to your normal degree and style as well, only, don't appear deliriously happy, OBVIOUSLY. The message you need him to glean is that you're NOT on the floor, dying (as indicates you never had enough trust in him and the relationship in the first place for it to have worked), but you are sad and pissed-off and, more to the point, DISTINCTLY UNIMPRESSED, as in, Really?...This is how you behave when opinions clash as call only for a bit of an uncomfortable pow-wow involving attempts to find a compromise?...Really??... What are ya - five?!...Should I be talking to mummy, can you fetch her for me? (Don't say any of that, obviously. ;-)) But that's the gist... just sad, perplexed, disillusions, unimpressed, considering the possibility that you might have to think twice about whether he's adult enough for an up-close romantic relationship, yet willing to concede that emotions can have a funny effect on people who are normally perfectly lovely and to wait to hear him out if he should come back down to earth within any reasonable timeframe that itself would PROVE he truly is, normally, a diamond (despite in the rough).

So... what's your personal deadline in days or weeks / how long is your tether?

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(sorry, should have been NON-undo-able damage)

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i read some of the posts on thread SILENT BREAKUP

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English isnt my nativ language so sometimes its difficult for me to understand some of phrases , pardon,,,

I am looking forward to how he behaves with me in uni, specialy in coming week,i believe one week should be deadline :) ( owing my condition, already started having fever، my weakness that i suffer from obsession- previously whenever i began to have temperature or got ill due to any small mistake or argument on his part he used to call me immediately, right now i am trying to compose myself and not tell him) ... So the point is.what we have to do after the deadline ?

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This is how you behave when opinions clash as call only for a bit of an uncomfortable pow-wow involving attempts to find a compromise?...Really??... What are ya - five?!...Should I be talking to mummy, can you fetch her for me? (Don't say any of that, obviously. ;-))

Didnt understand these lines,sorry could u kindly rephrase them

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One piddly week? Oh, be serious. Passionate men and sulkie men ARE ONE AND THE SAME (until however much tamed)... with bigger-than-average testosterone levels and egos... they can take far longer than that! Although, to be fair and realistic, he has actually "spoken" to you - through that mutual friend - because he knew darn well said friend would relay it all (almost all) to you. So that's his having communicated to you INSIDE of a week, isn't it.

He's coming round, slowly but surely (which will imperceptibly increment in batches with each passing day or 3rd day), but you do have to have SOME patience and tolerance. After all, this is (crystal-clearly) a hard HABIT of his, no easier to give up than 40-a-day smoking habit. Would you expect him to pass the point of never again hankering after a ciggie after only one short week (albeit I'm not suggesting this would take as long as giving up ciggies)? For starters, he doesn't even KNOW he faces having to give up this bad habit, does he. *Yet*. That's the point of this marital-grade test-drive (you and he constituting the car): his expedition to find out which habits and modus operandi of his (negative included) you'll 'let' him keep, which you won't, and which you might accept a decent paring-down of, and vice versa, and then your own expedition to find out what he's made of in terms of being capable of OR AT LEAST LEARNING to get a better, faster handle on himself and his temper and macho pride.

But, anyway, I'm reckoning that, next week, his eyesight and nose (and libido) will let him down, as in, one look and chemical whiff of you and he'll be incapable of resisting the temptation to come over and say something.

If you're getting a temperature then [withdraws shins] that's your OWN fault. After all, you could be right now relying on your faith in this relationship and his strength and tenure of feelings for you (and future hopes), as well as on the evidence from Terry's thread and everything I've told you, to the point where you're not really all that concerned (...bit like a mum who merrily but resignedly opens a magazine after 5 minutes of her toddler thrashing on the carpet in outright refusal to respond to reason or attempts to distract and gain a better control of himself) - AND changing your attitude to this: Crikey, this might well be the very last couple of weeks I ever again in my lifetime experience as a kind of SINGLE person...not having anyone else to think about, being able to non-stop please and spoil myself, get all the things done that this relationship makes difficult to get on with, see neglected friends and family.... etcetera. Trust me, once you and he get back to normal biz you'll positive KICK yourself for having wasted this golden, last-ditch opportunity to enjoy a 'Mancation'.

Nice try at an excuse to force his hand prematurely, though. ;-)

It'll take as long as it takes. And you'd do well to LET it. At least for as long as you can humanly manage. Because this is also your chance to see how quickly and effectively this young man can get a hold of himself following any type and level of crisis or trauma, WITHOUT anyone or everyone having to come to his aid and/or do it FOR him. I mean, I take it you want a husband and future father to your kids, don't you? Not an extra toddler, frozen at that age and behaviour?

Give him the floor to show you what he's made of before you however much come to his rescue. You ain't Tarzan and he CERTAINLY ain't Jane (unless you train him to be). ...Albeit right now, granted, he is Cheetah.

Look, you can't BOTH be egotistical idiots, SOMEONE'S going to have to be the more sensible and grounded one. And unfortunately, Nature chose "wimmin". So that means you, then, doesn't it.

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PS: "This is how you behave when opinions clash as call only for a bit of an uncomfortable pow-wow involving attempts to find a compromise?...Really??... What are ya - five?!...Should I be talking to mummy, can you fetch her for me? (Don't say any of that, obviously. ;-))

Didnt understand these lines,sorry could u kindly rephrase them"

Translation: I can't believe a supposedly nigh-on grown man would behave like a super-sulky toddler, just because he and I don't agree over something, whether or not he or I happen to feel strongly about, rather than more simply asking for me to join him in a serious, sensible, sit-down talk in order to calmly reach an agreement about what either or each of us should avoid feeling/thinking/doing next time our viewpoints naturally differ too wildly.

Or, if you want to use your fiance's present preferred dialiect, it's this: Hoo-ah-ha-ah-heeh-ah-heeh-ah-EEE, EEE, EEEEEEE!! (:-D)

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Here, why don't you courier him round a banana? :-D 'Might cheer him up?

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Are u kidding? :D

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Nw abt macho pride۔i wudny like to talk abt that much lol u know y? Becoz the last texts after which are not talking,i also evicted himof male dominance ( however i do know that he is a total feminist and is against all his family membets whi are over dominant on women and yeah he never actially tries to dominate me even in the houae he is constructing for us,he prwfered All my opinions and yea i shudnt hav sakd that i ws too upset u knw :(

But ya big ego,he often has lost classmates and frds due to his ego

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I know he is monitoring me,but i dun know whether he communicated with me indirectly or not because he only told me when i asked.2ndly i think he wont be v happy when he our frd told him that we three are having tea and good times.( i told u from some times he is getting a bit possessive though he trust me completely)

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I have told him many times u behaves as a child and he minds that lol ;)

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i dun know in which context u called him cheetah?? but once we were beginners in friendship he told me he is like a cheetah he gets heated when tense and need himself to cool down.... so he flees from situation. he said he can not a one percent tension even.

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Hey we had a chAt today at text and col as well ,i translated all msgs into eng for u but it got deltd by mstak :( so here is gist

I txtd him dere then he rep yes we had sum txtng in wich he sD u hurtd me and u dun likw me thats y i got away i told him i likw him and that ws just an emotnal outburst u shud hav been there for me in that tym he then cold me n said thay i m fightng wid famly and socitty( his famly wants hm to get marryd to cousin) so u instead of helping me are fightng wid me and said that nw it makesme really worried and u hav to decide that are we still frds or not he said we ll discs everythng i m out of town in a wedding i b bak in a day or two

So where are we now? ;)))

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He also said that how can u think that smbdy who lovea u so much can insult or abuse u, arent we frds too, and he said that u also hav mood swings like me i am not a perfext person but u always blame me,he sd that i was away so that this argument doeant prolong and also so we realise imp of each other, he said j tried to realise u thats y i txtd but u weretoo rude n unfriendly and i blv phone is nt a medium to dscs everything i was in vlg that tym

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Not ignoring you, just no time at the mo. Tomorrow.

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Now we wud be discusing face to face,shud i have to trll him that during an argument instead of name callibg u shuf tak in a civilised manner؟?anythng else ?plus shud i ask him for apology?

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1. When you say 'evicting him of male dominance' did you mean, accusing him of being a male chauvenist pig despite in actual practise he's nothing of the sort? Well, there you go, then: he calls you crazy, you call him a chauvenist.

That's given me an idea for next time you argue and he calls you something ridiculously nasty: just say, 'Oh, so it's Opposites Day today - I didn't realise!' (Do your fellow pupils play Opposites Day or is that just an English thing?) (Well, whichever - you can start the trend, can't you.) So if/when he says, No, you can grin and say, 'So that means Yes, then!'. Plus then, to any follow-on insults, you can just reply, 'Gosh, thanks!'. With any luck, he'll bust a blood vessel out of total frustration! LOL

In other words, he wants childish? He's gottit! And that (taking the mickey), actually, is the best way to deal with them when they get like that. Tends to have them seeing sense and coming back down to earth quite quickly.

But do you know what? ("What?") Kid you not - I was JUST WONDERING if your bloke had some sort of macho, physically demanding manual job like construction. So (again) there you go: Too much testosterone and not enough places to put it (bar you) once it becomes a fuel source for negative dealings. Male PMS.

2. WHO only told you when you asked? You mean his go-between friend? What, you think he wouldn't KNOW you'd be bound to ask? Course he would (and course you would).

3. No, not Cheetah as in big cat. Cheetah as in Tarzan's chimpanzee. Hence the monkey screeching sentance. (LOL, is there an interpretor in the house?) Go back and read it again and it'll suddenly make more sense.

4. Re him minding you telling him he behaves like a big kid sometimes: Yeah. But not enough to cease the behaviour, eh (actions speak louder). Nope, it's simply that this whole reaction of his, going by evidence, has always managed to work beautifully on other people close to him, including and especially exes. They'd probably have folded within 5 minutes and tried to batter down his door, wailing, 'Speak to me, oh-please-oh-please, why aren't you speaking to me, what have I done, I'M SORRY!!'. But you gave him a taste of his own medicine. And he's not used to that, hence his not knowing what on earth to do now, save for his usual ploy but HARDER.

5. How do you know for a *fact* your friend told him you're having a good time having tea and whatnot with him and his gf or that bf would have heard that and felt even more insulted? Said mutual friend could just be saying that to make you panic and believe you should urgently take him out of the indirect communications equation and do the speaking to bf yourself. Ignore it, certainly for now, because these boys stick together when it comes to Crunch times and can be very attempted-manipulative (despite in this case obviously for the power, ultimately, of good, i.e. well-meant for the purposes of getting you back together more quickly). Quickly, however, is not your friend right now. BF has more sweating to do because, I repeat, you want him to newly see this childish tack of his as no longer being something that works to get him what he wants without cost to him, and instead something that backfires. ONTO HIM more than you. That way, next time he'll think twice before he insults, flounces off and then sulks because he'll see it that it only makes things worse for him especially. That's how you do it.

...only - I now, reading further, see you folded and texted him. Well, then - you'd better hope that you at least made the results of his behaviour far more hassle for him than anyone else ever did. Because his having problems and hassle from OTHER people does not then give him free license to take his woes out on YOU. You're not his emotional punchbag. And, saying that, I know all he did was say something snarkily hurtful but, if you don't nip this liberty-taking in the bud then it could all too well become a habit that grows, meaning, any time he's upset or tired or whatever - BAM! - you suffer for it.

6. His COUSIN? What - they want to risk a grandbaby with birth defects?! (What nationality are you, by the way?) Is that TRUE or is he just making up stories because he thinks it'll make his behaviour seem more forgiveable to you? Personally, I don't believe him and would have said, 'B*LLOCKS! You just haven't ever learned adult conflict resolution skills and instead deal with clashes like you're still in Primary school!'.

The fact it was made-up nonsense is why, the minute you replied that in that case maybe he and you should solely be friends, he suddenly 'had something burning under the grill'. Anyway, what does you and he having perfectly natural fights have to do with his parents wanting him to marry some cousin? Is he trying to claim that if he did, he and said cousin would never ever have an argument? Pff, he's in La-La Land if he thinks that! Nah, load of rubbish. Where you are now is him hoping the need for him to promise to control himself better next time you clash will become buried under the rug, never to be mentioned again.... until next time he resorts to that tack (and so on and so forth).

Just wait until he's back and you and he are finally in the same room together, whereupon you can say something like, 'I just want you to know that there's never ANY excuses for that kind of childish reaction. Plus, not only do you trigger ME into acting like that in response if you push hard enough, you should bear in mind that I find it a bit of a turn-off, frankly. So if you want to spend the next year or whatever kicking the admiration I normally have for you right out of me - you carry on like that. If you'd rather keep me keen, next time employ a bit of self-control like the rest of us have to. You can't have it both ways - consider yourselves the bosses just because you're the men but then behave like chimps the minute the going gets tough.'

It's a bit much to demand an apology considering you didn't keep to the high road, instead getting down and dirty WITH him. So what you should do is either watch to SEE an apology, via some or other extra-nice/thoughtful act, or be the first to say you apologise (for having responded in kind) and hope that's all it takes for him to say, so is he.

Another tip: Don't leap on him with this conversation the minute he walks into the room. Ensure you have a positive time FIRST (to ensure both of your feelings are calm and un-ruffle-able). E.g. towards the end of the day. And whatever you say, say it all very matter-of-factly with zero emotion in your voice (think Mr Spock from Startrek). And whatever he might say in retaliation to, say, throw you off your stride and take the heat off of himself, ignore or say 'REGARDLESS!..., this whole last week was STILL sh*t conflict resolution, which we need to ensure never happens again, if humanly possible... because that kind of thing, repeated, can all too quickly eat away at a relationship until there's nothing left (- ask any counsellor!)...which I'm sure NEITHER of us want, right?'.

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Ok thnx for helpful tips.

We are pakistani,Muslims.and he is very true about family issue.here marrying outside family is rare specially in landlord family from which he belong.Though he is v strong in his stance and decides not give up any way.

I didnt go to uni today becoz of my frds wedding.Well no masg today from his side though he was online on fb. He told me on cal yestrday that we have still to discus many things i ll talk to u later.I ll go tomorq hope so he is there .

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We dun hav oposites day,what is that btn

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another thing i wanted to tell u ( may be u find it surprising :p ) i have slapped him on face many times i mean in fun or anger ( lol sorry but that s true ) and he never responded,he knw i do it as a frd ( and i also take advantage of being female :p ) .., so i dun even know myself what limit shud i put on him ? :p may be i lose these previleges too if i tell him to bwhave like a bf not frd ;) ( as besties we are)

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Hy we met today in uni,i initiated conversation, he was fst smiling while eating lunch then he said u always blame me i sd we can sort it today he said i dun want to and moved away then came back after 1min and talked abt it ..then we went to cafe and he told me i can give my life for u but u sd think again abt ths relatn so ok think abt it , i m not marryng u if u want,ill still single ( i knew he was trying to emotnally blakmail me ) i just kept quite n ignored, he sd why r u worryd nw :p then he shwd me a pic n sd she is my new gf( i knew he jus took sum photo frm net ) i sd i never get jealous of anybdy... He sd why are u impotent ;) ? i sd no :p he asked me why u liked me in fst place becoz u r an idealist i sd becoz u n i share same kind of kindnes for humanty he sd if i dun make an ngo u will stop loving me i sd no i m only talking abt intentions,then after a while i went home, frm his expression it ws obvious he wantd us to b togethr but couldnt say,but i had an urgent work so i went,he teztd me
Some poetry in evening abt pain of love ;)

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We had some lovely poetry texts sharing wid each other then he called me and we had quite a cool talk abt relation n othet stuff.so everthings nornal now,thanks to you, until nex time ;-) we plan to meet tomorrow morning to spend som tym rogether

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Oh, well, yes, I can understand his parents holding that attitude if they're Pakistani. Common stuff. But, hey, you're a bit uniquely fiesty for a Pakistani woman, aren't you? (And I don't just mean you using the flat of your hand, I mean about your assertive attitude generally. Is one of your parents/grandparents European or something?) In which case, no, I can't say I do find it surprising. But it's not a very clever thing to do, is it, even in fun. One, it can start you both onto a slippery slope and, two, that's probably precisely why he feels entitled to take his moodies and frustrations out on you. See how that works? A slap to the face or wherever, a slap to the mind - same thing, just different body parts.

Well, anyway, given that you've come clean about that (bravo for your brave honesty there!), I think the thing to do is to couch your talk in terms of 'WE'. E.g., 'For the sake of our present and future relationship, including sex-life, and lover-friendship as well as past platonic friendship, we need to ensure we treat each other with greater respect and maturity from now on. It's supposed to be 'us against the world', not 'us against each other...Teammates working on the Billion Pound project called, Everlasting Love, and I don't know about you but I don't *do* failure'.

(There are a number of healthily ego-manipulative trigger statements in there that should work a treat at inspiring him to *want* to improve his own ways. But the precise wording doesn't matter. Communicating the gist is the important bit, and the gist is called Challenge (men love challenge).)

*********

"( i knew he was trying to emotnally blakmail me )"

Well deduced!

"he shwd me a pic n sd she is my new gf( i knew he jus took sum photo frm net )"

From the net? Blimey, talk about desperate is as desperate does?! (Who was it a photo of? Anyone famous? :-D)

You sure this guy with the trigger ego is intelligent and mature enough for you - in the long run, I mean? Do you think perhaps he wonders the same thing? Could that be why the minute he (temporarily) doesn't like you he suddenly resorts to trying to master-servant and out-fox you? Were you and he always very competitive as friends? And do you think you and he made the mental switch sufficiently enough from friends to lovers? Do he and you both have siblings that you grew up squabbling frequently with?

'Are you impotent'. LOL But, oh, here we go - here's his root insecurity waving hello: "he asked me why u liked me in fst place becoz u r an idealist i sd becoz u n i share same kind of kindnes for humanty he sd if i dun make an ngo u will stop loving me ". It's called, fishing for compliments.

"frm his expression it ws obvious he wantd us to b togethr but couldnt say,but i had an urgent work so i went,he teztd me"

Oh yeah? WHAT urgent work? Like, washing your hair - THAT kind of urgent work? ;-)

That wasn't a talk, was it, more like half a one. That was just yet more two-player Poker, with you playing the final Ace card - "s/he who cares least, wins". Never mind, at least it was a start. Next time, though, either try to avoid the incendiary situation known as trying to reconcile that bit too soon, or before you open your mouth think TEAM. If you think it and remember that's what you both are, it'll come out automatically in your whole vibe and behaviour. If it comes out in your vibe and behaviour, he'll automatically join in and do the same (to compete). That's how to use your slightly over-competitiveness together TO YOUR ADVANTAGE. Because that's what secret followers *do* when their leader initiates anything: follow suit. But a relationship still shouldn't be a case of leader-follower, it should be leader and leader teamed up. Because it's a three-legged race (albeit, not a race in the conventional, competitive sense; more a challenging but beautiful and rewarding walk (with a prize at the end)). You try to execute a three-legged-race with one of you going faster and harder than the other and you'll just BOTH end up flat on your faces in the mud. And ain't that the truth!

Is he good at anything(s) that you're not? I'll presume yes. If I were you, then, I would spend the next few weeks very subtly reminding him of his own particular strengths that he brings to this team. In order to get that current inferiority chip off his shoulder. That would help the present and future climate a lot, I imagine. A LOT.


*********

By cool you obviously mean, positive? Good. That's the main thing - that you pick yourselves up immediately. Can't learn how not to trip up together unless you get up and do more practise at walking tied by the ankles again, can you.

Good. Glad you got through it without too many 'bruises'. :-)

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todays report:
we had some excellent time together,he also said me sorry himself :-)
and he was talking abt our marriage/future plans , enjoyed a lot in uni till evening (feeling lucky :-))_

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I am also Pakistani,just the thing that i try to learn from mistakes and thats what helps me in being positive in life ;-)
( though i have some weaknesses like common people which i will discuss in another thread)

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-no realtion from Europe :)

-no siblings quarrells,we are not aggressive or something like that,just fun loving and that made us this way :P though our classmates are often jealous of us and even ask us are u people fighting ? not talking to each other? ( in sense of investigation) etc this time he replied them there is no fight between us just normal small things happen between every person and his frd,,, later he discussed with me also that how they(those girls) asked him,,, though they are our friends but stilll.... ( also that he is the most prominent guy of class due to his background,active in class etc)

-no he is not a desperate at all.Later he told me that his friend sent him a pic of some gal and he even asked him that i am not interested in unknown girls's pics so kindly dun send...and to be honest he is a shy type of guy we have some mutual girl friends but he is very reserve with all girls except me (which is something which i appreciate a loT)

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and ya there was a serious urgent work !! i even told him i wanted to stay but couldnt.

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Pure Pakistani? Pay a geneologist to look into your family tree; I'll bet you're NOT, you know. I'm guessing Italian or Middle Eastern blood in there somewhere (and same for him).

No, don't start a new thread. It's all related, keep it here in one spot.

I think what you're trying to say, then, is that you and he can get very child-LIKE (not 'ish') and love bantering (verbal ping-pong).

WHICH friend sent him a pic? The one he made the (lopsided) go-between? If it is (or even if not) then that'll be this friend's oh-so-helpful attempt at getting your boyfriend far away from you so that he can pounce.

Work that could be done solely in your home, meaning not at his? Never MIND 'I wish I could stay'. Actions said, 'Don't really'. You've got to watch your actions as well as your more important words because more than anything it'll be this that he notes and reacts to. Next time, therefore, in the event that you indeed need to be at your place to get any imperative work done, offer to let him accompany you and at least sit and read a book in your company as you do so. Undoubtedly he'd end up declining, but that's not the point. The point is you've asked/offered (actions!).

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PS: You won't have to have him around your ankles forever, you know. Just until he feels safer and relaxes. You're obviously more independent-minded and complicated than the average female. So you have to understand that - in the context of his personal experiences/what he judges by - and make allowances for the poor dear. ;-)

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No that is his frd and ohh ya now i m putting chains together, may be his frd tried to put his attention towards another gal, may b my fiance called him and said i miss her and then he had offered him helping hand,but how shud i ask him abt it ( we trust eaxh other completely and it would be awkward to ask him abt anything ) i ll do anyway :( ( and yes he told me he gets sum messages on unknown numbers on watsapp these days)


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Cleared that,nothing to be worried abt

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So sorry for the delay, I've been off ill with sinus flu.

Yes, you're right, it's perfectly possible his friend offered (seeing his chance) rather than was asked.

What do you mean 'cleared that'? I was going to suggest - if you haven't done it already - that the best time for getting him to let slip what exactly he was up to behind-scenes during that or any (hopefully less severe) 'sulk-off' in the future is to bide your time, wait until the pair of you are firmly re-ensconced on cloud 9 - e.g. after a particularly romantic and harmonious weekend (preferably right after sex) - and then couch your question in a humorous, teasing but impressed way (ensuring to chuckle and snuggle as you ask). For example: "That period a few weeks back when we weren't talking...You got your friend to play go-between that whole time, didn't you, you sneaky wotsit. Yeah, you did, I know you did, go oooon, admit it. I'm not mad or anything! Quite impressed in a way, actually. But you did, though, right?".

Female Cold War spies knew a trick or two when it came to getting men to spill secrets, oh aye. ;-)

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Gws :)

Ya that secret thing is good idea :p

Latest report of today , we were sitting in cafe when our some classfellows made some plan for wekend, i asked him in loneliness we will go with them too, even they said me in lonloness that he listns to u so get him redy for weekend plan, when i talked he negated and said i only want to spend tym wid u,and got furious got quiet etc he sd to
Me why does it matter to u what they think abt us we have to decide ourselves we go or not, i am worryd now becoz i knw we do spend private life but we are getting isolated as well .We also have been cut off from whole class becoz of some previous hot arguments betwn our classflows n him,now i dun want to lose some of frdss left in clas :(

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Plus the other thing is that he said me today u feel very comfortable sitting wid sny body, i hated this statement۔ act this statemnt is said because one of our male frd came in class sitting next to me, so doea it matter? Previously one or two times i prohibited him from being possessive like this but see today he said this again.. I dun want this to b an issue btwn us۔but shud i remind him of it

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I txtd him in evening , he replied me that tell that girl we ll go wid her, i sd if u r not willing by hArt we wont go

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"when i talked he negated and said i only want to spend tym wid u,and got furious got quiet etc he sd to"

There you go. "Too" into you. Not a problem if you're equally "too" into him as well.

I think you meant alienated, not isolated. But why is that a problem at this early stage? Don't you know there are only two seats on Cloud 9 and for a very good reason?

The solution is to see your friends at all other times or just phone them more, after having explained to them 'the science bit': that where a deep and serious relationship is concerned, 'gorging' on each other for the first year or two is Nature's way of ensuring you're really tight and solid in case you conceived a baby, accidentally or otherwise, hence the chemistry that creates a high good enough to hook you for as long as possible so that that attachment can meanwhile happen. Because that baby would need that 'two against one' + 'two to cater for one very demanding one' set-up FOR EIGHTEEN YEARS AT LEAST (and then some). This programme 'runs' whether or not a baby results. Good, understanding and patient friends should already know and be able to appreciate that this is how newly in-love then newly decidedly committed couples behave the world over, meaning, friends have to by whatever degree graciously take a back seat for a while, same as any one of them in your same situation would do to you (better believe it).

Furthermore, he's protecting his territory. HE knows what men are like where other blokes' women are concerned even if you don't because they present themselves as more civilised and female-friendly to your gender. Any 'brotherhood' and code of ethics where men seeking a mate is concerned is rare; it's mostly "All's fair in love and war", "them's the breaks", etc., meaning you're fair game to anyone bold enough to give it a go. And since you come with a built-in recommendation (your boyfriend's) as regards your fertile female status and value having been tried and tested, that makes you even hotter property than were you single, ergo successful attempts to steal or lure you away seen as carrying extra kudos ("Stolen fruit tastes sweetest"). Added to that is the male-to-male competition aspect, getting to prove they're a better, cleverer hunter than him and his grade, with you the trophy to show for it... etc., etc.

Gorging doesn't last because at some point they hit Full. That's the point where you and he will start socialising again more. Hence, it's pretty futile to complain about what won't last unless a woman really isn't as into the man as he is she. Plus, if you tell a man of that age he can't, he'll want it even more and in greater quantity. So the clever thing to do, along with foreshortening its duration, rather than create an issue riddled with stored resentment that you might well later regret (once you catch up to his own, slightly ahead level of keenness) is to foie gras him so he hits Full sooner. ;-)

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But this is our last semester and we all will go to native cities then may be we meet many years after so this tym s precious and wont come
Bak :( also these are our mutual frds i cant enjoy wid them alone :( i dun find it so exciting without him, i want to enjoy trips with him and in whole group

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Well, surely that makes your purely academic circle (for want of a better word -) dispensible in comparison to him? Shouldn't you have a better idea of which side your bread is buttered on when it comes to things that last as opposed to those that are about to end, possibly for good?

Trust me, you and your friends can have all the good intentions you want on that keeping in touch score. But life nine times out of ten typically tends to get in the way and puts paid to such plans, because none of you know what developments could occur after you've all left and gone your daily separate ways. So what you're suggesting is that your short term future takes precedence over your longer-term one.... to which I'd say, QUE?!

As for lately not getting to be alone with these mutual friends (I take it you mean only the women?). You need to get with the programme or concede that you're not ready for engagement with anyone (or him specifically):

1. Given that you're actually betrothed, then you are, across the board, no longer a singleton living a single life under singleton rules, rights and privileges, meaning, all such past habits CHANGE to a large degree, certainly during the Honeymoon Period where exclusivity and commitment features. This means even friends that used to be yours alone become friends of your two-personed unit. As I said, however, past habits undoubtedly will naturally start to creep back in once you both hit Full (that critical quantum of safe bondedness, when the first application of glue SETS), so this twosome over-exclusivity set-up/process won't last forever. It will, however, if you do things that drag it out.

2. If these people truly *are* friends for life, then they'll bide their tolerant, understanding, patient time and NOT end up wandering off for good, never to return. So this is a conveniently opportune as well as low-cost test to get to put them under, wouldn't you say, when it comes to getting PROOF of just how solid and loyal they are thus whether worth keeping and worrying about?

(Question: Are a few of them starting to complain at you about this natural relegation phase?)

3. You've just said yourself that you enjoy them less when fiance isn't present. (Question: I take it that doesn't work the other way, as in, enjoy him less without them around?)

4. If getting to keep a mechanism for safely, secretly talking/ventng about him in the meantime (say, to let off resentful steam without upsetting him) is what you're worried about - you can come and have a good ol' whinge here! Or, as I say, you always have the PHONE to fall back on for keeping in touch with these women and re-filling their patience tanks.

I have to be honest, though, missus: I'm now getting a sense of WHY your boyfriend grabbed that fairly innocuous comment of yours as his golden opportunity to vent pent-up frustrations and resentments and hurt you BACK. You're playing it far too cool - which could be said to be making a bit of a mockery of your having already agreed to be his fiance, his (let's tell it straight) wife-for-life to-be. As a woman, it's great if during the most important bonding period you're always one or two steps behind the man because that then presents the perfect conditions for getting to see how he deals with tricky challenges and obstacles to whatever it is in life, now and into the future, he wants and tries to attain (like a pay-rise) when said item means more to him than ever before, like in this case, you. He has to WORK to gain/make you yield more and more of your heart, trust and lasting committed-ness, in other words. But no man wants to keep trying to crack a nut encased by actual concrete. Surface ice (armour) prior to then a shell, yes - the former he can melt through consistent wooing/romancing, impressing and reassuring/reaffirming before starting on your shell, without too much sweat and tears. But if you're a nut that demands far too much muscle-power for too long, he will either abandon mission in order to avoid what now feels inevitably like the indisputable label of "loser" (reject you before you reject him), coming away from the whole exercise with painful muscle strain to-boot, or - if he's the really determined type unused to thus hell-bent on not failing at anything - will start to exert TOO MUCH force to your shell, maybe even bringing in some over-the-top cracking mechanism(s). OUCH!, basically. LIKE YOU'VE JUST SEEN. It's called treating her mean to make her keen(er).

Granted, there's a fine balance to be struck between ending up having permanently and firmly categorised yourself as either a doormat/Yes Woman or over-stubborn despot/No Woman (and treated accordingly), but sought to be struck it has to be, for the good of everyone's future. So, in Quickstep fashion, as a fiancee who ALREADY said that coverall Yes, you need to turn the "No, No, Yes, No, No" DETAILS dial down to "Yes, Yes, No, Yes, Yes". As long as you can keep *enough* consistent ability to at times insist you operate independently - as a breather - that's the main thing. That translates in reality to being alone with your fiance roughly four times in a row before you then have a girl's night out. And if you want to be really clever about it in a womanly way, you can always say to any objection of his, something along the lines of, 'To be honest, I find it REALLY helpful to get to talk about you and our relationship in ways I couldn't do in front of you lest I wanted you to end up with a really big head [ha-ha]! Plus, spending an evening without you makes me MISS you which leaves me more keen and enthused than ever. Plus, when we gals are all together, the conversation tends to feature the type that would have you guys falling asleep or puking into your beer (I can't talk to YOU about gory girlie problems and all-round girl stuff, can I, or we'd end up more like sister and brother or you experiencing off-putting 'flashbacks' at precisely the wrong, (cough!) delicate moments)'.

In other words, unless you feel the problem is more about his IMPATIENCE (despite you did give that the Green light with getting engaged), stop fighting his ego and making it feel it has to fight even YOU to get to you and instead befriend it so that it puts its fists away and recommences purring, by making your getting to get together with friends without him every once in a while, a POSITIVE, FLATTERING thing that he anywhere between welcomes or at least doesn't feel threatened by and, more to the point, feels is actually a relationship/feelings ENHANCER. After a wee while of that, he'll want to be around that enhancement tool and/or partake of it independently himself.

There are other ways to make him less need to see your constant presence like a security/insurance blankie, as well - by turning whatever else OTHER commitment-style dials firmly up a few notches. Be more demonstrably affectionate, both verbally and physically, whenever you're with him; give him something fairly precious of yours to keep in his wallet as a symbol, or other gifts that affirm your feelings (like one of those His 'n Hers, two halves of of a heart keyrings, engraved with your names) (but, note, always gifts that are smaller/less impressive and expensive than his so that he can't feel you're trying to assert your independence by out-doing him in the Provider stakes)... that sort of thing. And always send him cute little texts when you're out without him (including to tell him you've reached home safely) so that he knows he's still very much "with you" as your constantly no. 1 priority and fixation, no matter where you go or whom you're with. If you give him enough of the sorts of signs and symbols that you don't mind handing over yet which hold meaning to any lover, you'll be less inclined to have to give those that you DO.

None of the above is rocket science, now, is it? It's plain compensating. An instinctual if not always precisely articulable knowledge. So why have you been yielding with your mouth ("I (will soon) take this man to be my lawfully wedded husband") whilst holding back too much with your actions in terms of the smaller but still important, confirmatory details? Is this parents issue niggling at you? Do you think they're going to be able to dissuade him from seeing the engagement through when it comes down to it, as makes you feel there's insufficient point in reality of throwing yourself more into the relationship?

I do think I'm right about this because, look: "Later he told me that his friend sent him a pic of some gal and he even asked him that i am not interested in unknown girls's pics so kindly dun send"

He *TOLD* you. That's him trying in a fairly passive, "innocent" way to add to your natural ardour using the artificial means called JEALOUSY AND FEMALE-TO-FEMALE COMPETITIVENESS. It's called, Hand your money over and buy me QUICK because (despite I don't AT THIS POINT want *them*) other customers want me, look!

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Right now i am too upset,bothered and dun knw to do becoz of what. Happened today. We went to aa shopping mall where my csn saw me (here keep a bf is not seen as respectable) i was so worried i asked him we shud take a bus now.he said no not ryt now. I said u dun undrstnd oh fool ( i usually call him jus as a frd or in fun this word ) he even knws but he reacted and left me alone in road and said u shud go hom alone ( i was standing aline frightened i rarely go alone n in pak young gals rarely go outside without men) i was crying and everybody was watxhing me on road i called him then he came bak..i tried to slap him first he stopped my hand second tym he said ill slap u too slappwd him but witha light hand...i said i am ur responsblty u left me alone y? He didnt hit me .. Tears again began to come down.. He said this is ur last trick to cry .. I got so hurt by his words he didnt cared even abt my tears? Aftr sometym i reminded him we had a plan of icecream he said no i need a brek i need space i also said sorry i sd i want to sort thngs out he wasnt lisning i sd we can sort things ryt away he said no, it cn extend to two
Months n u wont find anybdy like me... i ws tired of everything, he dropped me at home. We also had a uni trip out if town tommrw but i think we wont go nw :(

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Answers:
No i dun enjoy him less without frds.i enjoy to be with him

No i dun have fear frm his family.i m totally serious and comitted.

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No Friends did not complain anything.

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I also slapped him again wen he sd this s ur last trick to cry, it hurted me so much thats y i hit him :(

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I m not making any excuse but want to tell u what act happnd... I was trembling crying on road bcoz i was alone i even forgets roads i was so angry when he came bak bcoz i was thinking if something happnd to me today here who would hav been responsble? Also want to tell u that not only me even he smtyms slaps me in fun but this tym i was serious,it was my emotnl outburst,n it was nt a ful force slap just a light hand sideways,i didnt want to hurt him but i didnt know wat to do :(

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Also tell me that when he cums bak to cntct me shud i jgnure him. ? Or i shud behav norml ( i am so fed up frm his running away from situation habit , that now i feel angry and want him to feel his own taste, but i ll prefer ur advice ) pls be rational and give an unbiased answer, anxiously waiting for ur reply

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I think anyone would have felt like giving him a slap for such seeming lack of empathy or even sympathy at the fact of your tears. But emphasis on FELT and SEEMING. In fact, when men react like that (yep, it's not just him) - aside from it being testament to an immature and female-ignorance streak, it's because your tears trigger a huge sense of shame and guilt as well as injustice (his feeling like HE'S the victim of the piece yet there you are, trying to manipulatively turn the tables), it produces a horrid sensation, "you've made him" feel bad so, emotionally overloaded to the point where he loses cognition, he kneejerk reacts as he might towards another man ("stop your blubbing, you wimp!").

Deep-down he does know you're not another man and aren't deliberately faking the tears, but this hot-headed 'thought' is the only thing that explains and justifies his feeling quite so wretched.

Next time take no notice at what is just him losing his head and melodrama, and either walk away or 'slap him' only with your tongue.

Again, I repeat, this is the trouble with allowing no-nos like slapping into your garden just because the weather at that stage is sunny enough to take it. Those habits feel a whole lot less cute during any inevitable storms. Remember that - everything has a flipside.

The actual issue behind that whole outburst sounds like it has everything to do with his efforts to rebel against parental/cultural tradition-based rules and feeling overly frustrated at your refusal to ally up and join his rebellious campaign (or, if you prefer, stick two fingers up to Der Management).

He felt betrayed, basically.

But I don't think you two should be trying to have such a serious relationship under such testing conditions (going against tradition plus the relationship Conflict stage of testing and pushing each other's boundaries) if one or both of you can't manage the adult self-control and resolution skills that should accompany it. It's just going to be one drama after another, otherwise, rather than what it SHOULD be - serious but calm, quiet and dignified sit-down talks towards finding compromises that you're both happy with. You need to suck it up right now and call him/call round in order to TELL him it won't work unless you two sit down together the minute you're both feeling back to calmness and positivity to together discuss a future plan about how each to behave and how not whenever things start to get heated. Maybe a mutual code word would help snap you both out of it? Something meaningful and positive, e.g. the the name of the place where you both first met?

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On third day of this incident he called me many times i didnt pick then we texted each odr he was quite in cool mood then he called me again ww talked about it almost 4 hrs on fone talking mostly about rhe resolutions,solutions n wat we r learning each day

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Only 3 days? Okay, so the pair of you are learning an increasingly more comfortable fight modus operandum a deux. Well, that's fine, then, that's the main thing. :-) It might stick at 3 for a while or go straight down to 2 or 1 or mere hours (depending on how fast a learner he is). But don't lose heart if ever it suddenly goes back to weeks because it could just be a blip - a falling back to bad habits due to lack of energy (tiredness, illness, other stress). Just keep your eye on the trajectory *overall*.

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Yes thats important !

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Anothr issu .. I feel i have weak nerves. I observed this while i did a job after my college.i used to tremble during interview or feel unconfident/frightened by my workplace environment (where others used to feel safe).I avoid to take responsiblity and feel pressurised. Another thing is that if i have any problem with my any loved one means any relationship issue i am unable to do any of my routine work means i lose my concentration level.IF somebody scolds me i get badly hurt ( not a strong personality what i feel )... Any suggestions regarding this mental health issue?

Also i feel lonely sometimes though my family n HIm loves n giv me tym.. Environment affects me, sad events of ppl affect me, even i love rain but ryt now rain n cold in dark night time is freaking me out and making me feel sad/depresed/lonely. Previously i felt counselling by my frds or self counselling helped me and this has decreased with time but it is present and still VEry MUCH .

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Trembling during interviews isn't 'weak nerves', just nerves. Everybody feels like that, save for the naturally confident. But what do you mean, frightened of your workplace?

The third item is called, very sensitive + lacking a Backburner. Again, quite common, perfectly normal... more than you'd think, actually. It's just not something most people are brave enough to admit out-loud. So there you go, then, you've got something they *don't*.

What puts paid to these things is just practise/more experience (and, meanwhile, picturing anyone intimidating as being sat on the loo, knickers around ankles, straining to do a poo).

Also, normal hormonal changes (severe peaks and troughs) at your age can change how you perceive and feel things until they settle down, including making you more neurotic. Maybe an idea to talk this over with your doctor and get a blood test to check your levels aren't too out of kilter and needing intervention, e.g. the pill/change of the pill?

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Feeling hopeful nw :)

Ok bak there, today i wasnt feeling well in uni.. I was so hungry whole day .. I wanted to go out in a hotel but my bf ordered in uni cafe ignoring my opinion to go out .. I got angry n kept quite, he ate his lunch then left some of it and took me n my girl friend to hotel.. But he was cold and didnt even eat with us.. I am ignoring this, and dun want to put argument buti feel my opinion has an imp too and it should be respected ( our uni food is not that hygeinic n hate our department food )

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-Third item refers to ??

-Frightened by workplace links to the same feeling of not enough capability to take responsibility, or fear of any judgmental remarks by the boss ( bkground : very good academic career but not too much interest in job, thanks God my bf has also not pressurised me for it he said ill earn for u and u rear our kids future ;-)) he has already taken my many responsibilities ,, but this job phobia is old, by health i am a weak girl and cant do much physical or more stressed mental work )

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She is our old mutual frd. And i didnt hav a plan to take her but since she was with us i couldnt hurt or ignur her feelings.,He said me today that i am angry because why u asked me to drop her.. I felt bad but kept qute so he asked whats the matter i sd nuthing.. Then he said i can care only for u not others, i sd ok but didnt agree from heart.. Then he turned towards his hostel and i went alone towards my bus stop in uni

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If you're the type can't eat when stressed, feeling suddenly hungry again is an excellent sign! Means your mind recognises that the prior danger has mostly passed, meaning, it can get back to less important or urgent pursuits/demands. However, the 'cramming' part - storing up calories - indicates it anticipates the odd shock-wave thus another 'famine-ette'. And there it was: his being 'cold' and 'distant' - i.e. still processing, still a bit stressed/petulant with it, hence no real appetite, as well as (unconsciously) wanting to get his way over something 'minor' by his standards but major by yours, to even the score. You must have sensed that if you let it go (good). Plus, don't ever be in such a hurry to get your opinion taken into consideration at every opportunity because what actually counts is not the When but the Whether, meaning, you need only stand back and examine whether the getting-ones-way score board is OVERALL pretty even.

I expect he'll return to respecting and honouring your dislike of the canteen food once the sun comes properly out again.

Third item, being especially sensitive and lacking a back-burner, referred to: "Another thing is that if i have any problem with my any loved one means any relationship issue i am unable to do any of my routine work means i lose my concentration level.IF somebody scolds me i get badly hurt ( not a strong personality what i feel )"

Weak, my a*se. Were that the case you'd have chucked him by now for being just too high maintenance, too knackering (or, simply, due to the combination of the two of you together in a relationship being too HM).

But, listen, if you're not getting enough mental stimulation and enjoyment out of your job then your under-used mind will be BOUND to make a bigger meal out of any challenge elsewhere. Think bored toddler getting her hands on your knitting when she should be busying herself with her own possessions/toys. Knitting being the romantic domain. I'm not saying any issue isn't bona fide or doesn't demand addressing, but you will react more forcefully than entirely necessary or over-complicate and delay things. As will he (if you're Like & Like in that respect).

And now (third post) I see that you less *anticipated* a shock-wave/follow-on clash, as in a natural off-shoot, than sensed you were about to help one along - namely, taking a third wheel on your 'date' when he'd already made it perfectly clear that this is what upsets and discourages him about how into him and your relationship you truthfully can be, AND WHICH WAS WHAT ORIGINALLY CAUSED THE ARGUMENT IN THE FIRST PLACE (you not wanting to be with him at any opportunity, including posting a letter!).

So what you've got here is carrying on the argument but with it now switched to under the table (surreptitious little kicks in the shins at each other).

You two are not seeing yourselves thus acting like A TEAM. Although, he is more than you are, because, look - despite it took him a day he at least plonked his beef ATOP the table (in honestly telling you why he's angry). And did you return that teammate-like courtesy? No, you didn't. You, quote, KEPT QUIET. Even when he prompted you to speak your mind.

You're not cooperating, are you, not sharing thoughts and feelings, when it comes to ensuring this can work. Or you're indulgently playing with fire because work's boring, helped by a taking for granted that the fire won't ever actually BURN you. (Oh, yeah?!)

He wants to have you more to himself. So sue him for feeling like lovers in-love do! If YOU don't want that, don't find the thought as appealing as him, then EITHER get better at acting in order to bide time until your strength of feelings catch up more to his and not give him cause for a wobble (and a fight), or let him go so that he can find someone who's as ready as him to do more the real thing.

Until you choose whether you're all-in or all-out, considering you've clearly coupled up with an All Or Nothing merchant, then this is going to remain an uncomfortably stressy roller-coaster ride rather than a pleasing punt down a mostly gentle river.

You *didn't* let it go (like you should have done had you understood it was just a trickle-on reaction), the fact that he 'forced' you to eat in the canteen. Instead you got your 'revenge' by asking a third wheel along.
Him: Jab
You: KICK!
Him: Show of defeat (his admission/reminder).

A show of defeat can precede the real deal show of defeat, called DUMPED. 'To keep this woman means having to sacrifice my even basic pride.'

Instant but lasting damage-limitation suggestion: Cook him a candlelit meal, JUST THE TWO OF YOU.


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May b i m not able to express myself to u.. I understand the imp of privacy n 99 prcnt of tyms we are alone .. But wat if sumtyms we are with our old frds ? I mean after coming in a relationship have our group broken? And how to say our best frd gudbye when we are all making plam sitting together? Spec wen we are students of same clas n besties

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Today we had a discussion in uni abt it. He told me that i need more time alone with u. He sd we can go out with frds but fst we must had a coordination ourselves. Then we both agreed on it. Went to pizza paurlour, studied together etc

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What is it you think I'm not getting (for once)?

You wanting sometimes to be with friends or you two having been with best friend at the time is neither here nor there when his beef lay specifically with the fact you just suddenly sprung it on him without any warning. That's not good relationship etiquette (- a team of two pre-consult one another wherever possible before any decisions get set in stone or, this case, invitations issued). Plus, don't you think it's insensitive in the least, given his only very recent flagging up over this lack of consulting/conferring with him? PLUS it was *his* car, not yours, that you were offering out as a free taxi service, was it not? So where did you get the idea that you could offer it round like it were yours or like he's your personal chauffeur? Is this normal/does he not resent you when you do this?

"but since she was with us i couldnt hurt or ignur her feelings",

But you could afford to hurt his?

Have you forgotten that respect is supposed to go both ways? Or are you actually TOO sure of him, despite the impression to the contrary when you were experiencing that sulky stand-off? (Again, be careful with that assumption because I sense another blow-out or actual dumping looming.)

All I seem to be hearing is excuses this time round, AMMS. 'How this, how that...?' Where there's a will there's a way, particularly when wanting or needing to please both groups (but more so the most important and, I repeat, longer-lasting one of you and your husband-to-be) isn't exactly rocket science. For example, you could simply have said to this bessie mate, something along the lines of, 'Listen, I'm afraid fiance and I have to get going now because we have somewhere we have to be, but I'll give you a ring in the next day or so to arrange a proper get-together if you and any of our crowd fancy that?'. Result: no hard feelings on EITHER side.

Would something like that have really been so hard to have thought up?

I'm not here to be compliant in making him out to be the constant baddie like some battle of the sexes (I'm 100% impartial on that score), so I hope that's not what you're about? I'm here to help identify, towards rectification, whichever team-member is being a numptie and when. As per your tacit request (your actions). Unless whomever's at 'fault' at any given time is AWARE AND ACCEPTS they are, they lose their chance to put things right again (s/he who breaks, Cellotapes). And if one is in it to win it, then whomsoever's turn it might be to fix a bonding blocker isn't anywhere near as important as the blockade or obstacle getting removed (so that the path can continue a lot more smoothly).

You do want the path to be more smooth, right?

Last time he was the numptie. This time it's you. (Although, at least the two of you are taking it in turns, LOL) Fair enough?

Now, you said you were fully committed. To what, though - yourself first, the team second? I wonder whether, due to your having too many worries/misconceptions in your head, your mental Radar Room is over-staffed and too ready to defend against potential *incoming* missiles, but *under*-staffed when it comes to the radar that checks what missiles (or what could FEEL like missiles on impact) are getting sent *out*. You being thin-skinned yet insensitive at the moment, in other words. You need to stop (as in, just DECIDE to stop) whittling and worrying about whatever personal problems and difficulties will naturally get fixed all on their own, come a bit more time and experience (seeing as how they're purely age/stage-related) so that you can better monitor those respective staffing levels so as not to unwittingly keep p*ssing off your clearly very serious and committed fiance. To be MORE PLUGGED-IN, in other words.

Is that a fair observation?

If not, if you really DO lack that awareness and instinct of what is good versus bad etiquette thus put his nose further out of joint merely out of simple, innocent ignorance, then the thing to have done was just apologise to him for your mistake rather than have rushed too readily into your corner of the boxing-ring, all defensive and ready for a fight.

Is THAT a fair observation?

You come across out-of-kilter, AMMS. You have to start realising that whenever you endeavour to please and make happy your boyfriend (assuming it doesn't demand you harming or disrespecting yourself in the process), you prime him into wanting to please YOU, with that back-and-forth rally building trust and strengthening feelings. I call it keeping the interactional loop positive (looping back and forth in the upwards direction) rather than allowing it to become weighted with negativity ...until, down, round, down, round, SPLAT! If you let the loop hit the ground and STAY on the ground for longer than necessary, the relationship at that precise point has just DIED.

Can you see, now, that you owe your boyfriend the apology this time, NOT for your wanting to pepper your relationship with company of other friends, but for having failed to allow him to cast a vote via advance warning and discussion over whether he (or his car) wanted to be involved in it or not?

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Doh! Your last post wasn't there when I started... could have saved myself all that effort, LOL. Never mind - my fault for having left the posting box up and half-completed.

Well, anyway, there you go then, he managed to make you understand in the end. Sounds also like that was the missing 'final flourish' that the whole topic needed to put this latest clash to bed.

Let's hope that's it for misunderstandings for now. :-)

Now, why don't you tell me what's LOVELY about this chap of yours?... just to keep the picture more balanced?

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Chap ? Are u asking the lovely things about my fiance ?

Not a car, we were in local bus and i asked him to drop her back in bus.They both live in uni hostel.So i just asked him to accompany her while coming back from my home. Because its unsafe for her to move in evening time alone but he was reluctant because if he got late it was ok but late entry of girls is not allowed. ( Anyways if it was a car .does it matter its his or mine, he said our everything is shared, so when i really differentiate in this way i think it will bother him ? )

Yes i am fully committed and give him full time and yea i do understand privacy plus coordination is necessary

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No, I meant your grandad (;-p). COURSE, your fiance! LOL

Oh, chaperone her, not drive her. Fine, strike that one from the 'crimes and misdemeanours' list, then.

Would it matter, had it been his car? Well, yes. Share everything means, decisions and the process towards making them too - over whether he loans himself out as a taxi service or loans himself out as a chaperone.

Go on, then? Lovely things ARE....?

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Soft n loving

Very generous

Caring

Asks me to text n inform him when i arrive home or go out alone

Very handsome ( light brown eyes and white skin is less among asians so he looks attractive and different)

Do little things for me like when taking care of me doing my stuff when i am ill etc. Even my small headache makes him so worryd,takes me to dr etc.

Feminist , doesnt blv in male dominance

Simple person with kindness for humnty n helping people

V romantic

N most imp he is a man of character and that inspires me. Loyalty n character means a lot to me.

Usually he doesnt use filmy dialogues but yrstrday while we were sitting in our car he said me smthing wich really mesmerised me.He sd God made u with lot of effort and love Amms. :)

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Nice one! (PS: "God made u with lot of effort and love Amms" - swoon-swoon!)

And now, tell me what he's said or what you have grounds to suspect are all the things he loves about YOU?

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Loves my honesty shyness sense of humour awarenes abt society and the world,kindness which is a common character in both, my self respect etc

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Excellent.

Now tell me what things about you grate on him or drive him to distraction, but only those things that seem to belong to a running theme? And then, likewise, nutshell any running theme items from your point of view.

(For sheer example, if he always orders more than he can eat at restaurants PLUS you've seen him take the last piece of cake without asking if anyone else wants some more PLUS are aware he has debts for luxuries (gadgets, say) rather than necessities, you could say the theme there was greed and/or not knowing his limits.)

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I didnt get wats the meaning of running theme

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Okay, forget that bit and just list all the qualities and behaviours you suspect/believe he wished you didn't possess and then those you wish he didn't. (I'll spot any running themes).

Grade those of his from your point of view between 1 and 10 (10 being most annoying/off-putting, 1 being the least).

I basically want to see whether your core moral values match.

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I wished he didnt possess

1 moody nature

2 ego

3 sometimes say and dont act on that

4 very reserve ( which is in a way positive as well)

5 doesnt share his things with other people ( except me) ,relates to number 4

What he d wish i didnt possess

1 carelessness

2 giving friends equal importance to him

3 unromantic ( because of religous factor , i am a bit reserve,we are Muslims)

I really had to think hard for both which i or he posesswd, really there werre hardly these few things which came in mind after TOO much thinking

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N another which i wished he didnt posess was giving example of any random girl that see u shud dress up like her, i really get offended on that andhe sd he wont repeat this.

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The order just got opposite . I hav put 1 for most and then lesser in the others 2.3.4 etc

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?

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Tsk, not again! I did reply - yesterday - but it's completely disappeared for some reason (same for other posters on other threads). Am looking into it, but, for now, what I said was that you two appear to be nigh-on perfect for each other, other than having very different styles of dealing with conflict AND again, slightly, in how you express your respective feelings, and that (to repeat what I said up there) you could shut his ego up thus avoid a lot of these clashes in the first place by upping your romantic gestures and gushing. It's clearly his biggest issue. His ONLY issue, as far as I can tell. Would you agree?

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Hmm may be but i cNt hell him a lot in this regarf till we get married.

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You can't *what* him a lot?

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Help

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You can't be more 'gushy' until you get married?

Why?

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Religious n cultural factors

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Describe for me in real, specific terms what these 'religious and cultural' factors are that could/would stop a woman from being more demonstrative towards her fiance by way of sweet nothings and tiny, thoughtful gifts, even in private, despite seemingly he's free to be that way with you?

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He is equally bound too . He has a lesser control over himself than me thats why sometimes he want to hug or kiss me but basically he is also religous like me and he understands that illegal physicsl relations are Not allowed in Islam so thats not a bone of contention between us ;) however sometimes when he try to touch or kiss me i even give him good gestures too lol ( we are in hurry to get married too )

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Todays story , he was asking for my lunch made by my
Mom, i said let my girl friends come we all will eat together he got angry and didnt eat
Mine . I felt hurt i sd if u have by chance got a good girl then dun prove that u dunndeserve her .. He sd then u can leave me .. Later after cls he went to his hostl i got so offended and twxted him to com back becoz i had no cls tody i just came to uni for him but he didnt come .. I txtd ok go to hell bye ..then when i rchd home in eve i told hom that he i v rchd he replied good.

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First post first (can't really understand the text talk in your second, anyway; afraid you're going to have to do it again in longhand)... I wasn't talking about physical demonstrations and touch, I was quite clearly talking about verbal statements and little tokens of affection, the type you can share totally privately behind closed doors whereby no-one else ever gets to see or know about it. Now tell me how these cultural/religious factors prevent you both from doing THAT?

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Todays story , he was asking for my lunch made by my
Mom, i said let my girl friends come we all will eat together he got angry and didnt eat
Mine . I felt hurt i sd if u have by chance got a good girl then dun prove that u dunndeserve her .. He sd then u can leave me .. Later after cls he went to his hostl i got so offended and twxted him to com back becoz i had no cls tody i just came to uni for him but he didnt come .. I txtd ok go to hell bye ..then when i rchd home in evening i told hm by txt that i v rchd home he replied (good). I dun want to talk to him speclly how he left me in uni, but i m worryd that if his mood continued to be in same state he may not go to our last official trip of uni on this saturday,what should i do in this regard ?!

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Ok i got that yes we do exchange those v much

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"Ok i got that yes we do exchange those v much"

Then increase yours a bit. You'll see. If not, then it's woefully inadequate compared to what you're both up against. And yet - ah, but you don't DARE, do you... which leads me onto...

'Today's story':

" I txtd ok go to hell bye ..then when i rchd home in evening i told hm by txt that i v rchd home he replied (good)"

Roll on floor LAUGHING! I wish you two could see how hysterically inane your fight-talk is. It's this: I HHHHate you! / I hate you more! / PS: I love you / PS: I love you too.

But - there you go again. Why are you seemingly so hell-bent on avoiding being alone with him? Is he, out of natural frustration and typical blokie-ness, losing his self-restraint battle and trying to bit-by-bit 'push' his way into your bra or knick-knacks? Do you tend to do (or NEARLY do) "other stuff" when alone together, regardless of the cultural and religious no-nos (and remember, you're completely anonymous and not even remotely unique enough to identify on here so can say absolutely anything you like)?... meaning he needs more "other stuff" than usual to compensate for the fact you two haven't yet, in terms of what *should* naturally be occurring, consummated your marriage of the heart?

You two are so CRYSTAL-CLEARLY SEXUALLY-ROMANTICALLY FRUSTRATED AS HELL, it's as obvious as the nose on my face - hence all this VERY silly and needless bickering. You're bickering instead of having (and because you can't have) full sex, basically. And then, at the same time, he's trying to use said bicker episodes as indirect foreplay due to their requiring "making up" again, whereas you're using the fights to push him a few inches further away again (to where things are inconducive to sex). Course. Because if you both "did it", you as the female would get it worse in the neck than him - right?

Do you two do any sport? Separately or together?

PS: Tsk, yes he will go on the trip. But you can make doubly sure/speed it up...by texting this: "If you and I weren't constrained against doing what nature wants two people in-love to nightly do, we wouldn't constantly be like a car on full revs yet with its handbrake still engaged, i.e. blowing smoke and making one hell of a screechy noise every 'few minutes'." (Most men aren't very good at articulating "yucky emotional stuff" so this is you doing it for the team.)

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We have a trip on saturday and on monday its his birthday. I want to give him buday surprise but i doubt that if he continued to be like this he wont come on cafe to cut cake with me . I value such occasions a lot but he doesnt value them so much .. Today when i was entering a room he left that place later whne i txtd abt registration if trip he didnt reply .. However one clsfelw askd him he sd i dun know will go or not.. I have made mind that if his mood continured like this i ll send him cake by courier because if i broughy in uni and he didnt celerate i will get hurt a lot :(

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No, he values the ongoing day-to-day stuff more than one-offs... like most men. But don't worry about it, there'll be lots more birthdays to come - IF he doesn't 'cut cake' with you. I'm sure he will, though - the last fight was significantly more fleeting than usual, remember (because he didn't get his usual 'reward' out of it, quite the opposite).

His 'good' text married with failure to discuss the trip and leaving the room translates to in his mind the relationship still being intact but him right now wanting the right to act mad. The more you leave him be, the faster he'll come down and see sense again. If you keep 'nagging' about the trip, that'll tell him he's still safe to stay mad, whereas if you drop it he'll likely worry that YOU'VE gone off the idea, and panic (come forward again) - remember?

But sending his cake by courier is a GENIUS as well as very calmly self-controlled idea so - top marks to you for having been capable of coming up with that one!

And now I'd like a response regarding the sex part, please. (Nice try at side-stepping it. ;-p)

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Which sex part , lol no we dun do sport together but we did use to play in stream or running etc ( not a particular sport)... And no no i am not afraid of being alone with hm i enjoy a lot with him except only in his car lolzz( he doesnot use car in uni generally becoz he lives in hostel in uni ) so thats a rare case

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I dun think its such a small thing if i bring cake from thee other eend of the city to take it from best bakery and he dont cut wth me its really hurting plus its a humiliation
For me infront of our uni mates .. I want to see his behaviour on trip i have to decide then that we will cut together or courier him

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Also keep in mind that i am doing the regular two texts in morning and evening of catching bus/reaching home. I told u already he asked me that whatever is between us u have to inform me but i think when i tell him this gives him a sense of satisfaction that she is ready to inform me means she is not offended by my behavior because he hasnt replied to any of my these texts today and he is prolonging this NO LIFT/ignoring scene.

I m thinking not to inform him tomorrow.Lets see if there is a change in his behaviour ?

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He equally could have been claiming that by acknowledging your 'safety texts' all the time during these clash aftermath periods, he too is sending the wrong message - 'I'm not offended' - despite you know for a fact each and every time that he *is*. Being offended shouldn't mean the end of the relationship with behaviour to suit, or, rather, deliberately *contrived* behaviour to suit in order to scare the other into believing it's the end. (If you two are going to be marrieds then - trust me - you're GOING to offend each other, possibly fairly frequently. What are either of you going to do - pack your bags and leave the house every time? Too childish, too much a complete and needless waste of time.)

This occasion, however, is the exception to that 'text/text back regardless' rule - hence you now wanting to make an exceptional response (to cease texting) yourself. To match his. It's called a bat-back and is a purely egotistical reaction (wanting to even the negative score) rather than an intelligent, level-headed one.

Could there, for all you know, be some perfectly reasonable explanation for why yesterday he suddenly ceased following this protocol or do you know for a FACT that it's because he's mad, and much madder than ever before?

I'm obviously not condoning his "gone AWOL" behaviour, but - don't you think he SHOULD be madder this time? He'd only just recently gone to the effort of admitting and explaining to you how you issuing invitations for you-the-couple without his prerogative of own equal-half say-so makes him feel undermined and belittled (and emasculated, I shouldn't wonder!). So that makes your repeat offence strike as (and feel) worse than ever before, does it not?

He must have been expecting an apology in with those texts and, not getting one, revved himself up another notch. Or, possibly, grew madder due to having had time to review the situation more properly in his head.

So, okay, this time - because it's not some NEW issue and because he's more p*ssed off than ever before, it looks as if this extra quantum of indignation and upset has tipped him over the edge from still reasonable into unthinking gorilla mode. But does his breaking of all-situations safety-texting protocol automatically mean you have to get down into the poo-strewn mud WITH HIM? When the initial crime actually WAS yours and not his?

You need to be apologising and (if it's true) blaming it on you being a slow learner or whatever other reason made you (again, if it's true) forget the newly forged agreement on that unacceptable linear decisions-taking score. Trouble with that is, right now you'd be apologising to someone with all the rationale and long-sightedness of a gorilla, meaning, you'd probably get nothing back for it but an almighty roar (or stony silence, still). Do you deserve to be roared at or blanked? Could you stomach either one of those reactions... suck it up like a big girl, given that he's justified for being so much more upset this time that he went and forgot your (tacitly agreed-upon) rule NOT to go into mantrum mode just because he's upset about something?

I suppose you could always text just a precursory apology... keep it short and sweet as well as include the 'carrot' of his having to come and collect a more orthodox one - e.g. 'Want to apologise for my slip-up but can't very well do that if you won't see or speak to me, can I?'. That way, it might act as an ice-cube... cool him down a bit? Or quite possibly even do the trick in one fell swoop?

Alternatively, I'd have thought you courier-ing the cake *was* an apology (the starter that heralded the main course, so to speak). It not only says how you regret breaking that agreement, but adds that you respect how THIS TIME he has a leg to stand on (and could do with time left alone to collect himself). I mean, his mantrum-ing in order to try to manipulate you is one thing, but his doing it because he's genuinely at the end of his tether regarding that one point of contention is another, meaning, you can't treat him this time like he's exaggerating his upset or has no right to be upset in the first place - can you?

You WERE the one to make the boo-boo this time. I think *anyone* would be mad in this case, having watched you walk over the line whose paint had only just finished drying. I know I would. Hell, I know YOU would. So don't you think you deserve to "be humiliated" in this instance, safe in the knowledge that the gesture itself meanwhile is working its magic... hopefully in-time for the trip?

I thought - thanks to your courier-ing (with zero mention of the trip) idea, you realised all of this. Do you not? If not, why, then, did you even suggest the courier-ing?

Let me summarise with a simplification:

- Sulking and not talking to you despite in the wrong: BAD. (Still safety-texting = less bad)
- Sulking and not talking despite in the right yet the extent of his reaction being completely over-the-top (to where it outdoes your own crime): BAD. (Still safety-texting = less bad.)
- Sulking and delayed-reaction of resorting to silence when reacting to your breaking a rule for the Nth time despite (his perception) agreement having been understood to have been reached: JUSTIFIED. (Refusing to text = less justified but understandable.)

Agree/disagree?

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Tody my bf and other mutual frd ( male) teased me by hiding my
Mobile, his mood was type of normal to funny but i didnt give him much gestures .. Also yestrday he put
On a status on fb about enjoying with frdd in a luxury hotel i think he was trying to make me jealous .. I remained neutral the whole day but when they did this mischief of mobile phone i opened up in anger and said that u people should just go to hell and just damn enjoy in luxury hotels .. My bf was enjoying my gestures .. However his ego stillhounds him and i think he expects an apology from me for wat i said him THAT day but i m not going 2 apologise now becUse instead of discusing things he turned that sulky mode on which is terrible and i hate that :(

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I have ordered to courier the cake on his birth date because they require to be ordered earlier And i dont think his behaviour will change tremendously on the trip ..

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Yes cake itself is my love for him and a type of apology،، i ll also send him on 12 am on sunday night wishing him bitthday in the loveliest way :)

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I am not feeling well soulmate, this is thursday morning and feeling pain in head... He really hurts me a lot with his this behavour.. I doubt it will affect my trip tomorrow

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" i think he was trying to make me jealous"

Agree. But at least he's talking to you. So, you see, last time worked - he no longer dares go AWOL. Instead, therefore, he's resorting to satisfying his resentment by doling out little kicks to your shin under the table....bit like a prison inmate disposes of his escape tunnel dirt in little bits via his trouser leg). But did you HAVE to get mad? Couldn't you have taken the piss out of their nosiness instead, e.g., 'Do Nellie and Trunkie want a bun?'.

"i think he expects an apology from me for wat i said him THAT day but i m not going 2 apologise now becUse instead of discusing things he turned that sulky mode on which is terrible and i hate that :("

Well, then, he obviously doesn't want an apology - not yet. He wants to enjoy his little sulk first. Glad you're sending the cake anyway, that'll pee on his firework very nicely. :-)

"I am not feeling well soulmate, this is thursday morning and feeling pain in head... He really hurts me a lot with his this behavour.."

Yeah, I know. Join the club with all the other millions of women out there! But it doesn't have to affect you THAT much, not if you change your attitude about it and cease panicking about it having to mean the entire relationship hangs in the balance. It doesn't. Men don't sulk if they're ready to end it, they just end it (and sulk afterwards in private). So just think, 'Tsk, stupid tw*t's in gorilla mode again' and see it as a BONUS - a rare chance to get to "be" single for a few days and please yourself INCLUDING SEEING YOUR FRIENDS. Make *Lemonade* out of Lemons, see the advantages in everything, not just the detriments, that's how to have a happy life (and not get a tension headache).

They can't help their egos (call it a once-necessary, now a design fault). Well, they CAN. But not that much. Like I say, they come down a lot faster if you just give them a wide berth for a day or two (and pee on their firework and surreptitiously show them right royally up as less mature and sensible than you). Alternatively (this always works beautifully), take the blokie tack of taking the mickey as hilariously as you can the minute they start up.

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Agree . Our trip went well. He behaved ok in that . We did enjoy together all of us. No personal talk or conversation however. And one thing which hurt me was that one gal who had a fighy with him last semester insulted him for no reason i am really feeling sad for him :(

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u just give them a wide berth for a day or two (and pee on their firework and surreptitiously show them right royally up as less mature and sensible than you). Alternatively (this always works beautifully), take the blokie tack of taking the mickey as hilariously as you can the minute they start up.

I didnt get these lines..

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He brought my couriered cake and celebrated birthday with us in quite a light mood we enjoyed..
We talked on phone in evening , he said that i have not forgotten anything u have changed now u speak too much now i sd couldnt u discus it wid me i wanted to apologize that day but ur sulky mode turned me off.. He said i dont care if that annoys u Nd i dun want it to be discussed on fone.

So We are meeting in uni tomorrow hopefully we will discus it there.

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V sad today. We enjyd bday together had fun put cake on each oder played i gave v lovly statuses on fb about him but he didnt say thanks.
Last nyt he was getin rumantc on fone but today when we were sitting alone in uni and i sd that is it ur mood swing or what why dont u discus matters with me i should hav apilogixed if u gav me chanc n didnt ignur he sd i dun wana dscs anything,m nt in mood you blame me then he left me alone n went forward i went twards him i sd dun go i cnt live wdout u he sd u shud have thought before sayng i sd i wont do it again he sd i will discus in detail i dun c an effort frm ur side after a while when he was marching towards his hostel i tried to stop him he sd now i dun wana keep this relatn i sd i dun have any fear of u leavng me i am just woried abt our last days in uni we are ruining these we will get bk togther but these days wont come back..he sd ppl will look at us pls go then he sd "get lost" i felt hurt but i controlled myself and sd u dun hav ryt to talk to me like this. . He moved۔ i was left alone on road

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*i dont have any fear of u leavng me i am just woried abt our last days in uni we are ruining these we will get bk together but these days wont come back.. He sd dun worry now the semester would b "wasted"

This is strange does he mean that he will be this way till end of sem, it will end at the end of december

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He also said some words change love into hate۔،

but i m not cntcing him now bcoz those words really matter a lot to me that i dun want to kp relation whethr its a joke or what،، i m hurt surprised and really pissed off to be honest and i think i m losing my self respect a lot while running towards him :(

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I think he has bipolar/mood swings and i am
Extremely senstiv, do u think this is compatible?

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Glad the trip (and cake-cutting) wasn't affected!

"I think he has bipolar/mood swings and i am"

WELL DONE, you're very perceptive and absolutely correct! 'If it's not madness, it's not love', goes the very true, French saying. But so is *everyone* in truly-madly-deeply love "bipolar", degrees being the only difference. (Note I HAVE to exacerbate its definition because too many these days like to give it the label of Love when it's nowhere near it or merely a cover for getting to iron out ones childhood or romantic issues involving another person (a 'co-star') to re-enact with, experiment on or channel through rather than relying solely on ones own intellect and imagination - either without the partner's knowledge and consent or as tacit 'exchange'/deal via recognition of shared or compatible issues. Like anything else, love can be used as a tool, in other words, and not always for the power of altruism.

So, yes, at times you will be, both of you, ergo primed to wobble at the slightest fear or suspicion or over-react whenever such seems to be coming to the fore.

I do find men are worse, but that's because they're used to *avoiding* emotional over-arousal situations (typically provided by intimacy beyond a 'safe' level). They're not used to being vulnerable and some simply can't handle it - AT ALL in certain cases.

Normal. Degrees of.

But love *is* powerful stuff - a drug (self-manufactured) - so you do have to know how to use it sensibly, safely and productively. That's where time and experience come in, whereas you two are still quite young to be already fianced (and without benefit of the orthodox place to put that resultant, ever-generating energy, i.e. between the sheets). That's why you could both do with getting that excess out of your systems via taking up some aerobic sport.

Practise at rubbing along smoothly together makes perfect. As long as the glue (chemistry) is powerful and the pair of you are *intrinsically* decent folk who know how to treat close individuals and behave around them then, intermittent wobbles and tantrums notwithstanding, it can pretty much take any amount of stretching and pummelling without disintegrating and without need for worry.

INDIFFERENCE is the opposite to Love, not Hate. Hate is Love + Anger/Fear/Resentment as a cocktail. If he still "hates" you during/just after any fights then, GOOD/PHEW! Worry if ever anying that normally would get him rearing up instead starts producing nothing but "Yeah, whatever, talk to the hand". And this, perversely enough, is what you two are inclusively doing whenever you fight: testing each other's strength of ardour and gaining important reassurance over it. It is, however, FAR easier to just say, 'Houston, I'm feeling wobbly - help!'. For both of you. (You start, he'll follow suit.)

PS: That 'one girl' obviously could sense his Achilles was exposed and went in for the overdue kill, meaning, he must have somehow upset her at some past point.

PPS: Taking the p*ss means teasing (in this case, about and to highlight how silly and childishly they're behaving).

PPPS: He didn't say thanks because you have yet to right your wrong...which you can now do only when the very next same/similar opportunity arises. But at least the cake 'said', It wasn't intentional, just a moment of thoughtlessness/memory lapse. And he's vacillating between positivity and negativity because he's not yet reached Conclusions Peak and the route there is very hilly (up, down, up, down). Again, he won't until such time as he gets to see you put that 'no linear decisions-making' rule into effect - in which case: "i felt hurt but i controlled myself and sd u dun hav ryt to talk to me like this. . He moved۔ i was left alone on road" - GOOD! I told you, when they're in that frame of mind you get nothing but gorilla logic and talk, meaning, all you should do is BUTTON IT and wait for the minute you can tell they're finally receptive to sense again.... in which case: "This is strange does he mean that he will be this way till end of sem, it will end at the end of december". No. He just means this: HOO-HOO-HAH-HEE-HEE [thumps hairy chest]. It means nothing but hot, angry air at that particular moment in time.

Tip: contrive a bit of evidence. Next time on the phone and where you have some planned get-together, just (with her permission) SAY 'so and so said could she join us but I remembered how you feel about that so I said three was a crowd during any Lovers' Time so could we do it whatever time after that, and she said no problem'. But you WILL have to follow that through the minute any real incidence crops up, particularly when he's there to witness it.

"but i m not cntcing him now bcoz those words really matter a lot to me that i dun want to kp relation whethr its a joke or what،، i m hurt surprised and really pissed off to be honest and i think i m losing my self respect a lot while running towards him :("

Again, no, you're not. That would/could only be the case were he the one who'd been in the wrong whereas this time it was definitely you, meaning, you HAVE TO ALLOW him his pain noises and take no real notice of them. Put it this way, if you had a kid who needed pain-relieving medicine yet at the time was mad at you and spitting, I hate you mummy!, would that mean you withheld the important medicine? What would it make you if you did? A bad, i.e. totally self-centred, mother? I know he's not your kid but the principle is still the same when the reason he's in pain and acting and sounding like it is because you broke an implied promise that obviously meant the world to him. He must feel like your mere tag-along come slave when you override his right to vote like that. NOT NICE.

You have NO RIGHT to be angry at him just because he's angry at you for something specific of your doing and not his and acting accordingly. When you do, THEN you can get on your own high horse. Otherwise, you have to suck it up.

Nobody said apologising was always easy or automatically given the Welcome mat. He's obviously ignoring your whispers because he wants a neon sign this time... wants X number of past apologies in with this present one. The harder you have to work to apologise, the less likely you are to want to have to issue that same one all over again in the future. He's not the only one whose shape needs to alter to fit better around yours; yours has got to do the same.

Yes. Extremely sensitive. The PAIR of you.

Excellent glue, sh*t applicators/sh*t sh*t-removers or/plus unskilled hands. Berbom.

Practise. But the sign of madness is doing the same thing over and over yet expecting a new/different result. If you want change due to bad habits then you have to introduce a NEW habit(s): "Houston, are you having a wobble/are you not a happy bunny today? / Houston, help, please - I'm having a wobble/I'm not a happy bunny today'. Magic sentance. Works.

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While this discusion i only talked about that sentenc that he doesnt deserve me i was sorry at fhat , nw you have glorified me to some orher aspect as well.

My two close frds think i shouldnt have discuses myself when he was not in mood.Let bygones be bygones. By recalling he became more volatile.

But there are two reasons why i didnt say sorry dirextly

1. I think this is a habit making procedure. If on sulking hard he gets an apology he would repeat this behaviour because he got a response.

2 ok i understand ur point that i shud keep on apologyzing and not get angry but wat i experienced is that how much i run after him he keeps on running away and if i leave him he gets normal.

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And another question on my one mistake or slip of tongue do u think how much time i have to be mistreated ?? GET LOST is a big word :/

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Practise at rubbing along smoothly together makes perfect.. literally or metaphorically?

First time called crazy

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Sorry, not ignoring you - be back to posting tomorrow.

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Today he lliked my one post on fb.Is he coming off slowly?

Meanwhile i want to tell u that i am an extremist like him i love him madly the only difference being thT i get obsesses with things and he doesnt let the rrlationsip issues damage his other responsblts . I dint go to uni today bcoz my frds wedding is today. But i really want to tell u that whenever i wake up my whple body specially back pains a lot becoz i miss him its not only wid him if i get obsessed with anybody i am the same i dun make too many frds but ones who really matter are thr ones with whom i am really artached may be ovrly attached and when they r away it destroys my mental health.

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He asked about me to my frd in uni that why she didnt come. She sd that she is in a wedding and also that why u ppl get angry from each other he replied that when she d come then we three would sit and discus whose wrong. He also liked my several posts on fb today. He also made a group for asignment work in a class in which he included me as well.

I think he is coming off slowly, but i dun know how to react spec his sayinh that we two will discus in front of u ( our mutual girl friend ) i dun know how i am going to reciprocate him there if he is going to blame me and i also want him to realise his mood swings which he doesnt want to accept. I think he doesnt have confidenc to talk to me in private .

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I dont want to discuss our issuew in fromt of frds pr any other.

Why he sd to my frd that we will discuss in front of you?

Why doesnt he talk to me in private?

Why is he becoming overprotective?

Why we have a communication gap?

Why he negates my every effort of removing this gap?

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I have thought that if he tries to discus anything before our mutual frd i will say that our personal problems are not to be discussed woth frdss and we should try to end this communication gap.

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Do u think its ryt step ? What will be its comsequence? Because i dun want this habit to continue that everytym we have a problem he takes his or my frd as custodian/guardian/judge..i think a husband wife should discus their problems themaelves as they know each other most and most of times ppl make The situation worse .what u say

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? ?

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(Amms, sometimes life takes over and doesn't leave me any time to actually post. In those instances, I'm afraid you just have to bear with me and not think I've suddenly abandoned your thread. Ain't gonna happen.)

I didn't mean you have to keep *chasing after* him to apologise despite our establishing he's better left alone to cool down back to receptivity. I just meant as far as forgiving and rising above it that bit more whenever *you're* the one in the wrong. I'm sure you wouldn't be dating a bloke that was so dense he was incapable of distinguish between your patterns of behaviour whenever he's in the wrong versus whenever you are, right? So let him work that one out for himself. He will.

And that way, rather than insisting he go "cold turkey" with his hard-grained bristling and sulking habit, he'll get a chance to knock that out of himself by HALF the time having to suck things up himself, coupled with seeing how much BETTER things pan out for him as well as you & he whenever he does, until ditching the old habit in favour of the NEW. (Ta-daa, magic!) Also, this way, you can't be accused of having "mummied" him; he's been left to work it all out (cough!) for himself ("aren't I clever") (LOL).

Yes, I agree, "get lost!" isn't wise nor achieves anything (apart from his getting to 'puke' out a bit of his resentment, using you as his 'bucket'). Just, whenever he gets verbally untoward, WALK AWAY. Do it swiftly and silently (as in, spinning on your heels) or right before say, 'We'll talk again when you're prepared to be calm and grown-up about it'. Nobody likes to be abandoned on-the-spot or have a back turned to them. It'd mean he'd lose out thanks to his own silly choice of behaviour ('hoisted by his own petard', it's called). So this will knock that habit out of him as well, as a more manageable 'program'.

Yes, if he "Liked" something of yours on FB, of course it's a sign of his coming down and remembering he loves you and what you and he have outside of argument periods.

"Practise at rubbing along smoothly together makes perfect.. literally or metaphorically?"

Metaphorically.

"i get obsesses with things and he doesnt let the rrlationsip issues damage his other responsblts"

Er, yes, he does, actually. Have you FORGOTTEN the "DampPillow-itis" occasion up there as well as you telling me about when he forewent taking an exam? You're as bad (and as good) as each other, just in slightly different ways. But if you find yourself falling into actual grieving mode every time, then I would have thought the solution was not only obvious but one that would 'kill two birds with one stone': force yourself to go visit those 'neglected' friends of yours; they'll cheer you up...or at least distract you AND remind you that there's life beyond your relationship with your fiance, meaning, you feeling you've less to lose than you thought should your relationship indeed end. Not that it will with that amount of chemistry and morals in common, but this is about you having a better attitude and taking things more in your stride SO THAT it doesn't/can't. Like I said, you can't BOTH be panicking, screeching chimps the minute any thunder and lightning starts up.

Your alternative is to find an engaging hobby you can do at home so that you can revert to doing it the minute you're in fight aftermath mode, to take your mind off things that bit more (or a lot if the hobby's a really engrossing one). Or find whatever coping method suits. Whatever...just something that stops you from stewing and dwelling on it too much.

But (ref his asking after you because you were absent from Uni) - isn't it interesting how he ASSUMED that perhaps this time YOU were the one suffering DP-itis and how it clearly worried him? It's also highly interesting AND very encouraging that a man would outright ask a mutual friend to act as mediator! That is RARE, Amms, and shows how this guy would literally do ANYTHING, even swallow his manly pride, to ensure this relationship will succeed. So you're SAFE. With a capital S! No need for waking up with physical expressions of panic and sense of doom. (Do you get and finally accept that? THESE ARE JUST ARGUMENTS, a vying for marriage-long equality, rights, statuses, RULES - nothing more ominous or serious than that.)

"He also made a group for asignment work in a class in which he included me as well."

There you go. That and the "Like" and his asking after you, combined-ly, are him "do-saying" a big Sorry. :-) PS: I'm SURE this friend wouldn't allow any blame talk, not if she's got any kind of intelligence. You're a team, meaning, you're BOTH to blame, EQUALLY... the TEAM is to blame. Plus, other than when he's in angry/panicked chimp mode, he sounds very sensible and like he definitely means well. In fact, it sounds like HE'S scared to have this latest debrief alone, just the two of you. Undoubtedly because he thinks he'll just make things a whole lot worse or is now at a complete loss to know how to make you properly and finally understand how hurtful it is to him when you make unilateral decisions and undermine him.

Why do you have a communication gap? Because you're two separate people, that's why. Even genetic and Siamese/conjoined twins have communication difficulties. Unless two people's BRAINS are conjoined, that's par for the human course, I'm afraid, and you just have to keep practising until you learn to attune your respective wavelengths so that they match and you each have a better understanding of where the other is coming from. For example, if you knew that his "get lost!", for him, was a mild, 1/10 insult whereas for you it's a giant 10/10 one, either you could learn not to take it so seriously or he could appreciate how it impacts on you as an individual and try to abstain (or a bit of both).

Yes, I agree the IDEAL is that you and he hash things out together only. But look at the evidence, Amms. Even with me on-board, you still have trouble grasping how terrible you make him feel over this linear decisions issue, including what it says to him about your supposed team spirit. As for HIM? - he clearly has trouble understanding how his own mid- and post-fight behaviour impacts on YOU. For example, does he KNOW about how ill you wake up feeling each time,...that he's hurting you THAT MUCH? I'll bet he doesn't (albeit clearly he started to wonder when you were absent). HERE'S YOUR CHANCE. Get this major issue done and dusted and then next time, you CAN talk on your own just the two of you again.

Men aren't NEARLY as emotionally articulate as women. But the point remains about how DESPERATE he is to make you understand him better and he you.

If during this pow-wow you were to SPELL OUT how incredibly upsetting his rude words and sulks are to you but he STILL didn't next time tone it down or, god forbid, CRANKED IT UP, then you would have to conclude he was either beyond help or an emotional manipulator (during fights, I mean) and then have more of the facts you needed for deciding whether or not this bloke's silly streak were something you could actually live with.

If you tell him beforehand that you want he and you to agree to put a stop to the 'meeting' THE MINUTE either of you can tell this friend is 'making things worse' or liable to, then no damage can get done. Maybe agree a secret codeword or cough or gentle nudge under the table to signify either of you thinking it's proving to be a bad plan after all?

Do you not TRUST this mutual friend or when it comes to having yours and his best interests at heart, is that why you're dreading the idea? Or is it just not your comfort zone?

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Oh, and PS: If this friend's attempt DID start to show itself as unhelpful, you and he can simply say, 'Listen, friend, we are so incredibly touched by your attempt to help as well as that you cared enough about us as a couple to agree to it in the first place (you're a total sweetheart), but I think it's clear at this point that it's not really going to-plan so we think it better to take ourselves off and try to continue on our own. That's our fault, not yours, by the way, so thank-you majorly - we owe you BIG-time! - and we'll let you know how it all went next time we see you. Is that okay? :-)'.

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I understand and thanks thats so sweet of you , i know you have a life and lots of chores ;-) just feel good to hear from you.Is your family going well?

no that friend is totally trustable and basically she is closer to me than him so i never doubt her intentions.ok i ll discuss if he initiated i mean three of us but i dont like that i blame him or tell his weakness infronta any frd as well so may be i ll sum up this way that
''ya i just got rude with him that day but i was expecting him to be a bit more open to me and i also want an effort from both of us so that our communication gap decreases.Otherwise nobody can love me like him and i dont have any complaints from him''

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Yes i admit that i am safe :)
And i admit i do not want to lose him not becoz i love him but because he is really one out of million.

First time called crazy

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Chngd my allias

He called me when i ws sleeping.Lets see when he calls again.Thinking to act neutral.

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I've found your 'virus', the one that's causing you to get so damn worried and paranoid every time you two have a fight, that it leaks out even physically (you feeling ill and unable to function).

You say [1] nobody can love him like you and [2] that he really is one in a million.

[1] Yes they might and [2] no he isn't. He's one in roughly a max. 12,000 potential soulmates in just your immediate vicinity (50 mile radius) (trust me, I've done the maths), excluding those who are homosexual, not single/available at any given time that you are or horribly incompatible due to wildly different parental/familial/social rearing styles and experiences) - one with a genetic likeness enough to produce a great baby with you, but not enough to produce one with birth defects. And there aren't even any real geographical constraints when you consider how, like a great many couples out there, I and Mr S met and fell head-over-heels in Spain.

Your guy might well be the BEST of that worldwide soulmate pool, but you can't actually say that with any confidence unless you've already sampled a relationship with all 12k or X millions located elsewhere in the world. I'm presuming you haven't ever tended to 'get around' that much? LOL

But, seriously, you think that way and you may as well call it quits now. If you take "the scarcity principle" to that overblown extent and believe he literally is the only man for you on the planet then that is what's going to make you too scared and desperate to stay grounded and sensible during any clashes that you ONLY FEEL are putting the relationship at threat. It's not 'at threat', anyway, it's just 'TO "A" TEST'. Undergoing normal and natural tests isn't what kills relationships. People reacting pessimistically to them whereby they're panicking and going doolally, i.e. letting bog-standard fears spill out over their partner to the extent where it detriments the relationship is what kills them.

Have my Squishy Armchair analogy:

A relationship is you and the other person trying to exist together in an armchair that has a very deep and squishy seat cushion, so deep it takes time for it to sink under the weight and shifting movements of you both. The armchair isn't QUITE big enough for two, despite over-roomy for one, and sinks mainly in the centre as throws two sitters in towards each other, closer and closer. ("It's a love-seat, Jim, but not as we know it!")

So you sit and snuggle up in it the first time. Wonderful! What bliss! Happy-happy-happy!... But after a while (usually 3 months, then again 7-9 months, then again 18 months...), as said cushion starts to sinks a bit, you both get pushed more and more into each other.

Suddenly his elbows are sticking into your ribs and/or your hipbones are likewise poking/clashing with his. "Owww! Move OVER a bit, can't you? / Ow yourself!...I haven't got any ROOM!...it's not me, anyway, it's YOU, YOU move over a bit! / What are you talking about, I'm ALREADY as squashed up to my side as far I can, YOU move!...". Enter bickering.

Both convinced you're going to be in this chair for-life, no WAY do you want to have to keep sat in that awkward, uncomfortable position the entire time. So you have to start negotiating and trying to adjust your positions until you're both happy that a diplomatic share of shifting has taken place and can both, equally, be comfy again.

Sometimes who and what is causing or doing the sticking into is obvious, sometimes it isn't, meaning, you and he might tiresomely have to stand up out of the chair for a minute (your case, usually one week) to inspect the problem. If that happens, you tend to both plump up and re-straighten the cushion...which can result in your sitting a little less close-up than before. Then you sit down again, hopefully this time better and more cleverly than before.

And repeat with every sinkage stage...

If you've fallen in love with a man with very wide shoulders and torso, tough luck, that's the way the cookie crumbles. Same goes for if he's as much as twice the size of you plus unused to sharing to that degree or for that length of time or is a right "fidget-bum". Same for if he tends to get however much obnoxious whenever positions get problematic and discomfort/pain features. If he wants to remain in that chair with you he just has to learn NOT to be, doesn't he. And you have to learn the right way to approach him to say, Houston can you get your razor-sharp elbow out of my ribs, please, rather than, "OY, FATTIE - SHIFT - NOWWWW-AH!". Etcetera etcetera. (AND vice-versa, of course - YOU (the woman) might be grossly overweight and/or sit with your knees wide open like a man or have a mouth like a sewer, mightn't you.)

You don't get given any props, like throw cushions or giant corn plasters to cover your sharp or tender bits with. You have to just WORK IT OUT. Sitting partners instead of dance partners. But it still IS a dance. A chair-dance. So it still takes synchronicity (real love), particularly as, if he's 'up there' still (from his having been the only one to have stood up and plumped/adjusted before sitting down again) whereas you're 'further down', you're now going to have his shoulder or elbow sticking into your TEMPLE (now that really *is* uncomfortable!). That's why if he gets up and out to examine the problem, SO MUST YOU (mirroring) or else without the counter-balance of his weight, you're just going to meantime sink down even further and exacerbate the whole problem (or vice versa), as I say.

The solution is in fact obvious, but which tends to occur to some sitters too late (that "cry me a river" scenario)...even as late as a whole year following having gone 'That's it, I can't take this any more, I don't want to be your armchair partner E-VER AGAIN!'.

...And it's this: CUDDLE UP MORE, stop keep getting all the way out of the chair too often, stop fidgeting (struggling) so much, keep your fecking breath sweet and bloody lose weight either or the pair of you! If you're going to sit snuggled up to someone, DO IT PROPERLY, and try, for example, sitting atop one another's laps occasionally! And then you won't have to be so overly careful and considerate ALL the time, will you.

He's got out of the chair (albeit is still stood right beside it and you), hasn't been able to work out the exact problem with positions or the nature of the chair and/or can't quite find a way to convince you that you both need to shift or reorientate a little and how. So he's 'phoned' what he reckons is someone who is quite a good observer and analyser (your friend) to ask them to come and help explain his problem to you or even put HIM right over what the problem actually is (in case he's wrong). Like I say, that is the behaviour of a man who DOESN'T have too much false pride to admit his own or relationship fallibilities to a known 'outsider' when it comes to his UTTER DETERMINATION to find a solution, whatever it is, to ensure neither of you have to ever agree that you can't manage to sit there together for the rest of your lives, "rubbing along" smoothly together.

Is that any reason to panic and think he's going to leave the room altogether (and same for him and his panic on that score)? Answer: Tsk!

Just relax and listen to him and her and then, if you have any better ideas - OFFER them. I'm sure with all THREE of you inspecting the chair and how you both tend to sit in the first place or revert to sitting following your own inspections, a solution will make itself known. If you're panicking, you're not capable of listening and trying whatever's suggested, are you. You'll be too busy listening to the panic-babble in your head.... which would be a shame in the case of this friend quite possibly being capable of spotting a perfect positional compromise ("you can tuck your right hand under her right armpit while he at the same time can close or cross his legs").

You both get all panicky and melodramatic for nothing. *Particularly* as it's not exactly unheard of for couples to UPGRADE/CUSTOMISE their armchair to a slightly better design and shape each time they get the opportunity. Not a bigger chair - no-no-no, that's CHEATING. It's got to be that one and same chair that encourages you still to sit as close as comfortably, AS HUMANLY possible.

So that's that, that's all this is.

FEELING BETTER NOW? :-)

PS: If what you mean by 'neutral' is calm and normal despite your sitting styles aren't quite as compatible as they could or should be, then, yes, do. Because the point is, no-one's going anywhere, LEAST of all out of the entire room...not unless absolutely forced to. So get your respective neuroses and fears of abandonment (in this particular, really important relationship) under better, more grown-up control, the pair of you. (I'll let you off, though, because you're both very young and not exactly love-seat-type armchair experts yet.)

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He called and
Asked how was i and said that i called to ask u abt mothers health he sd that i will talk to my dr frd abt mums
Health and will get back to u wid a better opinion on how shud she proceed for treatmnt (May be he was trying to make me realise that nuthinh has changed :) )
He also sd that u r so busy that u dint attnd
My col.

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Yes feeling comfortable :-)

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I would also request u to reply on thread "post breakup anxiety" made by smbdy who is getting hopeless from
Life.i think a good counsellor like u would help him
Sort out.

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Listen, you can't claim I am or was a counsellor any more than you can ask (and have that question declined). Picture the scene: I or any of the other veteran advisers on this forum say we're counsellors and suddenly absolutely everybody is baying for our attention (either on theirs or someone else's behalf) whilst disregarding input from any others. We say we're not nor ever were counsellors and suddenly no-one has sufficient faith in our advice. Lose/Lose. And what of those who are just natural-born 'counsellors' yet non-practising lay people out in the 'real world'? Let's just leave it as I and the other vets and a surprisingly high number of visitors are especially talented at advising and also leave Fate to decide, Que Sera-style, whether I or they ever at any given moment in time have the space and inclination to come across any particular thread as may or may not create in us the urge to respond, or whether that individual isn't MEANT to have their dilemma sorted this soon or quickly. Fairenoughski? :-)

You, on the other hand, are perfectly free to pitch in (well done, by the way - I had noticed) because even "wrong" advice is good (if that's your fear?), in terms of it helping to eliminate X, Y or Z from the considerations or evidences table and/or just being very helpful food for thought.

Anyway, I'm glad fiance called. He's obviously holding back until this three-way pow-wow is done and dusted, which you can understand, but all the signals he's sending at least meantime reassure you that the relationship is itself still perfectly intact. Sulky or tantrum-y or not, underneath that over-arousal state, he DOES seem very considerate. That would explain why he wants, wherever possible, the same level of consideration and thoughtfulness back and ends up very disappointed if, as he sees it, he doesn't.

But this is all part and parcel of the 'really getting to know you/how we can operate smoothly together and both be equally satisfied' stage so... it's still all perfectly normal 'fidgeting and adjusting'. :-)

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My intention was just to say what is ur opinion on his/her condition,whats ur take on it,or may be what i think is that may be u can help him out.sometimes some queries are missed from our eyes so i just wanted to knows what will u suggest,whats wrong in that?

Hmm yeah i understand but well he didnt call me back the other day to let me know what that dr friend said ,i think that health issue was just an excuse to have a talk wid me .

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Nothing is 'wrong' with it, exactly, but... trouble is, I'm not quite sure how to explain it in a way you'll understand, other than what I've already said so - let's not worry about it and just contain the conversation to you and fiance for now.

He found an excuse to check your current temperature vis-a-vis the state of you and he. Yes, agree. But I'm sure he was well aware it would automatically serve as reassurance for you, too.

When is this mutual friend 'booked' to play mediator? And did you tell him during this temperature-check call that you were willing to give it a go?

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I txtd him tonight wats hapninh? But no reply.

Yes mAy be a temp check n i was v neutral. Well right now i am thinking that may be he was chlking my temp or whether i am angry on his behaviour.even i m thinking that i shud have shown sum attitude or anger otherwise he can alws get away wid that behaviour ,wat u say?
Anther ques,not only in this situation.wat u think ignuring in reaxtion to ignurung is a good way to end this habit? ( specially taking into consideration the sulking habit of men)
No this was only told by my frd that he sd this to her and i cant show him that she told me even i m not pretty sure v r going to hav a convrsatn over it or not.even i think he doesnot want me to start that story over n over again i did try to resolve matter last week and i saw result that was he running away n getting angry.this is his habit to just close the previous chapters n move on while i blv in discuion and resolving the mTers becoz they might bug us agn in future.

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Today was our fst day aftr holdays , he asked us in the morn to com to clas nd then whiole day we dint have any direct talk.later he went to his hostel.our that frd txtd hm to com to library to stdy tgethr for tmrws test but he didnt.

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I txtd him wat dr said ?
No reply.
It seems he doesnt want to talk to me or frd.. Really fed up . Miss him

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"Yes mAy be a temp check n i was v neutral. Well right now i am thinking that may be he was chlking my temp or whether i am angry on his behaviour.even i m thinking that i shud have shown sum attitude or anger otherwise he can alws get away wid that behaviour ,wat u say?
Anther ques,not only in this situation.wat u think ignuring in reaxtion to ignurung is a good way to end this habit? ( specially taking into consideration the sulking habit of men)"

I've already answered. It's in the November 28th 13:12 post above. However, if what you mean is, how should you react when in future HE'S the one in the wrong and thereby caused the trouble by breaking a relationship rule or normal relationship etiquette, then technically you can react as you see fit. But you wouldn't get far setting a better standard/training him out of his tantruming then ignoring and sulking habit if you just took on HIS style, would you. Do that and you're giving it the rubber stamp of approval.

The tack to take in those circumstances is what I call "sound warm, DO COOL" - to demonstrate (not say) whenever HE 'opens your door or window to take a peek' that you're a mixture between sad, disappointed and *distinctly unimpressed* (or a bit repulsed if he's been REALLY obnoxious) as manifests NOT through the tone of your voice but through your not being as eager as normal to be available to him. That means you cease leaping eagerly on his calls, i.e. let it go to voicemail then ring back an hour or more later, or accept it immediately but say you're busy and will call him back later once you're available again, to make dates to see your friends so that when he asks to see you Tuesday, he can't and has to make it 2 or 3 days or a whole week later... plus you act like a lemon, suddenly have to be SQUEEZED to yield any juice (chattiness and information about your life) instead of the normal 'pouring it for him'... all those sorts of things that show a slight but notable cooling off/taking a step or two back, despite you still pick up his calls with a fairly breezy (but only-just-palpable, slightly more formal and polite than usual) tone and manner. Example:

Him: Hiya, it's me!
You: [less enthusiasm] Oh. Hello.
Him: [realising you're not the one asking after him]....Er, so how are you?
You: Good, thanks, yeah. You?
Him: Yeah-good,-what have you been up to since I last saw you?
You: Oh, you know, this and that, the usual mainly.... nothing particularly out of the ordinarily, just busy-busy-busy, getting on with stuff.. [zero information that only *sounds* like information]
Him: .............Er..Well, have you been out anywhere good?
You: Mmmmm, yeeeeah... went to the cinema with [insert girl friend's name(s)]...yeah, that was fun.
Him: ............Well, what film did you see?
You: Phoooooooo, d'ya know, I can't remember what it was called, now........heh!.... [Then, like you're trying to get the focus off of you ] Anyway, you been up to much?
Him: [blah-blah-blah]
You: Mm-hm?.... Yuh?.....That's good-Anyway,..um, I've got to go out in a minute so, listen, I'll give you a call back, say, tomorrow, yeh?
Him: Oh. Okay. What time?
You: Dunno yet...probably evening?, dunno...
Him: Oh... okay.
You: Okay-bye!, *click* [none of the usual "you put it down ha-ha, no YOU, NO YOU" lovers' nonsense]

And then you, "oops", forget (so that he has to chase) or forget and ring hours later than you said. But only because you're so busy-busy-busy now that you've BEEN FORCED to turn your attention to other things and people.... just like you DO when someone's majorly turned you off.

The ideal would be for you to not even HAVE to act, but feel that way genuinely.

I remember when my rebound ex called one Wed evening, hot on the heels of his having behaved badly and non-cooperatively the prior Sunday (started trouble then refused to discuss it). Not expecting it to be him (because I'd been enjoying the break, despite feeling his taking his time to chase to apologise was insult atop injury whereby now *I* didn't want to discuss anything), I answered with my usual, chirpy, Heee-llo?! He replied, 'Hi, it's me' and, without even thinking/editing, I blurted, 'Ohhhh goddd' (as in, oh please no?, like he was my dentist calling to say I needed a hundredth filling). He went, "OH, THAT'S REALLY NICE, YEAH, THANKS! A! LLLOT!" and slammed the phone down. Despite a tad guilty, I just felt too relieved not to have to sit and listen to any more of his usual pathetic excuses and went and sat back down on the sofa. Ten minutes later, HE was the one to ring back. I didn't answer. So he rang and rang and..... Why? Because deep-down he knew I was justified to feel such dread and distaste. Berbom.

So you can't do it if you're the one to have legitimately upset him to begin with, no matter if he chooses to react badly to it. You do that - add gross insult to injury and spit in the face of justice - and you could make things a whole lot worse or get yourself knee-jerk "dumped".

So anyway, it's not what you say but HOW you say, and, more than that, what you DO/FAIL TO DO compared to situation normal that counts. You just act befittingly unimpressed and turned off a bit/a lot (depending on the severity of the 'crime').

But not this time because, I repeat, you're the one who 'broke the law'.

********

"this is his habit to just close the previous chapters n move on while i blv in discuion and resolving the mTers becoz they might bug us agn in future."

Well in that case he should stay single rather than inflict himself on other people including (and especially) the fairer sex. That or quick-sharpish learn that a team-player attitude, including trying to resolve things at the very first opportunity so that they CAN'T bother or threaten the team ever again at whatever further-flung point, is VITAL to a relationship being able to survive. If he keeps trying to sweep everything *permanently* under the rug that stands between you, pretty soon all you'll be capable of seeing is this great big mountain that makes you think UGH, rather than him as used to make you think YUM.

********

"Today was our fst day aftr holdays , he asked us in the morn to com to clas nd then whiole day we dint have any direct talk.later he went to his hostel.our that frd txtd hm to com to library to stdy tgethr for tmrws test but he didnt."

It sounds like he's still holding out for an apology. Either that or is simply trying to minimise any interactions for a while as a sort of mini-break, to give himself longer to calm down and think properly?

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I got the reply latr of that txt from him becoz he ws bzy smwere.i told him then that my
Mum has seen ur pic and she had given a pstv response. We both thanked GOd.however he was still holding back to my that statemnt which hurtd him i explnd him on texts that i didnt mean it then he sd u shud think before speaking.then he called me on watsap and then we had a detail talk abt life and stuf how he managed last week and how his sis n aunty hav come to know abt mine and his liking.. Then he sd i m fed up of hostel and want tp run my own bUsnes as soon as posble so that i can get marryd

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"becoz he ws bzy smwere"

Yeah. Picking his nose and scratching his b*lls on his sofa in front of the telly, meanwhile trying his hardest to create a reply delay by resisting the pull to make contact, that kind of 'busy'. LOL

".i told him then that my
Mum has seen ur pic and she had given a pstv response."

Sorry - what's all this about?

" i explnd him on texts that i didnt mean it then he sd u shud think before speaking"

True. And so should he. What's his point? :-p Can't stand being upset/anxious even enough to let you commit mistakes same as he does? In actual fact, I'd say it were truer to say, you need to think more before you act and HE'S the one that needs to think before speaking ("you're a mental case, you need treatment, get lost!, etc.).

Well anyway, you obviously hit the spot with that explanation (tick!) if he then went chatty-chat-chat for ages AND basically revealed to you that your own coast is coming clear in terms of seeking familial approval (tick!).

Oh wait... should have read ahead, LOL: "Then he sd i m fed up of hostel and want tp run my own bUsnes as soon as posble so that i can get marryd"

You've impressed him! :-) See how easy that was (when it's your fault as gives you all the power and control (the right sort), I mean)? Suggest you take time to chew on that, swallow it, but NOT POO IT OUT.

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He was quite positive today.He took me to shoping and lunch.And was quite in good mood۔

My family doesnt know that we love each odr only my mother know that we are clasfelows so i told him that my mother has given quite a positive respons abt u when i told that my clasfelow proposes me and she saw ur snap she liked it.

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He bought me sum cosmetcs in market.i also tried to return him some money which i borowed from him last month for my frds marriage.he sd i will never take them from u .u r my responsiblyy and u shud spend it on mums health, even if u need more u shud take from me :)

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I dun think he was intentionally delaying reply. Becoz i texted him at that tym in which he goes to sleep (at daytime) he wakes up in evening and i got reply in early eveing.

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"He was quite positive today.He took me to shoping and lunch.And was quite in good mood۔"

Well, yes. Because you apologised and explained, and in a way that rang true and he could accept. (He'd obviously all along been pessimistically believing/fearing you were just being bloody-mindedly resistant to his sensitivities-based requests.)

See how p*ss-easy it was to snap him out of it (compared to the marathon sulks, I mean)? Not only that, but, next time HE'S in the wrong but doing his sulky act, you'll be at liberty to challenge his calibre (flick his competitive nerves) compared to your own by reminding him that when it was you in the wrong it took you far less time to make-good.

"He bought me sum cosmetcs in market.i also tried to return him some money which i borowed from him last month for my frds marriage.he sd i will never take them from u .u r my responsiblyy and u shud spend it on mums health, even if u need more u shud take from me :)"

Awww, sweeeeet. :-) Well, all I can say is that when you DO do it, you're one excellent apologiser.

PS: "I dun think he was intentionally delaying reply. Becoz i texted him at that tym in which he goes to sleep (at daytime) he wakes up in evening and i got reply in early eveing." Yeah, maybe... but, put it this way - neither did he intentionally stay alert for your call. (Ketchup, baby tomato - you're still a little bit Green ;-))

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Agree cent percent :-)

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Bad day!
We were going fr a hiking trip wid frds when he ate my breakfast after that i ws feeling hungry and we weerent able to find a restaurnt my mood got off he got offended and he left fr uni i got angry and said y r u going i was just going to hold his ear when he slapped me ( not a genuine forceful one - just a try to stop mine- he was thinking that i was going to slap) i was so surprised at hs reaction bcoz i had no intention to slap or smthing.. I abused him verballyy ( becoz he slapped me infronta lot of ppl i got so angry) he then left and i sd to frds that u ppl shud go wd him too they calld him he cam bak then we went fr hiking we had no direct convrtsatns bt i reminded him that he ate my breakfast he minded that may be i dun care becoz i ws hurt by hus behavr۔۔ later in uni i tryd to tak to him but he didnt respond i told him on txt that y is he Afraid i was nvr going to slap he replied with ( fuck off) i sd fuck off u too then i wrote long msgs telling him that how his feudal family bkground affected his psychAe where male r being over dominant he replied ( i said fuck off ) i said ( fuck offu too ). Then again i txtd hm n sd that u ll agn com to b n confess ur lov do not frget those days during ur mood swing , do not frget that u sd u can giv ur life for me however i donot blv because it seems funy to me now,he replied dont expect that from me, then i sd only material things cant buy love, he sd ok then leav me, i sd i m comitted however u hav free choice nd i m hoples that i dun c a postv chang in un. He didnt rep. Then i sd i wasjust making mood off face becoz i was xpctng u to pamper me that tym, he said Alas these talks matter now

Wat u guess from this all?
Me v v v upset panic attack sad crying and i didnt rep him aftr his last that text.. He had his frds wedding tomorrow n day After tmorrow he will come bak to uni on tue , today s friday. But i dont even knw how will he react aftr coming bak? Any guesed n sugestnd? However i do want u to knw that i dun want to b treated bad just to be in a relatn

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I m really missing feeling incomplete without my father who board to eternal life last year. Feeling severely that nobody can replace him :(

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Two steps forward, one back. That's the usual pattern when it comes to human learning. As long as the progress trajectory is still upward-climbing, that's the main thing. SO STOP PANICKING EVERY TIME, it's completely unnecessary.

With friends. There's your sticking point. EVERY SINGLE TIME. It's obviously a climate-trigger. Hence he ate your breakfast - to put you into as low/bad a mood as he already was. See it?

He doesn't know how to puke behind a bush. He has to have a vessel. *You*. He's never learnt emotional self-sufficiency and self-comforting; always had A. N. Other involved.

Hold his ear? And he [wait for it] panicked and literally batted back?

Why did you have to return the shot/puke atop his own puke? Why couldn't you have left his own stenchy mess for all to see? Instead of your friends thinking, There goes an emotional idiot, you saw to it that they thought, There go TWO emotional idiots. See it?

Anyway, you can't injure someone and then expect them to have the normal calm and concentration to listen to anything. You have to give their nerves time to stop stinging. YOU may be able to have a right royal barnie and then go, 'Drama over, now let's all have a nice cup of tea!', but - HE'S NOT YOU (not yet, not to that extent). Plus, you HAVE slapped him before so why are you so surprised and indignant that he presumed that was what was coming and pre-empted accordingly?

"he replied with ( fuck off) i sd fuck off u"

LOL!

..and then you made like you're his analyst. Mmm, sexy (not).

"he replied ( i said fuck off ) i said ( fuck offu too )"

LOL!!! Desensitization, anyone?

You're becoming him and he's becoming you. That's alright - at some point you'll both meet in the middle, LOL.

And then, basically, we had, 'You leave me / No, you leave ME / No, you / No, YOU!', followed by "he said Alas these talks matter now" (- b*llocks!).

Shall we just finally concede to the crystal-clear fact that no-one's leaving anyone around here?

But you are STILL REFUSING to choose the smoother side of the path. If Violet-Elizabeth wants to flounce off then next time LET HIM. Don't try to grab his ear, for goodness' sake - what did THAT achieve? Nothing. It only made things escalate. KNOW WHEN TO TAKE A STEP *BACK*.

...which, funnily enough, is what you did by then failing to reply. It leaves his words out there, echo-ing in his mind (good). 'Whoops, sh*t!', he'll think, the minute he's calmed down. But it would still have been better not to have blotted out his vomit with yours.

"But i dont even knw how will he react aftr coming bak? "

Same as ever. It's a dance. And you DO insist, the pair of you, in putting on the same ol' music track.

"However i do want u to knw that i dun want to b treated bad just to be in a relatn"

Then next time he acts out his displeasure (you giving 'his' attention to other people, I shouldn't wonder) by eating your breakfast or whatever, voice your dismay and disapproval calmly and rationally and then, if he fails to there and then say sorry and/or do something to make up for it, completely withdraw your attention and affection and treat him as you would your local vicar, but only with *responses* of address, not initiation. He'll soon join those dots (doing X gets me the unwanted Y).

"I m really missing feeling incomplete without my father who board to eternal life last year. Feeling severely that nobody can replace him :("

That's just a normal, fleeting reaction whenever the one man that in your mind matches up to your beloved dad seems to veer too much and too negatively from your own personal experiences of the man. However, I bet if your dad had been your husband, you'd have tried to grab his ear and he'd have whoops-failed to not make skin contact as he swatted your hand away.

Let the mutual re-circling process now commence... ;-)

Still, look on the bright side: that's yet another fight from the total bucket and only X left to go.

He was the one who started it this time, though. The usual (relationship-induced insecurity and territorialism). He ate your breakfast. If that's not him saying, 'Fancy a fight?' I don't know WHAT is! I suggest that to whatever snidey, snarky things he might still have it in him to say, you reply simply, each and every time, 'You stole my breakfast'. No exclamation-marks. No edits or additions. Just that. Real men are supposed to PROVIDE food for their partner, not take it off them. HE knows that.

PS: I have to ask: is there one or a couple of blokes in that crowd that, unbeknownst to you, spend the whole time taking sneaky peeks at you whenever you're not looking yet not quite sneakily enough when it comes to his noticing?

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To ur last ques. No there isnt anyone like that.

Ok i read ur rep now so i have to tell u that in the morning i did text him that i am not going to forgiv u for raising hand to me infront of entire public no matter what u do bye.( soulmate i am a lady for God sake and i never slapped him when we had an agreement abt it so how he made something in his own mind and then reacts according to that- have i lost the benefit from
His last text after this? )

It was HIS plan too to accompany friends because we are left with two weeks in ending of last semester and then exams. So

When i am explaining smrhing on txt how his fuck off text is reasonable??

Even before this fight our frds were tellinh him that you are too moody.so i m not the only one who says this.

Overall its an unexpected and worst day in our relationship.i couldnt ever believe he can do this to me .still in shock. All men are the same :/

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On that day i was so ill even then i came fr trip
Just fr him.. Thats y i was stoping him frm going bak and canceling trip

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"Ai'm a lay-deee!" (- sorry, couldn't resist a quote from Little Britain's "Emily").

Well, then - " i was just going to hold his ear when he slapped me ( not a genuine forceful one - just a try to stop mine" - you shouldn't have tried beforehand to grab his ear. Or what - do you somehow think that doesn't count as 'laying your hands on him'?

Despite he was wrong about that, HE THOUGHT YOU WERE GOING TO SLAP/AGGRESS HIM like *has* happened before on more than one occasion (the pair of you, him the worst), meaning 'with-basis', not paranoia.

What were you intending to DO with his lughole, anyway? Lead to him by it to the Naughty Step like his mum (obviously) used to?

No his eff-off text is NOT reasonable. I laughed because you gave him a taste of his own medicine (which clearly shocked him off his perch) and, although I wouldn't pre-condone such childish behaviour as has now forced you out of exasperation to bat it straight back, it still has to be recognised for the "I ain't 'AVIN' this!" attitude that it newly represents in you. Right and self-respectful intention on your part, WRONG COUNTER-METHOD.

Have you never tried a "Paddington hard stare"? RSvP.

It might WELL have been his co-plan to include the rest of your joint posse - and kudos to him for at least trying to make that effort for what, going by his past attitude, can only be construed as having been for your sake (tick! - progress) - ... but he obviously couldn't cope with the reality of it, for whatever reason(s) (that I'm TRYING to identify). I'm pretty sure the reason is his inability to cope with not having your attention all or mostly to himself, only unless you give me more data (e.g. what exactly happened in the direct run-up to his stealing your brekkie), it could have literally been anything.

Okay, scratch that - just read the next sentance: "Even before this fight our frds were tellinh him that you are too moody."

THERE IT IS!

Go on - tell me [1] what he said/did to make them say so and [2] what YOU then said or did with your face in reaction to hearing them say it? Or, equally, what you can fathom you (in his mind) *failed* to do/say/facially gesticulate?

********

"All men are the same :/"

Crikey - you've dated ALL MEN??? Here, I thought you just said you're a lay-dee? ;-)

Awwww, cheer up. Things always (alwaysalwaysalways) get worse right before they get better. Anyway, how on earth can a zit pop, excrete its pus, heal and become barely visible scar-tissue, a thing of the past, if it never comes to a head? ALL couples fight, particularly in the Power Struggle phase. You can do the chronic, drip-drip, never-ending drip version or the MUCH more cleverly efficient short-sharp, over-in-'minutes' version. If you get this out of your systems *now*, while you're still young and before you marry and move in together, then you'll end up one of those genuinely smug couples who have become nigh-on telepathic, etc., because they've naturally FUSED to become 'one' (comprised of two halves).

Magical things happen after that. And no, I'm not telling you what or it'll tamper with the process and alter the outcome. "Soz".

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I m trying to cheer up :-) just that my health doesnt support me :-)

Wen we were going fr the sake of hiking he sd i dun like moody ppl his male frd said u shudnt say this ATLEAST. My girl frd said yes he is right u r v moody. I was smilinh n lafing at their cuments and my bf also smiled and giggled.

Life is tough spec if u lov smbdy, everytime i think that we wont fight but something happens bcoz of his mood swinhs and whole day is ruined. Even he hurted my frd as well she went alone tpwards uni while coming bak however he called him later to cheer up. I told him in those txts that you have this "attack" normally and your "mood swings" ruin everything.

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It was not "stealing" breakie , act he daily eats lunch from my lunch box bcoz he mises his mothers home food in return he takes lunch from canteen for me

But problem was not him eating my breakfast i ws just "showing off" to b angry becoz i was expecting him to pamper me ( cant i expect my hubby to do lil bit pampering to me :-( just an innocent wish) and I ws expctng him to say my love we ll do breakfast sumwhere dun b sad,wat he did was totally oposite he went towards oposite path leaving me

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what should i do right now? should i stay silent and wait for him ? ( taking into notice my last msg). i also asked you have i lost the benefit from His last text after this??

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he minded that a lot... abt my breakfast words... becoz he feels he has a right on my mother made lunch as he misses his mom so he got hurt by that , also when after that we all bought a piza he also took share of money from ME (usually he doesnt) trying to realise me that if YOu will do this difference(calculation in things etc) i will do too. he also said me at that time that u r doing this calculation from the morning. and i sd u r doing so why not me ? he said i am NOT DOING IT !

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"I was smilinh n lafing at their cuments and my bf also smiled and giggled."

*sigh*

What are you like, eh? He only smiled and giggled because the only alternative - showing his hurt feelings (how fragile he secretly is) or outwardly sulking (as had just been blocked DESPITE NOW JUSTIFIED) - "isn't" socially acceptable for a man who has to constantly appear like he's made of Titanium, so what else was he going to do but pretend to laugh along? Fall in a heap on the path and blub his face off? (I bet he bloody felt like it.)

You, on the other hand, whether you knew what they were saying were mostly true or not, should have stuck up for him, protected him (female version), when seeing he was under attack like that. What would you have done had he been your kid?

I mean, that was VERY tactlessly, insensitively, BRUTALLY put by them! How humiliating, being criticised en masse, criticised in front of the person you're always endeavouring to keep impressed, and seeing everyone getting to witness first-hand how "unloveable" he must be, given that not even she who is his LOVER, seemingly can't even love him when he's in that underdog position!

So there he was, feeling victimised, not only at the hands of people who are supposed to be equally his friends and allies (considerate), but by the ONE PERSON IN THE WORLD WHO'S SUPPOSED TO HAVE HIS BACK AND SHOWS SHE ACCEPTS THAT HE'S NOT PERFECT, EVEN APT TO BE HYPOCRITICAL, YET LOVES HIM NONETHELESS FOR HIS OTHER *BRILLIANT* QUALITIES.

Me, I'd have said something like, 'Well, granted, he can be incredibly sensitive but, to be fair - considering that carries far bigger benefits as well in other ways and other times - I'd rather have a sensitive fiance than a rhino with overly thick skin/numb nerves to match, treading on my toes all the time', then (knowing me) lightening everyone up and compensating by adding, '...plus he's got a huuuuuuuuge d*ck! ;-)'.

Even an, 'Oy, leave it out, too much!' would have sufficed.

ANYONE would have felt betrayed and heartbroken in his position.

So here we are, coming full circle back to the fact that you're not putting him constantly first, like you should, and are showing split loyalties or even greater loyalty to them (as well as not being sufficiently aware of his delicate sensitivities).

He's your partner, supporter, PSYCHOLOGICAL HOME WITH COSY FIREPLACE for the rest of your life.
They are not nor ever will be nor ever could be.

Stop choosing them over him.

If he ever hurts one of his friends then it's up to he and they to sort it out, not you to help them get petty revenge like that just because it serves as an opportune moment for you to discharge whatever anger didn't get properly cancelled-out from inside you the last time he and you squabbled. That one requires better, longer discussions, not acts of passive-aggression after the fact.

If you can't see this then you'll have to replay that whole tape but with you as the one they were all picking on and humiliating, and he being the one to show such gross, such extra-hurtful disloyalty towards you. You'd have dumped him the next day or else not spoken to him for an entire month!

He may be a hyper-sensitive, moody git at times but by GOD he's big-hearted, patient, tolerant and forgiving for a man!!! And that can only be because he's so incredibly in-love with you. And I'm not SURPRISED he's constantly on the look-out for incoming missiles, always so ready to react defensively, if that's how heavy-handedly his so-called friends and fiancee treat him (yet to which ALL he responsively does to get his own back is something trivial in comparison like eat your food and not replace it).

His moods don't constantly "swing", MEE. Half the time they're SHOVED, whereupon kenesis takes over. You and your friends were the one ruined that day, actually. You lot ruined HIS day. I'm surprised the injustice of his being told he's the perpetrator even when so obviously the victim hasn't had him self-combusting by now. His having told you merely to eff off is you getting off lightly.

After everything that's been happening - never mind 'next day',
I
would
have
dumped
you
on
the
SPOT
for
that!

for the disheartening sign it seemed, finally, undeniably, to be (- you trying to push him away or showing him he'd never have a No. 1 ally in this life if he married you).

YOUR avoidable slip-up, your olive-branch to proffer. ****Be quick because it's already overdue.*****

Start with telling him you've had time to reflect and now appreciate what a complete cow you were, without even meaning to be or realising. And no you won't 'lose the benefit' if you sincerely apologise and by that act, prove 100% that you merely made a silly oversight.

And in future, please ensure you give me all the available data in its entirety so that I don't waste my time and yours omitting to enter important numbers into my calculator, thereby coming up with the wrong total (calculator: rubbish in = rubbish out, correct in = correct out) and having to adjust it days later.

A few warts or not, like everyone else sports - HE'S your bestest friend in the world ever-ever-ever-ever-ever. Not them. Please make better efforts to behave accordingly from now on so that he has no resentments aimed at you to get in the way of his enormous feelings for you and can get more and more opportunity to show you their whole depth.

*******

PS: No he doesn't miss his mum's food, that's not the romantic-situation-relevant reason he shares yours, just the cover story. It's him helping himself to reassurance that you do, despite slip-ups such as the above one, genuinely love and want to nurture him as much as he does you, courtesy of the ACTION of you LETTING him share your food without going, 'Oy, geddoff - that's MINE!'. Because genuine lovers LOVE sharing everything possible together and those in Honeymoon Period take any and every opportunity to feed each other constantly. It's them showing off their in-common all-round nurturing capabilities in order to signal what a great long-term mate AND PARENT they'll make. So they treat each other as they would their future baby together, INCLUDING TALKING like babies together (Hewow baby bunny, I wove oo / Hewow squidgy boo-boos, I wove oo too......coochie-coochie-coo).

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Every single time i hav to say sorry? Y not one time he? If i m hurt over his slap y not he make an effort this time?(also keeping in mind my last text)

Spec in his last text he sd these talks doesnt matter any more means he is not even interested in sorting out.

He also mks fun of me smtyms if he has right thn y not me , is he the only one who gets hurt nd others r made of stone they never deserv an apology

N i told u before if he is left alone he gets bk to his norml tonr much early. N if i keep on mingling i dun thnk we ll get any response In turn it wil delAy.

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i texted him today in morning told him abt my severe illnes the dr tablets had even side effect on me and from 3 days my temp is not decreasing and i told i m not going to party in uni ....

but later my mom forcd me to attend party so i m here, he did nt hav plan to atnd bcoz he had some arguments wid classmates 2 months bak

First time called crazy

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I have sent these two apology texts to him
" I am sorry . I can never hurt u intenionally . It was just becoz i was too upset that day-pls ignore me:( "

"I m so sad abt the end of our so enjoyable uni life that i m behaving ridiculously , even i dun know what i do and say these days, i m really really upset that how will i live wthout u after this semester thats why i do what i dun want to :/ please pardon me for that..
i know nobody in the world can love me like u as u r my bestestest friend and hubby and i was being rude the other day-but please understand my situation and help me restore to my original self otherwise my health will keep on deteriorating day by day-pls :( "

First time called crazy

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Well, I was right, you do do apologies well when you have a mind to. And no - not every time. Only whenever you're the one who's started the negativity (again, this case, agreeing with the friends who were pecking at him, rather than sticking up for him purely because it was a two (plus?) against one at that point). Anyway, you clearly DID understand why - hence you went ahead and did it anyway. Now you wait for him and his newly freed-up, non anger-blocked mind to play back the whole tape and see HIS subsequent bad behaviour and apologise.

But this is the thing: you merely have to be responsible for your OWN side of things. It's up to HIM if he doesn't reciprocate in kind, like he should. Enough times of that and you'd then know this guy wasn't truly a keeper...that's how it works: you give them the floor to see what they're truly made of.

Plus, you have to ensure that his sulking time alone is done whilst without anything still to hold against you, otherwise your 'crime' becomes constantly too easily retrievable in his memory and builds and builds, providing justification after justification for keeping his resentment going. So you apologise when it's your fault and THEN stand back and let the positive little seed do its magic. You see, you THINK that devoid of an apology from you, he 'comes round'. Yet, SECRETLY, he's got a little cache of back-dated resentments in his Pandora's Box, meaning, next time he needs to take you to task and its lid gets let open - WHOOSH!..you get that reprimand AND a whole load of backdated anger and resentment with it. Keep the box empty and then his protests won't ever be out of proportion with the 'gravity' of the faux pas you've committed.

What's this about him making fun of your symptoms? Is that when he's mad at you?...or even (;;;-)) secretly still mad?

That last apology text of yours was highly, knock-yer-socks-off impressively written, btw. The only problem is, it perhaps should have been your first and last (i.e. in with the first one) before then leaving him to stew in its goodness, whereas you obviously couldn't have the patience to leave it and him alone thus couldn't resist nudging him. Never mind - he got two for the price of one. NOW let it work its magic - no more texts for now.

What's the latest anyway?

First time called crazy

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u mean i have to remain silent now? i txtd him becoz tchr asked me to call him to give his assignment bcoz it was his last day for assignment and if he didnt give she d fail him. i had to txt bcoz there was nobody else that day.its not in my disfavour? then he came to uni but i have not met him i saw him then but didnt say anything.is it wat u recemnd?

yes fun,like i made his-sort of that

First time called crazy

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fun as in he makes mine and i his... just as colg mates classfellows ... no not right now,he does normally

from come round u mean he ll contact me soon again?

when do u expect him to contact me ? he didnt rep to my texts but i m sticking to ur advices totally.

First time called crazy

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YES, you have to remain silent. You've DONE your bit by having apologised (and impressively so). Why, what else is there? What - chasing him as if desperate and terrified (revealing total lack of faith in your chemistry and bond), using a whole stream of Sorrys where one full and proper one would do, as your mere cover excuse to nudge again? NO. That's playing into the gorilla's hands when what you want is for the gorilla to fall back to sleep out of boredom of not getting interacted with, so that the human can re-surface (which is the entity that can see sense and forgive/shake it off). It's his turn to reciprocate the olive branch. So if the gorilla hasn't gone to sleep yet and is still running his whole show, you have to JUST WAIT.

I know it's frustrating, I know you're worried about Xmas and whatever else expectations or already-made arrangements, but you must never pander to your mere short-term needs over what you need today and for the rest of your life...and, again, that is this: someone who learns he gets NOTHING (bar the first contact apology where it were see-ably you who started him off) by sulking and holding a grudge for such a long time that it makes him end up looking very childish and unimpressive.

No, it's not a problem if you added in your 1st or 2nd text about the assignment. He knows where you are/where it is if he wants it and doesn't want an automatic Fail. There again, if after that he came into uni, I imagine he went and found that teacher. So you've done all you can on that matter as well and don't have to worry about his grades like you're his mum.

Banter-type teasing about symptoms isn't exactly saintly but it's worse to tease someone about their deepest personal shortcomings that no quick-fix medicine can touch or alleviate FOR them, because - these symptoms of yours are nothing to do with you and your personality, just temporary hitch-hiker type passengers that could steal a lift from *anyone*. His passengers are superglued to his passenger seat, meaning, he doesn't even KNOW if they're going to be electing to get out at whatever imminent stop or (yet) how to make them if not. He'll need to do a lot of shopping around (in his lifelong memory bank) to identify where that glue came from, what type it is, and find the correct solvent.

I can't see why he wouldn't calm down at some point, given that you've said AND SHOWN that you just made an error in judgement during what was/is an upsetting climate (uni coming to an end) when being upset is known to seriously cloud ones judgement even at the best of times. PS: He might be upset about that as well...highly likely, in fact, considering he doesn't just stand to possibly lose these friends automatically, same as you, but nigh-on guaranteeably now that he and they are mad at each other anyway on top. So he might be DOUBLY upset thus DOUBLY incapable of thinking straight, compared to normal/were this just a fight between you and he and nothing else.

'When' is the golden question as ever, but it did only take a few days last time... just 3 (between incident and re-contact), wasn't it? In that case, double it or add another 50% duration? It really depends on how much these friends mean to him compared to how much we obviously know you do.

Listen, HE knows Christmas is round the corner. Do you think HE wants to miss out on that special loved-ones' time as goes into the lifelong "Us" Memory Box any more than you do? Maybe he doesn't care about that side of things (yet), maybe he's that stubborn about it this time. I doubt it, particularly as seemingly you're the only friend he's got left. But if so - LET him lose out. And then let his conscience spend a whole year (until he can get to cancel it out Xmas 2016), kicking him hard in the shins for it, because - you? You've now cancelled out what you did wrong, have done everything in your power to, in amongst everything else, ensure you and he WOULDN'T lose out. And not just the once but TWICE. It'll be his fault, in other words. Undeniably. You, meanwhile, can party it up with your friends with a squeaky-clean conscience.

I mean, that's what a Sorry is for - to erase the crime (by showing you understand what specifically you did wrong thus won't be future-liable to repeat it) and pacify instantly AND clean the conscience. Or pacify as instantly as humanly possible. So if he's that wound-up that being slathered in Apology-Honey doesn't instantly do the trick, then you're better off giving him a wide berth for a while anyway because he'd just end up putting a serious dampener on any party spirit.

You did say you wanted to see your friends more. And now he's forcing you to have to. Silly him, then. :-p But great negative consequence of his own doing to help teach him not to just throw away his better effort last time at coming round faster.

You'll be fine. And anyway, he and you share wavelengths so - usually the way this goes is, the other somehow just *senses* you're no longer sat by the phone, obsessively worrying about him and what he's up to, and instead have 'wandered off' with your attention turned to other people or things. And since underneath it all this is extra-attention-seeking behaviour, they tend to not like that suspicion ("his" woman being left wide open to other advances by other, possibly (his perception) better blokes during parties or what-not) and get off their sulky arses and do something about it... to make you "look-at-him-look-at-him-and-only-him" by POSITIVE means instead. So WHEN he contacts and shows he's ready to play ball again, and you respond FAIRLY warmly (but at least not non-receptively) to give him that chance, his mind will yet again join the dots and have the lesson you're trying to 'teach' reinforced: 'when I sulk despite I've been apologised to, it gets me nothing - worse, makes me miss out on whatever fun's going down at the time WHEREAS when I do finally knock on her door with a bit of a smile on my face, she lets me in, MEANING, that whole extra sulking period was a COMPLETE waste of time...FUTILE... and apparently harmed - in real and meaningful ways - *ONLY ME*'. Ta-daaa!

People repeat behaviour only if they get what they want out of it every time. If it backfires in whatever way, gets them the OPPOSITE of what they'd been after, they bin it and try not to repeat it.

He's ignoring/resenting TWO 'groups' of people right now, isn't he. I expect he's feeling doubly sorry for himself that neither party are trying to bash his superstar door down with their anxious, fan-club fists to beg him to come out to play. The thing is, though, you lumped yourself in with the Friends group, meaning, he's mad at you for betraying him as his lover *and* as his best friend, itself meaning that if he forgives and re-approaches you too quickly he has to do likewise with the pure friends. Or vice versa. Whereas what he'll be wanting to give time to see is whether ANY of you try to beat down his door if he just sits back and waits a bit longer...a bit longer.... What I mean is, if he shows he's forgiven you already, these friends will get to know and will then themselves do the sitting back to wait to see if he similarly comes to their door. And vice versa with forgiving them first. So it's a bit more complicated this time.

However, I repeat, YOU at least HAVE given it a rightly gentle/normal knock, if not an actual kicking-in. So, once the deadline he's mentally set all of you as a group comes and goes, he'll conclude they're NOT going to do like you've done, meaning, now it's time to reward you (and f**k them).

The time for giving him a further little knock or making the decision as to whether you even should, is not now. Not yet.

Did all of that make sense to you?

First time called crazy

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In other words, he's HAD his little doggy choccie drop to symbolise your being sorry enough to make up for it. So now he's just being GREEDY, hoping he'll get more and more tasty treats. That's not how it works. The drop was a befitting adult apology, not an exercise in indulging his inability to know when to stop as some underhanded bid to take advantage of the situation. You do that and doggy not only gets fat but gets an increased appetite, meaning, the next time and the next (and so on), one drop won't ever be enough. And then you'll be all out of drops as well as feel you won't be able to afford to buy more if he's going to through the bag too quickly each and every time.

First time called crazy

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Sorry - get through [the bag too quickly].

First time called crazy

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I am updating statuses photos love poetry etc on fb is it ok or i have to refrain from that too?

First time called crazy

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(People repeat behaviour only if they get what they want out of it every time. If it backfires in whatever way, gets them the OPPOSITE of what they'd been after, they bin it and try not to repeat it.)

Dont u think if he ignures me and evrytime wen he gets bak to me i n same like befr, doesnt it assures his behaviour, means i m accepting his behavr fr future as well? ( by not shwng any complaint frm my syde? )

No he is only angry wid me he is good wid frds like norml, thats why i ws telling u that hus mood can not only b off bcoz of my lAfing at their compliment bcoz he was norml calm for quite a time after that, he ggot mad wen i sd its ur mistak that i cant find breakfast then he sd u blame me evrytime and he got angry - and he didnt go to party becozhe had a fight wd classfellws two months bak not wid HIS/OUR frds

First time called crazy

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If by photos and love poetry you mean photos of he and you exclusively rather than in amongst a group, and poems that he would know were for his benefit then, no that is not alright. Because it constitutes another 'knock'. But the way you've put it, it sounds like you're telling me AFTER the fact. Are you? If you are then you're scuppering the 'kick the sulks out of him' campaign.

Re your second question: Good grief, MEE, I've already EXPLAINED all of this - multiply! One last time: The campaign is this:
- Quickly clean up any mess you made on the floor (via the sincere apology) so that he can't keep slipping on it and thereby experiencing additional resentment stopping his sensible side from taking back over from his inner gorilla;
- Thereafter IGNORE HIM/NOT NUDGE HIM as you wait-without-waiting (busy yourself with fun and distraction) for this to happen;
- Open your own door a chink to take his apology but open it all the rest of the way ONLY if he then apologises back for the silly say he reacted to what was just a faux pas on your part (not a deliberate attempt to hurt him).

His MISSING YOU and not having had a nice time (because he's been left to stew miserably and sort it out in his head without any help at pacification) is his punishment in the main. Your being SLIGHTLY COOLER after you've let him 'back into the house' is then a punishment for the EXCESSIVE TIME he might have taken in accepting that apology, because it means he's lost progress with you and has to warm you back up to where you were before the fight. (which is romantic hard work). Added to this bit is the fact that as time has been ticking on during his sulk, he will naturally have begun to worry that HE might have actually gone and lost YOU (because he's seen no follow-up to your formal apology)... it puts a firework up his bum.

All in all, then, his opting to sulk before he gets down to the more serious, realistic thinking for more than the acceptable human amount means a great long marathon-worth of HASSLE AND WORRY FOR HIM; it does NOT get him seeing you from then on 'walking on eggshells', i.e. letting him get his own way over absolutely everything forevermore in a bid to try to avoid ever again antagonising him in any way (because that's impossible between two people that are very mentally intimate, each with their own ideas, desires and preferences, let alone when the relationship's particularly close, intense and passionate (despite/because of missing the sex element) like yours).

So if you're not making yourself accessible to him, where normally you two see each other frequently - how does that make things the same as always or represent you accepting this marathon sulk behaviour?

It doesn't. It's you DEMONSTRATING your disapproval and unimpressed-ness... so that you don't have to wear yourself out explaining WHY how his chosen form of reaction (and now this sulking) was unacceptable and WHY you find it so and WHY he shouldn't do it next time, blah-blah-blah-knackering-unnecessary-blah. Save for the initial apology itself, you don't ever NEED to speak and explain/teach. Or how do you think deaf mute couples who haven't learned sign-language cope? (Ok, there aren't any these days who can't sign but you get my gist).

******

I didn't realise he'd already forgiven and forgotten with these other friends or that they were a different crowd altogether. Well, in that case, that still just proves one of my earlier points - that he's NOT "insecure" per se (and possessing high standards and expectations of 'etiquette'). Only with you. So he doesn't really give a sh*t about that other crowd, then, not in comparison to you (I should think not!).

He's a HUGE sulker. We know that. He can go for days and days without cracking. He's used to it, is well practised. That means you're going to have to be capable of lasting even longer without cracking. This is stand-off. Poker. But the difference is - you're not SULKING. You're just standing up for yourself, 'saying' you're willing to make an apology if ever necessary but, other than that, what does he want - BLOOD?! *No*, he can't have it.

He wants it because then it becomes the 'enough' that HE needs, to be convinced that you DO love him and care about his feelings. Reassurance. But he has to learn that he needs to find OTHER, CLEVERER, MORE POSITIVE ways to gain it - for example, just ASKING if you've gone off him a little bit or if it's because you're under the weather, whatever... or just TELLING YOU, HONESTLY, 'Houston, I've been feeling like you don't love me as much lately' so that you can then obviously willingly respond with, 'What - NOOOOO! - are you bonkers - what makes you think THAT?!' etc., and get as quickly as possible to the bottom of why he believes that's the sad-making case and why he's mistaken on that score.

I guess at the end of the day it depends on what amount of reassurance you'll always be willing to give him, though, doesn't it. Why - do you feel that two-part apology text wasn't enough? Does HE tend to issue his apologies via text or have I missed something and he tends to actually phone or go to other greater lengths? Alternatively, do you believe there are unresolved past resentments in his Pandora's Box that are retrospectively making this latest faux pas of yours feel so much worse in his mind as thereby warrant so much more of an apologetic gesture on your part?

I mean, you didn't stab his granny with a knife, did you? So what do YOU think is the reason he's sulking overly prolonged-ly again? WHY do you feel you need to 'write him poetry' on FB? I mean, how is it NOT his fault you had no breakfast when he's the one who went and ate it without asking or replacing it like he usually does?

******

Look... Can you hack having a bloke who over-reacts, takes too much time in his little sulk cave every time, if we were to assume he WOULDN'T ever grow out of it as his trust in you grows greater and greater over time or, similarly, the pair of you DIDN'T ever meet a time when there wasn't much left to argue about? That, still, is your burning question to consider and decide over.

First time called crazy

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Our dept was locked due to strike in uni 2day.. I came there but nobody ws there i thor if i shud ask him whether he is there in uni i thot a while abt this aa we were sticking to no nudge policy but eventually i thot one text atleast shud b done to tell him that i am alone here may be he also needed alone tym wid me then when i txtd him " are you in uni ? I came here and nobody is here dept s locked" he didnt reply but in 2 mins his car stopped close to my feet where i was walking on the road to dept .. I sat in his car then i just lightly patted him on his face, said why arwnt u replying to my msgs, he only smiled. Then we went to dept had chit chat wid tchers had breakfast wid frds in cafe then we all went to recreation outside town , enjoyd sniwfall .. Then he dropd them to their van stops BUT dropped ME at my home !! Aftr them droping we two dint have any persnal talk in car just he ws lisning romantc songs in car then he ordered to pack food frm a restaurant bcoz aftr droping me had to go to his home town he asked me if he shud order one to pack for me too , i said no i m not really hungry.. Then ww went bak not a clear conversation, once or twice we had deep contacts :) nuthing else then said good bye

First time called crazy

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Aftr reachng home i txtd him that his new hair style looked sooper dpoper on him :)

BUT i dun c an apology coming from him, wat if he bcoms nornl without discusing this issue/wdout apologizing? How to make him realise HIS mistake as well at that point

First time called crazy

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(Crikey, so now the university is sulking? It must be contagious!)

"I came there but nobody ws there i thor if i shud ask him whether he is there in uni i thot a while abt this aa we were sticking to no nudge policy but eventually i thot one text atleast shud b done to tell him that i am alone here may be he also needed alone tym wid me"

Blah-blah-blah - NO, it's called, I couldn't wait another day to find out if he was no longer mad at me. That's the second time you've done that. You do it a third time and you'll have set a pattern whereby he never feels he has to come to you to signify he's finished bristling and to apologise so you'll agree to meet up, because you'll always 'come and get him'. Your bid not to suffer having to endure patience each time is going to end up your having made a rod for your own back if you don't cut that out. Because - look how instantly he turned up! That evidence proves that ALREADY he had been ready to see you and waiting to be summoned (you Tarzan, he Jane), whereas the ball had been in HIS court (because you'd served two apologies), meaning HE should have been the one to knock for YOU and ASK IF YOU WERE AGREEABLE TO SEEING HIM.

...the cheeky fecker. AND playing female-manipulating music. Pff... what is he like! And what are YOU like? What would have been so hard about having said something like, 'Well, I'm not sure I'm ready to be sat next to you in such close proximity because you haven't told me YOU'RE sorry and I don't see what's so darned hard about that if I can do it'...

"BUT i dun c an apology coming from him"

...in which case: No, course not. * Not a verbal one, anyway. Why would he need to when you'd, to all intents and purposes, knocked and summoned him without having WAITED until he HAD apologised?

*Him coming to 'rescue' you *was* an apology. A half-one...or bit of one. But a sneaky, unspoken one, hidden in the action. One where he doesn't have to accommodate the female need of getting the apology in the form THEY prefer and verbally say the actual sentance 'I am suh-...suh-...suh-... (ker-boom!)'. There again, saying that, one could equally say that he couldn't 'read' you and your mood properly from the text so couldn't resist coming to see for himself.

So all in all, it was half an apology and the other half his over-burning curiosity and need-to-know.

Had you followed instructions in waiting, you could have had BOTH. PROPERLY.

I suppose it's something that you got the "do-say" variety instead, given how he COULD have just ignored your text or texted back in a way that showed he was leaving you to it (e.g. Oh dear, s'pose you'll just have to go home again, then'). But, again, if you'd texted someone else instead of him, you could have had him contact and summon YOU.

I suggest that as soon as he next texts you to get together, you take that as your opportunity to ask something like, 'Yeah, I guess I would like to meet...only... I have to be honest - I'm having trouble with the fact that, having apologised to you not once but twice for my part, you seem to think you yourself have nothing of your own to say sorry for. Is that right or have I missed something?'. That or wait until you're on the date and THEN ask him (and if not satisfied because he makes some lame excuse, go cool on him and not let him touch or hug you or anything). After all, he can't act normal and like nothing's happened if you don't let him, can he.

Saying all of that (this is difficult with your poor text-spelling), I guess it may be that his invitation to pick you up some supper (a takeaway?) was his way of inviting himself to your place so's you could eat it together (in which case, he might then have worked up to his own apology)? I don't know, only you'd know. ? I mean, was he offering to pay for it as well?

First time called crazy

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sorry, deep eye contacts :)

First time called crazy

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ohh offcourse yes he was paying ,everytime ! whenever we are alone.

ALso sometimes when we are with frds each of us pay ours, or mostly he pays for all.(he is a generous buddy,i told u )

But no we were not having a lunch together as he had to rush to meet somebody ,somebody was calling him again and agian for some documents.

Yes i do want an apology from him and i understand he doesnt apologise verbally,rather mostly with actions,doing care type things... but i ll prefer tp listen him up on that and will say something like u mentioned,'I have to be honest - I'm having trouble with the fact that, having apologised to you not once but twice for my part, you seem to think you yourself have nothing of your own to say sorry for. Is that right or have I missed something?'

First time called crazy

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Noted.

Okay, so he was indeed offering to shout you the takeaway. Another 'I'm mostly over it' gesture and act of apology, again without having to drop his pride by spelling it out verbally.

Has he ever said the actual sentance, I'm sorry, or has it always been the do-it variety?

What documents?

And considering he's a uni student, how come he can afford to splash the cash with you and others?

First time called crazy

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I was posting normal statuses abt politics on my wall where he commented like this on my post

He: :-)
Long debate it is :-)

Me: Wish u realise that u dont need to hav a "long debate" everytime specifically wid ur partner .Sometimes u can AGREE too wid the person who is going to be ur no 1 ally in this long term parternship

First time called crazy

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Exact cell fone texts, i am pasting here for u

He : But don't forget that we're no more in relationship

Me : lol
Keep on ur words !!!

He: Yes,I will

Me : Good
I expect this from you, well done :)

He: Obviously, you should, specially after what you did

Me: to be honest - I'm having trouble with the fact that, having apologised to you not once but twice for my part, you seem to think you yourself have nothing of your own to say sorry for.??? ( i havent forgiven you for that YET, keep that in mind )

BUT you want to take shortcut , then take it, you are more than welcome to leave the relation ,who can stop somebdy who doesnt want to stay:)

First time called crazy

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Note : the above cell fone conversation started after my THAT reply on my fb post. ( he then sent me This text on my cell )

Ps befor that he was asking me random questns abt our group asignmnt in cell fone texts

First time called crazy

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Answer to ur questions:

Yes he says sorry but when he is in a light mood, not easy for men u know. Mostly he shows by action.( a practical man u can say)

Documents, as in not related to us, he is also much involvwd in his family business, he is eldest in home so he is also taking charge of everything at home, means some property documents, and he is also busy these days constructing a new house in his town, and aftr M.Sc he plans to start his own business.

And that continues with ur last questn, he is ths richest person in our class,means family background wise,also he is the right hand of his father ,he takes charge of accounts selling buyinh cars property etc. One day Before our this trip(hiking) where we got angry, he also offered me to continuw my studies he sd ill pay ur fees if u want to study. I sd no i want a break. He sd wenever u join nex tym i wil pay as u r my responabiluty.Also i want to tell u that on our farewell party i was given the title of "decent girl wid polite nature" and he was given "moody guy" by juniors ( he didnt com to party so i had receivd his title and hid it wid me so our frds dun come to know i told him howevee that i havent told them) a protective wife typ :-p

First time called crazy

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Those transcripts were gold-dust, thanks!

If like he claims yours and his relationship is over then why wasn't he DOING "over" and NOT posting Likes and comments on your page until (no-brainer) the time came when you and he had abstained from contact enough to make reconciliation as just friends even possible? Not to mention his almost instantly turning up in the car to 'rescue' you (particularly as you weren't even 'marooned' without any way of making your own way home) like would only a boyfriend... plus the assignment-related texts (ask someone else!). ERROR, DOES NOT COMPUTE (eezfullash*t).

But if he's telling you it's over whilst making indications behaviourally to the contrary - or even just telling you it's over but wanting to wave himself constantly in front of your nose like some unobtainable carrot as a way to rub salt into the wound - then he is even more emotionally manipulative than I first thought (- everyone is emotionally manipulative but it's always about *degrees*). He is CRUEL, SPITEFUL AND VINDICTIVE, is what he is.

"not easy for men u know."

No, really? :-p But if they find it THAT incredibly hard, as ridiculously hard as he's making it out to be, then they shouldn't apply for nor accept a 'job offer' as demands that ability in the job description, IN THE FIRST PLACE.

"Me: [to be honest - I'm having trouble with the fact that, having apologised to you not once but twice for my part, you seem to think you yourself have nothing of your own to say sorry for.???] ( i havent forgiven you for that YET, keep that in mind ) BUT you want to take shortcut , then take it, you are more than welcome to leave the relation ,who can stop somebdy who doesnt want to stay:)"

Your own-words addendum: SASSY HIGH FIVE! And now I see why he scrapes the mid- and post-argument barrel by doing this negative over-reacting and over-protracted flouncing and sulking nonsense. Because compared to you he's a lightweight. And compared to him, you're not nearly as emotionally affectable by him/this relationship as he is because you're (befittingly) a few steps behind him (because he started the wooing, meaning, you're always in the respondent position) (quite right).

You ARE a bit on the cool side to be honest, from what I've seen. But he could just as easily spend a mere ONE TENTH of the energy required for this ridiculous, drawn-out behaviour, WARMING YOU BACK UP instead.

Ah, but he's got his eye on the even busier future, hasn't he. If he can shut you up now and forever, complaints wise, then this protracted campaign of his has been energy well spent.

Yup, this is Treat Her Mean To Keep Her Keen (or in your case, Make Her KeenER and however much gag her). He *does* want blood. Or the two certainly when things turn suddenly negative (him using the climate as his opportunistic cover tool). He thinks that putting an engagement ring on your finger doesn't just enhance bonding thus the amount of juice you thereafter give out, but actually CUTS OUT a lot of the requisite hard work involved between engagement and actually walking up that aisle. It's not just wooing that they have to do, it's self-asserting the right and healthy way including when it comes to resolving conflicts as quickly, sensibly and maturely as possible. In other words, he's trying to get out of regularly having to hoover by ripping up the entire carpet plus underlay, section by section.

Er, NO. A house with no carpet, just concrete floors, is a COLD ONE.

That doesn't mean you yourself aren't ever at fault where concerns the argument issue. It means he adds fat to the fire instead of applying the fire-extinguisher - while you're busy trying to apply your own extinguisher (thereby undoing your efforts). That's called, own worst enemy.

And here is why: "Documents, as in not related to us, he is also much involvwd in his family business, he is eldest in home so he is also taking charge of everything at home, means some property documents, and he is also busy these days constructing a new house in his town, and aftr M.Sc he plans to start his own business."

He is RIDICULOUSLY over-stretched, spreading his energy FAR too thin, even were he older and mature enough to cope! Hence wants you to be low-maintenance. Well, TOUGH.

He is also - "the right hand of his father" - incapable of handling what is basically more power than he can handle (because with power comes RESPONSIBILITY), particularly given the high value nature of the business 'products', meaning he cannot differentiate between a staff member/minion and what's supposed to be his EQUAL STATUS AND RIGHTS FIANCEE, meaning, if you disagree over anything as constitutes you disrespecting his "authoritah" (ref Cartman from South Park :-p), his ego can't take it...because it's STUCK IN AN ALL-POWER, NO TIME FOR *IN-DEPTH/COMPLICATED* RESPONSIBILITY, GROOVE, unable to flex between situations and contexts as those things dictate. (Sense?)

Something is going to have to give. If this is also partly a cry for help then it's futile because you can't cut anything out of his workload for him, can you? I think, therefore, he is stress-overloaded and TAKING IT OUT ON YOU... because you constantly USED TO BE so basically instantly forgiving each time (= low-maintenance).

You're not his kicking cat and if he feels you need taming - neither a horse. So he should toddle off and find himself a meek and mild little thing with low behavioural expectations (in terms of coming from him)... the type that deludes herself with, 'Awww, but that's just MEN for you'. PFF - tell that to their happy, respected and deferred to clients, the ones with the constantly damp bum-holes!

I'm surprised his father hasn't just gone all out and sent him up all the local chimneys to give them a sweep! Silly man.

Throwing money around (ref his offer re your continued studies) is NOT taking and handling responsibility. It's just throwing money around, which any idiot can do. So he can't just embrace responsibility only whenever the sun's out; it has to be done in cloud or rain & thunder too. That's what he lacks. Because he's too used to getting his own way.

Solution: You need to stick to your self-respectful guns so that he realises his choice is only between continuing the relationship without trying to get you to sacrifice your equal rights or losing the relationship (and being incapable of managing any replacement to any degree of female satisfaction) altogether. That's his right, not trying to get you to bend over backwards until you paralyse yourself just so that he can continue to pretend he has NOT bitten off or accepted more than he can chew.

"a protective wife typ :-p"

[1] You're not his wife yet (no work, no corresponding perk).
[2] Where's his protection towards YOU? The emotional variety? Answer - nowhere save for when it suits him (when it's sunny).

Application: He's now dared say (claimed as a bluff) in writing that it's over not once but TWICE. Be seen to take it seriously. Make him live it as a reality...let's see how he likes having to put his money where his spouty mouth is.

ZERO CONTACT FROM NOW ON.

Ignore anything he says or does. Do not take his calls. If he bombards, remind him that HE said it's over ergo Over is exactly how you're behaving.

Let's slap the idiot out of him once and for all.

This is now stand-off. But I imagine he's already close to cracking because, you see, when mummy puts stairgates up, Little Jimmy, if fiddling with their locks yields no success, starts, in desperation, to bang his little fists and feet against them. If that still yields no success, that's when his LAST-DITCH EFFORT of throwing his whole body numerous times against them commences.

He's "said" it's over. That's him throwing his whole weight against the new boundary, hoping to tire YOU out so that you'll finally remove them.

I hope you have the b*lls to agree to this, out of the realisation that you've no other course of action open to you save for finishing this relationship yourself or, worse, giving in, only to have to go through this whole rigmerole time and time again until YOU'RE exhausted and roll over (down next to the front door with WELCOME painted on your forehead)?

(BTW, When Mr S tried this 'act up until I exhaust her into submission' tack, way back when he was overloading himself, I ended up unceremoniously chucking him out, whereby he had to WALK to the airport (24 miles) in order to catch a flight back to France. Kid you not. He was lucky he still had his clothes on at the time. :-p Message: We all get overloaded and stressed but that does NOT give anyone carte-blanche to take it out on ones nearest and dearest (until you've eventually worn them down into the ground and they die prematurely of whatever stress-induced illness) - HAVE A BIT OF SELF-CONTROL LIKE THE REST OF US HAVE TO. He then realised my patience and understanding did indeed have a limit. He still sulks A BIT, but not to the extent worth mentioning, only VERY occasionally (yep, if coming with some bug, or whatever else is sapping his energy or denting his trust and confidence). Because that's the crux here: no human is perfect and even NON cat-kickers succumb once in a while, meaning, it's about firmly re-establishing the *degree* you or anyone could happily tolerate (but especially you). People can treat you badly only if you LET them - which means, let them escape the consequences. But first you do have to identify, via a bit of experimentation, what their idea of bad consequence IS. You (and I) have done that, now. He obviously can't abide being ignored so - there's your weapon, all spelled out for you (how kind of him ;-)).)

And letting them includes their feeling SAFE ENOUGH TO. Because I tell ya: repeated behaviour sets the tone, meaning, whereas normally you might never take your moodies out on someone else, if your 'counterpart' has been doing it for long enough, that makes it VERY hard not to 'think', "F**kit, he does it and nothing bad happens to HIM so - I'm going to enjoy that liberty as well!' And THEN where are you? Answer: low standards city. And after that? SPLATVILLE. Howzat for 'nothing bad'?

This is the quality of your future you're battling for, not just future married life, because your marital home life affects EVERYTHING AND EVERYONE YOU TOUCH.

You've TRIED the being reasonable route (attempting to get him to calm down and discuss) and it's not helped or helped fast enough. Now it's hard-ball time, to see if you truly are a match for him or whether he would wipe the floor with you forevermore if you still went there.

Underneath all of this, you must realise, is him testing you out - testing your strength - to (as said earlier on) see whether you'll be his secret, behind-closed-doors hero and motivator as much as he yours. If you pass, he'll suddenly have new-found respect for you as well as feel safe THE RIGHT WAY.

Is the otherwise more predominant lovely side worth the energy of sustained determination and endurance this is going to require from you? Or would you rather just dump the dud and either remain available for what I call the Automatic Upgrade or, indeed, give him a second chance if he goes away and then comes back having experienced an epiphany (hence himself becomes the AU)?

That 'who can stop someone' comment of yours was the PERFECT place to go No Contact from.

What are your thoughts and how do you feel?

First time called crazy

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Agreed no contct now. I m ok and know he is trying to emotnally manipulate me but no use. I ll behav as if he is nomore my bf from now on

First time called crazy

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Nor your friend for now. Right? He can't even have a lick to keep him going!

Nada. Zip. Zilch. Zero. *Zeriously*

First time called crazy

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Merry christmas :-)

So mr S used to do too hmm u were clever at dealing him :-)

We have holidays till monday,strike,christmas etc

First time called crazy

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Yes hr has behavd cruelly becoz despite me telling him several times abt my illness he didnt give a damn

First time called crazy

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Today is my moms budday as well , he liked the pic of me and her ( i wishinh her buday

One serious problem as always, he keeps many of my things with him, he has the printed reslts of our class of all semesters wid him which i need to take from him i need to apply as the last date will end in a week.. Now i dun know what to do, i have talked to my best frd (our mutual girl friend) that she asks him day aftr tomorow to bring them wid him from hometown, becoz if he left them there it will be much problematic for me in the whole process, is it alryt of her to convey my msg indirectly?

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He is calling me , i am not picking

First time called crazy

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He called ne 5 tymes.. I havent picked .. I ll txt him that u said its over but still i havent txtd m waiting to let him panick more

First time called crazy

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I txtd him no reply but callinh me again and again , my fone was busy on other number.. Now wen he ll call i will tell him on fone that u wantd it to be over its ur happines wat else u want

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See his stupid text

(I was calling you to talk about study's..
I think that we can still talk !)

I havent replied nor i think i should.

First time called crazy

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Why would he call 8 times just for stdys? Am i some scholar?

Lame msg and that y i am saying to u that i dint reply nor do i think i shud, wats ur take on it?

First time called crazy

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Merry Turkey-Day to you, too! :-)

"So mr S used to do too hmm u were clever at dealing him :-)"

Yes, but I'm a lot older than you. You're in fact doing far better than, I'm sure, I would have, had I been in a relationship with him in my "yoof". I'd no doubt have dumped him the very first time he flounced off, never mind second and third. (The rebound ex behaved like that as well, but, not being as incredibly in-love with him as I am Mr S, I was far less tolerant - no doubt because his good side and qualities were utter pants compared to Mr S's.) Good job I didn't, then, because I'm reaping the massive, MASSIVE rewards now. The love and lust is just getting more and more and more huge and intense with every passing year, and the need for disagreements still lessening both in frequency, duration and strength/volume.... have now started finishing each other's sentances or literally speaking each other's thoughts (shpookayyy!).

In fact, this is far more common a clashes scenario than you'd suppose. A LOT more. It's just not the sort of thing people like to admit. Because it always sounds so utterly childish, I suppose. But who said adults didn't behave like children from time to time?

Your chap is *refusing* to give a damn about your symptoms - diff/all the diff.

His still having many of your possessions just proves further that he's talking hot-air nonsense re he and you being over. It's called, keeping the bridges back to you intact. But if there's something you need urgently, YES, do ask a mutual friend to play two-way go-between and bring it to you (and vice versa anything he reckons he can't live without). Good thinking, missus! You're in the zone! :-) In fact, reading all of that refusal to play the silly game - you're doing BRILLIANTLY! And I agree you should let him stew and panic.

If he refuses to text but is calling then obviously there are things he wants to say that are too long and complicated to write AND he no doubt wants to be able to soft-soap you via the sound of his voice. It sounds like he's ALREADY panicking, wouldn't you say? And using any excuse... Yes, why would he call you 8 times in one day just to talk about schooling?

My take: it's up to you how long you want to keep him with this giant firework up his bum, really. An idea could be to take one of the calls, keeping your voice sweet but cool, just to find out what he has to say, etc., and then saying, 'NO THANK-YOUP, NOT RIGHT NOW!' and gently putting the receiver down, the minute he starts to get silly again or proves the call were just for 'dangling the carrot' purposes (carrot being him). Or not. Really, the longer you can reasonably leave it, the better.

This is his bed that he made. So he can lie on it.

First time called crazy

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A severe earthquake jolted in our country 6.5 rectire scale
I txtd all my frds including him if they are fine,( also txtd his sis is sh me n evrybdy at hom was fine she is my frd she also asked m if all of us at home were fyn she told me all woke up from
Skip at this tym of nyt after the jolts but not him) i know he ll rep m in the morning,

God safe us all :-(

First time called crazy

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***A severe earthquake jolted in our country 6.5 rectire scale I txtd all my frds including him if they are fine,( also txtd his sis is she n evrybdy at hom was fine she is my frd she also asked me if all of us at home were fyn
she told me all woke up from Sleep at this tym of nyt after the jolts but not him) i know he ll rep me in the morning,
God safe us all :-(

First time called crazy

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Wow! Glad you're okay! No, that's fine, you texting him when it's an extenuating circumstance of this magnitude.

What happened, what was it like?

In fact, come on over to the 'alone at Xmas' thread and tell me there!

First time called crazy

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Forgot to add: Also, he'll get to know you texted absolutely everyone, not just him, including, note, his sister. Hence he won't be capable of kidding himself (- desperate is as desperate does, or in this case, jumpingly concludes) it had just been a great excuse on your part to contact him.

First time called crazy

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I think he needs some more treatment, until tomorow evening i dun hav any plans to talk to him on fone as i have to go out iwid family, and wat his that texts guides me is that he is missing me and wants contact in one way or another, like u said licking, to kesp it going... He shud better pay pff this time for WHAT he said (over,ah how dare he ? )

U said u d have dumped, hmm I am a bit diffrnt kinda person, i am strong but not to that extent, its v difficult for me to dump smbdy ( i fear i can mever do this after a commitmwnt ) as i get overly attached to things places ppl etc .. And the second reason for this high level of loyalty is that i am a huge idealist. I dun finde ppl v much attractive till they are really some much different/special) i am v much beauty conscious plus a filmy typ man is what i want :-p and that is the reason i accepted his proposal and is loyal to him, he has proved his sincerity over times wid me and my family, only one frd in uni knows of our relation and he often binds my shoe laces, takes care of me infronta her :-) ( i like that) but as i am worried abt reputitiion and havent allowd to tell to other frds so infronta them he is normal means teases me etc just as frd. Anyways point was that i donot believ in DUMPING but do blv in LET GO becoz relations madw of force dun last longer ( however in this case i am quite sure he dun mean it but have to teach him a leason so that he doesnt dare say this one more time :-) )

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That's the spirit!

WARNING, though (because it looks like he's no snail, this one!):

The object of this is not to gain you more share of the power in the relationship. It's you taking back a portion of power that belonged to you but which he greedily took from you. You don't want this present recouping of power going to your head or you'll end up, the pair of you, in the exact same boat, but just where the roles are reversed. So don't hold out for longer than you believe in your heart of hearts is just and fair and 100% necessary for dissuading him once-and-for-all not to sulk for such silly lengths of time either genuinely or deliberately-as-a-ploy (as if admission of powerlessness, i.e. demonstrably claiming no other fairer weapons/tools exist) is somehow NOT childish for a fact, but "manly". If you hold out for TOO long, you're being despotically cruel. If you hold out for not long ENOUGH, you're being inadvertently cruel (and wasteful for all this effort so far). Whereas.. the name of this game (were it a game) is, Cruel to be kind.

I advise that HE DOES NOT GET TO TALK TO YOU UNLESS HE SHOWS THAT THE VERY FIRST WORDS HE IS WILLING TO UTTER OR TEXT ARE, FOR EXAMPLE: "I'm sorry too...And I didn't mean it when I said we were over, I was just angry, still". Or something too clearly hinting at it (allowing the rest to follow naturally once face-to-face and ensuring that it does).

********

Still, it's good to hear you getting self-righteously angry. You've earned it.

But we're not complaining about the 'teasing like a friend when incognito' scenario, we're complaining about how he reacts once the actual argument is fully underway - the flouncing off and sulking for dayszzzzzz.

So no need to panic like that (listing all his good points). I KNOW he's an angel at all other times. You only need to dump this insecure/controlling, mean streak of his, not the whole man.

But even if you did reach a stage where you needed to dump him over it (this point, hypothetically) - you could even SAY that (letter): "I'm not dumping "you", but I am forced to dump that nasty, manipulative little streak of yours that surfaces during the close and aftermath of any disagreements and altercations ...because it really is insufferable and, frankly, quite traumatic. Nobody could live with that for very long and stay sane. You are a salad from Heaven, you truly are. But you have a slug in your leaves, one that makes the whole salad seem slimy even though it isn't,...is Heavenly like I said. Not sure what else to do. More sorry than you would perhaps imagine. Be happy."

It's not what you do, it's the way that you do it. If there's true love in that man for you, a letter like that really shouldn't fail to have him thinking reeeeally long and hard and self-critically (unless the man has a personality disorder like Narcissism) and then experiencing a giant PING! and running on back to you with cap in hand. But this is just FYI, general chat, at this juncture. Because from what I've seen so far: he uses sulking/the (not very) silent treatment because...[drum-roll]..... it's something he knows would hurt HIM (ergo you too).

So that's why all the phone and text chasing. Because when he's on the end of it he can't handle it.

He's probably using 'but we're friends so I can' excuse. But, seriously, what friend calls 8 times in one day like that, LOL. If a friend DID, you'd be having to ask them, 'Er... About your behaviour lately.... Forgive me for asking, but, do you fancy me or are in-love with me or something?'.

Right? ("Right!")

Taste Of Own Medicine for the gentleman and his Teddy at Table 4, please Waiter!

Don't lose faith. Remember, it was just an argument. And that's ALL it was and should have stayed. It wasn't YOU who turned it into a melodrama having acted like it was over then twice actually said it was. The MINUTE you sent that second, better apology/ending to prior apology, he should have been STRAIGHT on the phone, apologising back. LIKE A MANNNNNN-UH.

Right? ("Right!")

So what other choice do you have anyway.

And anyway, you NEED a wee break from him, you really do. This is you recuperating...getting up off your knees (part-time only, granted) and standing back up to full height again (and having a well-needed stretch). Can he hack a future wife who's in this respect is as near-as-damnit as tall as him? Or does he want a midget? A Polly Pocket? Someone who, rather than face a melodrama of a fight, says yes, sir, no, sir,...and he doesn't even hear her because he's fallen asleep ...OUT OF BOREDOM. :-p

Neither he nor anyone can have (as in always keep) their cake AND eat it. No es possible.


First time called crazy

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He rep to my txt in morn asked if i ws fyn . I replied fine he said good. No msg from then on frm both sydes.

First time called crazy

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No text or call from
Him the whole day, wondering wat he is up to :x

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"He rep to my txt in morn asked if i ws fyn . I replied fine he said good. No msg from then on frm both sydes."

He didn't really want to know if you were fine, he was hoping you would leap onto his excuse and run with it - as in, start a whole, long conversation. Yet you didn't. Good for you! He knows how to initiate an apology, he's a big boy now.

Here's what he's up to:

He has to hammer a nail into the wall, now (get you back without losing face). He's picked up a banana and tried to hit the nail with it. Hasn't worked. So he's tried hitting it with the banana HARDER. Still hasn't worked. One more try. Nope. Now he puts down the (knackered) banana and picks up his shoe, thinking he can use it's heel. Nope, that doesn't work either. Try it a good few more times ("I will not be beaten!"). Shoe ends up knackered as well. So he puts that back down and tries the (now very mushy) banana again.

That 'are you ok?' text was the now very mushy banana.

Sooner or later he'll have to admit defeat and go and get the damn HAMMER, like he should have from the start.

Right now he's back in his cave, racking his poor little brains about what else other than the damn hammer he might possibly employ. He might pick his fist (start trying to be mean and upset you) before he finally goes and gets the hammer. Ignore, ignore, ignore.

Give Einstein time to work it all out... LOL. He will.

THAT is what he's up to. His behaviour so-far shows you have nothing whatsoever to worry about. You just carry on with having some fun and relative mental peace and quiet; don't waste it by worrying completely unnecessarily. That's for HIM to do.

First time called crazy

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Yes soulmate its a tough life and getting attached to people really make u weak, i am missing him but i hVe cmplete faith over my spirit and God who will turn out things to be better in my favour..
I need a break, yes
I need to stand up, yes
I need to stand on my knees,yes
He hasnt come online on fb nor any contct after that last message, may b he z in vlg or may b he is waiting thT she ll again contact , but it wont hPpn becoz u r rite , till he txts an apology or atleast an admission that the over thing was just a mistKe on his part , he doesnt deserve to talk to me, not as frds even.. N i hav askd my frd to talk abt my documents frm him ( this is another hint to him that I DO NOT WANT TO hAVE A DIRECT CONTACT WID HIM) if its over then he shud feel wat doez thT mean.. Actually !

First time called crazy

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Einstein, ha ha ha

Loved ur last reply .

U say it so right wth this example of banana and hammer lol

Ok seeing ur intellect i enjoy talking stuf wid u

Ok so letme tell u somthing which is in my heart, we both wana get maryd to each other but i have a fear: i fear of responsibility : of husband, of home and especially KIDS ( i mean i am not a cruel person but i fear from that too big responsbility which i have to take 1 day or another. To raise them being a mother, to bring up a child when u urself r half a child-me seeing my emotional immaturities and emotional traumas i go-as in missing someone getting obsessed or ill etc- how will i cope wid this aftr marriage? I think he doesnt fear marriage as i do .. Even i talk to him several tymes that we d have one kid only to which he agree :-p and we will send him to boarding throughout.. Sometimes he says to me that i will bring up our child :( why u get so afraid from that responsibility ? :(

First time called crazy

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(Get OFF your knees, onto your feet again, you mean.)

No, again, regardless of where geographically he and his mobile might be at the moment, he's wondering what on earth to try next after having been able to gauge from your very curt 'Fine' that you are refusing to pander to his issues any more or behave like you need the relationship more than he does (pff!) by chasing him to get him back despite it was his wholly needless decision alone to have flounced off like a sulky little girl, rather than simply having requested a reasonable Time-Out period followed by a discussion to examine what you both did wrong and how to avoid repeating it ever again.

He's invited no discussion as a means for admitting his part. All he's banging on about is what you did to HIM, as if what worse he did to YOU isn't something worth your being bothered about (- gimmie the gun!). And if as his now-supposedly-needless contacting implies, he could make his admission and/or apology only once finally in the same room as you, then he could MORE easily - not less! - do an initial little taster via text, PARTICULARLY when he's already had ample opportunity(zuh).

He doesn't WANT his flounce-and-sulk tack to be removed from the deck (yet). Because it serves him and always has (has permanently distracted girlfriends'/whomevers' attentions away from his need to say an outright sorry). Now this tack's FAILING, he's upped his nasty ante (from 'this relationship hangs in the balance' to 'it's actually over'), yet completely contradicting it in how he's chasing and nudging and trying to get a litmus reading over whether your mood has softened. By softened, I mean, whether you've started to crack under the pressure of missing him and going into grieving due to believing his ruse about you and he being over unless you act quick, such as, by desperately grabbing hold of his hand as and when he nudges you in order to draw him in.

Basically, he is trying to provoke you into wanting to forgive him without meting out any punishment (in the form of insisting he change that fight behaviour), by getting you to concede that there WAS no crime committed. Except by you.

Pff, 'done to him'. You unwittingly made a pencil scribble on the, at that point, nicely clean relationship wall. Instead of confronting you to find out why and ask that you erase it, he made an even bigger scribble in childish retaliation. You got the eraser and rubbed yours out, thinking he'd follow grown-up suit. Instead, he threw the eraser in the bin and made another, EVEN BIGGER scribble. AND NOW ANOTHER. Scribble tally sheet: You: 0, Him: 4. So how on EARTH can he try to make out he's the poor wickle victim to your bloody-minded criminal? Ludicrous!

I'll tell you what your SO-CALLED latest crime is that he's in a sweat about. And it's not even regarded as a crime by healthy, reasonable, self-respecting individuals: not automatically forgiving him free-of-charge.

If this so-called "top executive" supposedly can't even apologise like a man then equally supposedly, not only is his father very foolish and short-sighted for having handed such important reins over to someone who's shown himself to be, the minute the going gets sticky, nothing but A TODDLER wearing a full-grown man's suit (that swamps him), but, also, neither is he adult enough to get to enjoy yet another (emotionally-)mature person's privilege called, serious romantic relationship, when it demands as part and parcel the adult quality of BEING ABLE TO APOLOGISE WHEN ONE IS SO PATENTLY IN THE WRONG.

Bet he does apologise to clients, though, whenever the need arises. And instantly. If he didn't, those clients would soon f**k off to whatever other company that knows the right way to to treat people on whom ones financial survival depended. Oh, so, clients and money are more important and more worthy of respect from him than YOU, are they? Money and power are going to nurse him when he's ill, produce and raise his babies, and hold his hand on his death-bed, are they?

Unless he can demonstrate otherwise by stepping up to full adult calibre, and be damned quick about it now(!), you'd end up marrying a child.

You shouldn't have to be the one to teach him this bog-standard code of person-to-person etiquette. Unfortunately, though, it would seem you have to...because the persons whose earlier job it was FAILED TO.

Oh, and I know it was me who secretly behind-scenes encouraged you to make your apology. But HE doesn't know that. And anyway, you could have turned around and said to me, 'No! Don't wanna! Not gonna!'. You weren't being childish, therefore, you were just confused at that precisely point about who'd been culpable for what and at which point in the story.

Your conscience is clean. His is not. That relentlessly nagging mental itch is HELL. Not to mention being without your no. 1 loved-one for so long on top of it. Why, then, is he so hell-bent on putting himself through hell instead of simply climbing out via the ladder that sits there lit in Neon? There's his burning question.

First time called crazy

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The answer, by the way, is this: he's angry at HIMSELF...and is using that anger to ruin his own primary source of happiness. Self-harm.

It's himself he hates, not you. Not something he'd admit, though. Easier to kid himself his anger is caused by you and has nothing to do with personal issues on his part. Because then it's not him who has a mental job to have to knuckle down and do.

He's lazy (because he's over-stretched) (or he's over-stretched because he's lazy?).

Something clearly has to give or get cut out. If he lets that be you, he's his own worst enemy. You don't need someone like that... they'd be a constant liability.

He won't though. He can't even stick to his own silent treatment/ex-boyfriend pretence. Save for today (big deal). (That won't last.)

First time called crazy

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Ya he cant resist for more than a while.

Hope u read my post of 16:33 as well

First time called crazy

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Sorry, not ignoring your last-but-one post, have just run out of time. But listen, if you can learn to handle this guy, handling a baby then toddler then kid will be a doddle! And anyway, you wouldn't BE so scared if you thought you had an equal or even more mature and capable TEAM-MATE.

First time called crazy

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Alrite :-)

First time called crazy

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tomorrow is our first day after holidays ... hopefully he will come too ....kindly tell me how should i behave if he tries to meet or contact me tomorrow in uni...?

First time called crazy

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Your chap is *refusing* to give a damn about your symptoms - diff/all the diff

elaborate it pls

First time called crazy

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He called me one time today i dint pik he then called my frd (mutual and female) said that she s not piking my cols.
She sd she d b sleeping (though she knows my
Point :p ) he sd she s sleeping frm
One week? Then he sd u both shud send me more work on assignmnt. He sd he waa in vlg no net there (so i was rightly guessing )

First time called crazy

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He did not come to uni today.. I had to say to
My frd to ask him abt our assignmnt and the results which i need... I m getting irritated .. First he took assgnmnt from
Me and now he is getting absent nd saying her u do it urself .. I mean wat the hell ... Why did he take responsbiliyy if he cant do it himself.. Anyways i have thot i ll wait for a couple of days if he didnt submit till day aftr 2mrow ill sbmit it myself ( waiting that he DOES HIMSELF- a grp assgnmnt -not only my responsblty huh) also this week is last working after that we d hav holidays

First time called crazy

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now he has called our other mutual frd (now male) when we were in uni... he asked if there was a class and wats happening in uni.i dont know what other questns he had asked.Frd was replying wid yes/no.then asked will u come tomorrow? i dunnow wat he replied *hopefully yes* becoz he has missed todays class as well...

my one other female frd is scolding me for not piking his calls ... she says u didnt give him opportunity to apologize... i sd he could do in text as well i think he is calling just to stay in contact

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I am so embarsd... He has told his sis that i dun pik his cols .. She called me she was wid him in car she sd are u angry i sd no she sd then y dun u both talk i sd there is nothing like that.. She is such a nice lady and i got so
Embarassd
When she was pleadinh me to tak to her... I am literally feeling sp strange .. He is panicking so
Much that he is using our frds and his fmly to have a reconcilation ... I am
Confused becoz his family doesnt kno full story and i dont want them to know... His sis sd he is missing u so
Much and sd that u hav to pik his col i sd ok.. Then she sd he is asking details abt ur moms dr and the hospital in which she got operated... I told her .. Then i consoled her that dun wry n pray ,evrything is alrite btwn us
On the other hand 5 mins aftr her call
My mutual female frd called me and said that he called her now (when i was going bk home from uni) and asked same details of dr etc from her as well .. Wat he is up to ? I dont know
However i am convinced that he made his sis talk to me to let me know that nothing is over ... But i want to hear from him Directly .. He is shy or is not able to gather words to talk to me , dun know,, he has to gather sone strength anyways

First time called crazy

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he came to uni today... didnt talk to me ... he just kept himself wid his male frd,,,

Bullshit,,,! :p (if he thinks i ll be summoning him.. he has to take an initiative himself (is it so hard to apologize? ughh then better off)

i am really getting angry at this behaviour... he z taking so much time to hold a hammer! (now may be trying to use the hard way-doing me upset by NOT SAYING ANYTHING)

First time called crazy

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1. If this is a group assignment, of which you and your mutual friend are part, on whose cooperation you both rely, and he isn't, then he's holding his contribution to ransom in order to force you to talk to him.

2. He's refusing to show he cares, like he normally does, because he's mad at you and wants to scare you into believing he no longer cares or suddenly cares less because of you and how you're refusing to interact with him. It's a panic tactic.

3. He's not been coming into uni because of the usual (Damp Pillow-itis), and to deliberately worry you, and because if he did, you'd both corner him about his portion of the group assignment.

4. "he asked if there was a class and wats happening in uni.i dont know what other questns he had asked"

Yes you do. Ones about you (subtly, whilst trying to sound nonchalant).

5. "my one other female frd is scolding me for not piking his calls ... she says u didnt give him opportunity to apologize... i sd he could do in text as well i think he is calling just to stay in contact"

GOOD FOR YOU! And that's 100% true.

6. He clearly is incredibly desperate if he'd even get his sister to come to his aid! So why, then, doesn't he just do what he knows needs to be done (apologise)? We know why, don't we. He'd rather stick needles in his eyes than have to say to YOU of all people, 'I'm suh-...suh....'. This is all emotional blackmail-style AVOIDANCE tactics.

Tough. Won't work. Nor should it. Tell outsiders simply that the problem going on between you and he is strictly between you and he, thank-you anyway for your concern. If pressed, tell them simply that he majorly owes you an apology but is refusing to give one, instead trying to solicit help with avoiding it by instead chipping at your resolve.

But was does 'pik his col' mean? (Less of the text talk; use longhand, please.)

7. Assuming he's telling them (or telling only his side and version) - why would that matter to you? Have you done anything wrong? Have you left any mess without having cleaned it up already? Nope. And so, even if he does tell a self-flattering story, people are not stupid. They'll see from your refusal to speak to him that he must be telling them fibs.

8. Yup. B*llsh*t. He spends days and days trying to get you to talk to him and, because you don't, despite he knows why (because you spelled it out and because evidently this other mutual friend knows and would have reminded him), because you won't talk to him when HE wants you to, he now thinks he's punishing you for that.

Yes. IS IT SO HARD JUST TO SAY HE'S SORRY AND IN A WAY THAT SHOWS HE KNOWS EXACTLY WHAT HE DID WRONG AND MUSTN'T REPEAT? What would he do if you were married with kids and he accidentally hurt one of them, e.g. off-balanced them as ended up with their bumping their head hard against a wall and bursting into hysterical crying? Try any trick in the book rather than apologise to him/her? Tell them it was THEIR fault? Great. Great lesson to those future adults, eh. (*not*)

Yes, he likes that squishy banana doesn't he. Told ya he was Cheetah. ;-) But, yes, correct again - now he's trying the heel of his shoe. (I wonder how many goes with THAT he'll try?)

You, on the other hand, are doing GREAT! So stop doubting yourself every step of the way. Seriously - Gold star!

First time called crazy

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By piCking col she meant why dont i respond to his calls.he told her that she wont piCk mine so u should call.Anywatys i tried to be as neutral as i could infronta her.

hope u meant ,by longghand,to write here in detail? (correct me if understood this line wrong)
Each day new happenings :( he came early morning completed assignmnts and gave it to teachers ( earlier day my friend texted him that if u r NOT ABLE to do then MEE will do and he in retaliation did it faster in morning )- however after giving assignmnts to teachers he rushed towards bus some classfellows asked him where are u going?its ur exam! he said i am not feeling well... i thought he might be saying it just casually but when he didnt give paper it really shook us hard because it was a very important exam, even his male friend also left paper in between and went somewhere ( may be taking him to hospital etc) i got worried called him and his friend both didnt reply my calls and texts (uptill now-right now i am in uni -daytime) ... first i tried to be insensitive like he was during my illness but i dont know what my heart was worrying so much that i contacted them,i hope he gets well soon.

he is panicking so much that i doubt he has started to SELF-HARM ( u were right).his big time ego is killing him inside but he is not able to utter those three words.

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Later he replied to my girl friend that i wasnt able to write at that time it was lil fever dun u ppl worry..but he didnot reply me ..Later when i called him his friend picked fone and said u dont come to hosp he ll be fine and come back
In a while he told me that he had some ultrasound... .
I texted him this
(Get well soon
Do share the progress with me
Take care of yourself please)
Later his frd asked if i was in uni (may b because they were coming back) i said no i
M home now.he said hs tests r clear.i evening i called him i thot he d b alone now i wanted to ask abt his health but again his frd picked fone i got so irritated i said when will u go home? After 5 mins again number shined on screen ,it was that frd who had called frm my fiances num,he asked smthing abt ppr and then he said which really furiated me he said "dont irritate him now,he is going outa statiom" i said u shut up dont come between us and i put down fone.
See what this shows abt human nature ( if this was asked by my bf that say this to her) -see the moment i started to sympathise he started to be OVERCONFiDENT..

However i am really mad and emotional rigjht now that why he asked our mutual male frd to respond in such a way.. I want him to text and say that dun show our frds and family that there is something rong between us -wat u say should i text him telling this right now or not? If u r online kindly do tell this

First time called crazy

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I texted him this no at night

" Listen-i didnt want to talk to u after wat u had done .. i was just worried calling to ask abt ur illness ( though u left me alone when i was ill)
but u r making things diffucult for me by not understanding a FEW RULES- we have some respect and status in front of others-DO NOT TELL Our families and frieends about whats hapning in between-u are showing Ur sis smthing is rong btwn us-however she often asks me and i never tell her-she is also like my family i cant hurt her.so u also pls be careful from now on - also this is last month in uni so i dont want any sort of repu issue-
Just ACT in front of our family and frds as everything is normal-and if they ask u say everythings is good..pls ..
Nd if there is anything imp,can say directly to me ..tc n bye"

I didnt expect any reply and this is OKAY.

On other hand he called our mutual female friend (whom
He told that he waa in hosp) now and said that what is my mistake? What did i do ? She was the one who wasnt piking my col? He sd that i ll tell u whole story tomorrow.

I hav asked her about it, and i have advised her not to give him the slightest clue that she knows anything.just listen to his stupid story and if he says again that she doesnt pick then say that MEE told me this only that i wasnt picking call because he said its over !

First time called crazy

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he also told her in same call that i asked him(frd) to tell u ppl that i am going out of station so that u guys dun com tomorrow for me , i mean height of confidence uggh?


ps he didnt respond to any text or call of mine only those which were attended on his number were by his frd (obviously he said him to report me about progress,tests,hospital etc).

First time called crazy

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soulmate,i dont SEE from his behaviour that he is going to apologize atleast not in a verbal way saying 'i am sorry i did this etc' even right now u see he have started blaming me for NOT TALKING OR TAKING HIS CALLS infronta our friends...our uni classes have ended,now he is gona go back to home town, only he will be back for exams ,which will last till 22 of january and they even will be with prep leaves meaning one exam three four holidays and so on. so Do you think he will apologize till 22 jan means OUR LAST DAY OF FINAL EXAMS AND LAST DAY IN UNI ?

Do you really think he is GONNA apologize in that verbal or i am sorry words? its hard for him,big time ego :( what can be other forms of apology that i MAY CONSIDER TO ACCEPT? ( pls dun take this as IF i am cracking under negative pressure-just that i really dont want to lose this relation (i love him :( )... i am really into thinking that now when he calls or contacts me next time how should i correspond him regarding his ALLEGATIONS OF ME NOT PICKING HIS CALLS AND PROLONGING ARGUMENT (as he is saying this to our frds)- one way may be this:

'see,you yourself said its over,didnt u?" or adding wid it "i have stepped back for your happiness,what else u want?'
i am also thinking should i text him this instead of attending call(when he calls me) that 'u owe me an apology-contact me when u realise ur mistake like i did' which one is better?

My mother these days is praying hard for any good proposal for me and that i do consider some proposal (told u i am an idealist),she knows about him but not our relationship,i even doubt her prayers may be affecting our realation as well SAME from his side his father is a strict religous and cultural man wants him to marry his cousin ;-)

WARNING, though (because it looks like he's no snail, this one!) what this means??snail?

First time called crazy

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He was taken to hosp on uni ambulance he had extreme fever and stomach pain an ultrasound was done which was clear he went to home town without giving exam there he consulted a specialist who refered him endoscopy

First time called crazy

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On the same call he said to her i havent ended it she is the one who ended it! Wat does he mean by that? I hav no idea۔۔ may be it was an indirect msg to me that its finish from MEE side means she should contact? Pleading me to come again hmm

See I had begged wept in front of God that he gets back to his good health and also take me out of this life exam i cant bear it .. :/

First time called crazy

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He's just blaming/emotionally blackmailing you and doing his poor wickle victim act as usual. Don't worry, you're seeing through his little ploys just fine. Again, stop doubting yourself. You know your objective: anything incoming from him as veers from it - forget it and ignore-ignore-ignore/rise-above-rise-above-rise-above/side-step-side-step.

Sorry - I've no time today. Be with you tomorrow.

First time called crazy

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Just got time to say this, though:

"See what this shows abt human nature ( if this was asked by my bf that say this to her) -see the moment i started to sympathise he started to be OVERCONFiDENT.."

Correct.

He's playing you, trying to manipulate your maternal instinct into feeling sorry for him and taking the blame for how the situation has panned out. If you admit you were the one who ended it, that makes it a far bigger crime than he committed and means you have to be the one to apologise to HIM.

Did you keep those texts of his, telling you it was over? Not that you'd need them; it'd just be very satisfying to show his allies, would it not. It'd shut them up in an instant!

Anyway, in spite of it being in face-saving fashion - he's cracking. In fact, call me cynical ("You're cynical!") (thanks), but... I'm not sure I even believe he had stomach pain or went to hospital. Do you?

First time called crazy

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No no he was in hosp (first in uni medical centre and then 6 injections wre put there and then taken to civil hosp by uni ambulance.That is confirmed by my own reliable sources and he has even missed his paper i was in exam hall he has gone back to town this is confirm.. That is 100 percent confirm that he is ill,this is wat i personally know and confirming you.

So these are the circumstances!

Happy new year

First time called crazy

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Hippy New Year to you, too! :-)

I'll just warn you...Have had 2 Kier(sp?) Royales and a double shot of Giner Wine- no, see, GINGER Wine, LOL, so forgive any errors...

He was genuinely in hospital, eh? Okay, then. Well, yes we feel sorry for him, then, because he's obviously suffering majorly. Hence you HAD to send that text because it was the only decent and healthy thing to do, as well as shows your appreciation for his GOOD side and, consequently, all the good times. (You could, however, if you'd wanted, stayed silent out of homage to the present day situation so - tick to you!) BUT. He did bring it on himself. So no we don't. We just feel sorry for anyone with that condition based on the assumption when we evoke that picutre that that 'anyone' is full-time decent and *not* a self-harmer.

Christ almighty. He'd rather suffer majorly both now (nervous stomach) and 'tomorrow' (missing the important exam) than JUST SAY SORRY OR EXTENT THE OLIVE BRANCH IN THE NORMAL BLOODY WAY!

Seriously? SERIOUSLY?

Mee, that isn't just common-or-garden Stubbornness. That young man, if you married him, would be a LIABILITY.

You need to think about that, think about in what myriad other manifestations that level of stubbornness - STUPID stubbornness, more to the point - could scupper yours and your future children's practical/financial and emotional/psychological welfare. Quite possibly at the drop of any hat, without warning!

...Think about your FUTURE as well as your present. Because trust me, when you're married to a part-time emotional idiot that FEELS like a full-time one due to the real and meaningful IMPACT of his stupid choice-making of actions, there is far more 'future' than there is 'present'.

(Imagine a tiny, only slightly annoying and uncomfortable pebble trapped irremovably in your shoe all day tomorrow. Imagine that tiny pebble still in your shoe the day after. And the day after. And the day after that. And the month after. And the year after. And the two years after................. decade after.................... Tell me - how 'slightly annoying and uncomfortable is it NOW?)

When I say, think about that, I don't necessarily mean chuck him (unless you want to now?). I mean, DO NOT AGREE TO WALK UP THAT AISLE HIM UNTIL HE HAS SOUGHT A COMPLETE COURSE OF INDIVIDUAL COUNSELLING, SPECIFICALLY COGNITIVE BEHAVIOURAL THERAPY *FROM AN EXPERT SPECIALIST IN GESTALT THERAPY* (focussing on Reproductive Thinking, taking responsibility and approach social life with an egalitarian attitude). Because it's not his EMOTIONS or how he allows himself to express them that need understanding, explaining and adjusting/correcting. It's his whole attitude (thus thinking) to begin with as RESULT in those emotions. In other words, he wouldn't feel bad and malicious whenever he does if certain of his thinking weren't skewed. There's the diff that makes ALL the diff.

(My conclusion thus far is, his father could/can be abusive. Ber-bom.)

He is not ready to be any woman's husband or any child's father . And that's not just because he's young and inexperienced (albeit, it doesn't help). If he's serious about wanting you and he to marry then he had better do what it takes to BECOME ready! And pretty damned quick!

And if all of THAT doesn't keep your strength of resolve intact - god 'elp ya! Although, from what I've seen of your iron will - I'm sure it will. But I'm also sure it'll waver from time to time so...

...New mantra: cruel to be kind, long-term over short-term, cruel to be kind, long-term over short-term...

Say it in the mirror every first-thing morning and last-thing night. And look yourself in your reflection's RIGHT eye when you do so.

First time called crazy

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Sorry ("hic!") - LEFT eye (doh!).

That's my cue for beddiebyes, methinks, LOL..., s/he said, pretending it was an effect of the booze.

PS:

"You-put-yer right leg in...
[Er, no..] You-put-yer left leg in...
Yer-left leg out
In, out, in, out
Shake-it all-a-bout
You-do-the Cokey-Hokey [No..] Hokey-Cokey and-you turn-a round
And that's-what-it's all a-bout
[All what's about? Eh?]

WOAH... Hokey-Pokey-Dokey!
WOAH... Smokey-Robinson-blokey!
WOAH... fnuef-fe-fneuf-fe- Mini-Moke-ey

Knees up,
Mo-ther
Brown!

;-D

First time called crazy

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No i dun hav messages and i dun think i need to show anybody.bt i remember wat he said so i can remind him tthe moment he contacts me or ask me where were i..

He z ill doing self harm yess totally bad and liable.In our country these therapies r rare so i m his psychologist and counsellor :-) yes his fathr is an abuser,in a way that he sulks too when get past a certain degree of angriness.i remember the frst day i met this guy in uni and he told me i and my dad havent talkd for a month and today he has called me himself.! And his family has always suffered becoz of his dominant behVior,thats y this bloke is too muxh in favour of his mom and is a feminist.


He again told my gf that he was in hosp today too but he z not telling her details or wat dr said.. May b he wants that i ll ask out of curiosity myself. But even if it is so, why wud his frd say to me "Dont disturb him he is going hometown right now". I dun even knw his frd said this "disturb" thing himself or he was asked to do so (he was wid him that moment however). May be it was to upset me so that i contact more?

From the day he z ill i am really really worried,stressed,getting temprature now,i cant c him in pain and thats true. I have to act v much rational and treat him very carefully keeping lot of his goodness in mind and how to mould him into a better personality spec in crisis mode.

Not a snail means?

Nd sorry dint get ur last one post :-)

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""He again told my gf that he was in hosp today too but he z not telling her details or wat dr said.. May b he wants that i ll ask out of curiosity myself."

Definitely. Guilt/pity, abject curiosity and hating not knowing exactly what's what, missing him too much to bear, worrying that other people are taking his word for it thus making you look like the guilty party... all or any, whatever will work best.

If you allow yourself to get so stressed you feel ill, you're playing straight into his hands.

He may genuinely have had physical symptoms (grief and guilt does that, as you yourself know) and hospital staff may be duty-bound to take patients at their word, including running the entire gamut of diagnostic tests corresponding to that one or set of symptoms, but there's clearly an awful lot of exaggerating going on. Think about it: If you owed him a giant apology but believed he'd crack and take the blame instantly if only he could be convinced his refusal was making you genuinely ill, and meanwhile the medical staff were very handily *legitimately* giving you cause to believe they suspected something grave or ominous were responsible for those symptoms ("we think it could be this/that/this problem") - you'd damn well WANT him to know the extent of those specific suspicions, not keep it vague in front of willing messengers in order to leave it to their own over-active, drama-loving imaginations before passing the result onto you.

Also, let's not forget that needing medical treatment or tests right before an exam is liable to get you A RE-SIT! Is it not.

Sorry, but from what I can see, he's deliberately making a bigger meal out of this than is necessary.

He doesn't need reminding. He knows the true chain of events. He's just trying to confuse you and trying to evoke guilt as an antidote to your anger and staunch refusal to approach and kowtow, or alternatively provoke a need to confront him over the gross injustice of his falsified version of events (either will do). He's also re-writing history to other people in case they, too, would tell him the only thing he can do is apologise and take those statements back, whereas, if they can be duped into believing YOU'RE the guilty party and he the innocent victim, they'll nag you instead (which will add to the pressure meant to make you back down).

You are absolutely NOT his psychologist and counsellor. You play THAT game and you're automatically slowly, bit-by-bit killing the relationship by messing with what should be the more natural dynamic (two equal partners). It's not your job to MOULD him, either. He should have come to you more-or-less ALREADY "moulded".

A feminist? He may like to *think* he's feminist or *want* to be (in order to disassociate himself from his father) or be capable of saying all the right things in all the right places during Situation Normal. But whenever the going gets tough, he panics and instantly grabs for his *dad's* box of tricks (Emotional Blackmail Tactics). Feminist is as feminist *does*. What comes out of the mouth means NOTHING unless it's proven there and then or not long afterwards by corresponding actions that get repeated or sustained, even under duress. So, if anything, he's a FAIR-WEATHERED, LIP-serving feminist.

Well, we can all "be" this and pay lip-service to that whenever everything's rosy, can't we.

Nah, men who truly believe in feminism, i.e. equal rights and justice for women, don't try to emotionally blackmail women out of their rights for [wait for it] equal rights and justices, the minute it's THEM who'd stand to suffer.

"I dun even knw his frd said this "disturb" thing himself or he was asked to do so (he was wid him that moment however). May be it was to upset me so that i contact more?"

Yup. And to paint himself the victim at your monstrous hand (pff!) for the above-explained reason. But truth wins every battle. Without exception. Even if all it requires is just enough TIME.

If you play into his hands, all that'll mean is yet MORE opportunities for you to get stressed and poorly on all future occasions.

Not a snail meant he's not slow to react or start ever more desperately trying to hammer in the nail (using anything *but* the hammer). He IS slow to admit culpability and defeat, however. All he keeps doing, still, is trying out bigger and bigger and less and less-ripe bananas. This hospital thing, whether contrived or getting used by him simply as a conveniently-timed, very handy, extra-large banana, is his last-ditch effort. You cave now and all it'll teach him for next time is to get the big banana out to start with rather than treat it as a near-last resort.

He KNOWS you're naturally concerned for his health status and why that would be, he KNOWS why you're not the one apologising even so (his current health and his transgression against you are not related). He knows the truth. He just doesn't want to have to admit it and thinks he can get away with pretending it doesn't exist if only he can just keep up the pretences and working on your weaknesses (your soft-heartedness) to emotionally force you do his backing-down *for* him. (What are you - the team's scapegoat and whipping girl??) And that, undoubtedly, is because you've shown him you believe you're his willing armchair therapist. Because what are therapists supposed to do? Answer: have a deeper understanding than your normal woman. And to him and any other lay-person not 'in the know', that, even leaving ASIDE being in-love with ones patient, must automatically equal deeper tolerance and forgiveness, given instantly.

Er, no it doesn't. Why do you think therapists refuse to allow any attachment to take place on their part to begin with ("DRRRRING, time's up for this week!"). Understanding WHY, for extreme thus clearer example, a serial-killer thinks and behaves the way he does, does not mean he gets automatically forgiven. Contrary to popular myth, forgiveness is NOT something one bestows as if one arrogantly believes one is somehow Jesus/Allah himself. Reaching a place where you, the victim, accept that what happened actually did happen and why, is just that - Acceptance, an entirely different kettle of fish and not reliant on forgiveness. Forgiveness is something you deliver when shown to be something that's genuinely, actively wanted and sought, i.e. ASKED FOR (or begged, depending on the size of the crime). Forgiveness WITHOUT the subject understanding what he's done and showing he wishes to make amends both past, present and future as EARNS that forgiveness (repeat - SHOWING), just means he gets free license to keep doing the crime over and over because the only consequence thus deterrent against the next time will be (shock-horror!) instant forgiveness. That kind of so-called forgiveness is actually called letting them completely off the hook and is plain laziness on the part of the victim ("can't be bothered any more"). Forgiveness is a RESPONSE, not a catalyst aka pre-payment for services not even rendered or unlikely to be rendered.

You'd be surprised how many people are sorry even BEFORE they commit a crime - hence don't ever unleash it in the first place! The horror of the act and consequences simply played out in the imagination is ENOUGH of a deterrent.

Look, you're a bouncer at the door of a nightclub. Someone who trashed it wants in again. Admission, including compensation, costs £25. Not £5 and CERTAINLY not free-of-charge. Why on earth would you let someone in for free whom had proven a repetition of bad behaviour highly likely, unless you secretly thought your club was sh*t or that you needed someone-anyone's silhouette visible through the front window from outside in order to attract anyone else? If you truly think membership to your club is a paid-for privilege as should get revered accordingly then act like it or your club will quickly go under.

You wouldn't do that as a serious businesswoman who felt she had a club worth protecting and preserving so why do it with your even more precious heart and sense of justice?

However, it's your relationship so if you can't stick comfortably by your healthy resolutions - or know in your heart of hearts that the evidence you presented was false or missing vital data, hence the verdict now in application was however much wrong and unjust - then by all means drop your stance in admission. I'm a calculator: rubbish in = rubbish out; correct numbers in = correct sum out. Which is it?

Look, I know this is hard. I wouldn't advise anyone else to stand by their honest convictions if I or other people couldn't do likewise. We can and we have. But the truth is, if you'd been this keenly determined to defend your welfare and equal-status rights in terms of how you expected always to be treated LONG before now, i.e. had started as you meant to go on - nipping buds - you'd have only had to have put up with a few, very brief bursts of pain and grief here and there during that first year, rather than this banked-up, drawn-out amount today. So now you have to do it all in one fell swoop. No pain, NO GAIN...and certainly no change.

But hey - better late than never, right?

No point in stressing so much that you get ill. No need, either, considering you deliberately cleaned your conscience. He's struggling all over the shop, trying to hold back the tide called Cracking because he did not. That's what's making HIM ill, his fishwife of a conscience, sat there in his head, repeatedly harping on and on, 'No, actually - everything that's happened since she apologised is YOUR FAULT!'.

If he takes too long to accept that truth and do what's right, I imagine you'll decide you can do a lot better, husband- or even boyfriend-wise, anyway. Because for every day that passes without his sincerely issuing that simple, heartfelt apology is yet another drip of an insult into the total bucket, which, if he's not careful, is going to reach Full.

You're being cruel to be kind to yourself (your future self and mini-future selves) as well, you know.

Tell any interlopers, 'Well, apparently he'd rather have to spend time in hospital than admit he's wrong and apologise. What can *I* do about that? Nothing! That's his stubborn choice and no-one else's'.

First time called crazy

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I textd him at 11 pm Tonight that we can wish our best frd together,he said ok then he told me that he is better nd he asked me to get well soon as well, i said tc of urself all frds love u so much then i sd u shud hav told me abt ur illnes u know how much i have been worried then he said that why do u worry abt me ? when i said i cant c him in pain he said y? Then Again he was pleading me to ask why why? he was eager to lisn smthing which i said finally : " becoz i love u" then i said that parents never say "we leave u "then how can a lover say ?is it ok to say this in a relation?do justice.. He dint reply and then time of birthday wish came he called me at 12 asked me how were u ill,why ... ? I told him that i was worried abt u. Thats why then we wishes our frd togthr on confrnc call we had jokes wid her later after talking to her i asked abt his health in detail and then i asked again "dont u think that over word was wrong" he said no i was right u finished this relation by ur previous bad words ( he was specifically pointing out to those words that i said during fight means verbal abuse and also afterwards when i sent msgs to him sying about his damned family bakground etc ...) i said u shud b sorry on that statemnt ,he said i was just calling u afterwards because at that day when no one was there in uni u were normal wid me so i thot why not be frds til the end of semestr..i am still on my words -i keep on them even today -
I got so hurt to hear this,i replied its ok and i cut the call :-(

First time called crazy

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He called me next morn asked how are u feeling now? Get well soon and prepare exams u shudnt fail !!! I said " you have done a big thing fo me by paying my last sem fees, i will complete this semester" (my tone was agreesive)
He sd, if u dint give papers, its my insult my reputiton will be at stake that my classfello couldnt pass, i said u only care about repu , he sd no no i dun fear u fear abt repo issues !!
Then we said goodbyes.

After half hr he called me again and sd why ur voic is down, he tryd to cut jokes, and thrn he said just tell me about those msgs wich u sent to me after hiking trip.. Just think abt thm anything s possible aftr that? ( i had apologzd on those so why he z repeating the same shit)
I just replyd " u dun know wats the situation at my home my single mom is so in hurry to get me marryd,u carry on wid ur childish games and ill be married to smbdy else in fronta ur eyes.and then ull cry only. Bye !!!!! " and i cut the call.

First time called crazy

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He was asking em again n agan to tell me details abt my illness-i told him i was finw but ge was saying TEll me wat i am asking.then i said i am alive when i will die u ll get an invitation card so dun u worry...
dun know may b he was trying to finish the matter coz his words were "can u read those cruel msgs for me ? But i got so emotional and ended up saying that..(mentioned in last post end)
Earlier,When we were wishing budday he told he ll slp wid dad today i said keep some distance from him in bed may b he kills u by hands on neck (lol i wss kidding) i also sd that i dun wan my future husband to die ryt nw both of them enjoyd my jokes then i sd i really will see a lot of real horror movies in my future home lol :-)
Anyways I called him aftr two hrs again (after that emotional outburst) he called me back ,i asked him how was he? He sd "as two hrs back".theree wass too much voice there in back.he told me he came in sum other town for wedding,i sd ok we ll talk when u r free..

U r right therapist dont let patients get attached to them v right and well he has been brought up in a very good manner by his mom she is a simple villahe lady very recessive to husband,but his father is too much dominant and strange prrson.he had v less communication with his children through out,and i totaly agree wid ur comments on feminism,

First time called crazy

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Then he called me pleading me to be for those msgs n me to him for that statmnt . He sd u r prolonging matter . We had a detailed talk . I sd think n col me again wen u realise that u had even 1 % of ur mistake. He sd u blame me for evrything. I sd i m not u just get overdefensve. Then he had to go bak home he sd il call u again. He txtd me late nyt that he had reached home now. I said ok.

I think he ll call me tmrw. I dont hv a clue wat to say now, but possibly he come wid a lot of preparatn bcoz he dont hav much valid points for his argument

First time called crazy

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So today we had the final reconciliation talk :-)
He called me when i reminded him that u had to col me for sorting things out, then we had detaled talk, he apologised for misbehaving in fronta frds amd i apologised for those msgs ... Then we discussed each and everything all the events in detail, thus telling him we have communications gaps, so we resolved the issue :-)

But he said that after those msgs in which u criticisrd my family and gave them bad names after that i dun knw whether i ll have same feelings for u or not becoz i m
Really hurt one shud nevr come till family, i told that i ll try to control my anger next time ,and wid time same feelings wil develop so lets hav a new strat :-) we r meeting on 7th of jan so fingrrs crossed :-)

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"he apologised for misbehaving in fronta frds amd i apologised for those msgs"

EUREKA! Finally!

Sorry for the absence but [1] I was busy and [2] I took advantage of that situation to see whether and how you'd cope flying solo. ;-)

No doubt the credit goes to comments/acts like these ones:

- "[I got so hurt to hear this,] i replied its ok and i cut the call"
- " I said " you have done a big thing fo me by paying my last sem fees, i will complete this semester" (my tone was agreesive)"
- "" u dun know wats the situation at my home my single mom is so in hurry to get me marryd,u carry on wid ur childish games and ill be married to smbdy else in fronta ur eyes.and then ull cry only. Bye !!!!! " and i cut the call."
- "[he told me he came in sum other town for wedding,] i sd ok we ll talk when u r free.."
- "I sd think n col me again wen u realise that u had even 1 % of ur mistake."
- "[He txtd me late nyt that he had reached home now.] I said ok. [I think he ll call me tmrw. I dont hv a clue wat to say now, but possibly he come wid a lot of preparatn bcoz] he dont hav much valid points for his argument"
- "i told that i ll try to control my anger next time ,and wid time same feelings wil develop so lets hav a new strat :-)" (- very true, Mee!)

They basically all translate to this: I'm now *very* bored and *distinctly* unimpressed with this and am taking no prisoners. Better you realise it now rather than when it's too late, that I'm no pushover and additionally can be just as cruel and spiteful with my mouth as YOU... possibly more so. So watch yourself in future!

That's the way to do it. Don't bother getting upset, let alone showing him as if you believe it'll flick his pity nerves enough to tip him into seeing sense on your timeline. It's just this: YAWN + 'Ugh' + 'I feel sorry for you'.

Not perfect. But definitely perfect considering your youth and inexperience! :-)

How do you feel? More powerful than all the last fights and stand-offs?

You certainly made him sweat and do the long-haul, didn't you! I don't think he q....UITE enjoyed it as much as all prior times [understatement].

First time called crazy

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Ha haa yes i am feeling beter becoz this was the fst tyme he didnt just put dust under the carpe't instead discussed each n every point wid me.Secondly thanks
U for judging me lol :-) thirdly this time i have made a plan on weekend (wen we have a prep leave) that only two of us will go, enjoy our day and also i have to take a degree from my previous colg so he ll take ms there.

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Definitely this tym he really had to sweat, moreover i trried to realise him dat a successful relation consists of sinxerrity,loyality and good communicstion.Though we are besties stil we lack in 3rd one.So both of us shud work on it.

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"yes i am feeling beter becoz this was the fst tyme he didnt just put dust under the carpe't instead discussed each n every point wid me"

I expect he did. Because on all previous occasions, his sulking and drawing out the argument had been worth his while, but not yours. This time [1] it wasn't worth HIS while (- the difference that makes *all* the difference); [2] not once did you have to burst into tears to get him running; [3] and due directly to this recouping of empowerment, you now feel *capable* of giving the concession he needs (just the two of you this weekend, no 'gooseberries'). And I'm pleased to note that last one, that you heeded my warning not to let this stand-off victory tip the power scales more in your own favour, so well done.

HOWEVER - something is still going to have to be cut out of his ridiculously over-crowded workload in-tray or he's just going to *keep* being thin-skinned, tetchy and unreasonable and either trying to take it out on you/his friends or, now, what with firm deterrents against those in place, take it out on himself (physical ailments, mild depression). Did you get a chance to point this out to him as well?

Yes, re your last post, he and you need to learn to become 'speak your thoughts' machines with each other. Too much is always better than not enough. Because you can then take what you need and disregard the rest. Works to bring project success in business teams of two, works in romantic teams of two (order of priority deliberate). Projects are tricky enough without having to play Guess My Thoughts, eh!

So do I take it he's overall as much a happier bunny as you are right now?

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We realy enjoyd weeknd watchd movi had diner togthr.yes i did ask slightly to him abt work load but he didnt reply me abt it۔However i dun think work is his bigger motivator for anger becoz he is responsble for sure but not a workaholic.So i dont find a great link between two.ALso right now wen we werr studying he was quite away frm business,

Yes he is TOO much happy n i m hpy dat we r enjoyngast days of uni together.He is alws hppu wen we spend tym togtherHe says i only dmand one thng frm u and that is ur time and i m trying my level best to spnd max tym with him :)

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Well done! :-)

But have you two had a proper debrief yet, about why he thinks he tends to assume the worst and then overreact (and whatever he wants to know about you)?

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He give the reason that this has happens before thats y he has to get defensive however i have made him realise that we had an agreemnt and we should abide to ut by allmeans.

Also his overreacting is not directly realted to his workload he is a v responsible person and he z eldest at home so he has to do the chores himself bcoz his dad works out of town.however i do believe that he is in immense family pressure about marriage inside family and this May directly or indirectly affect his moods.

First time called crazy

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WHAT has happened before?

PS: "Also his overreacting is not directly realted to his workload "

Oh, yeah, it is. Maybe not exclusively but... oh, yeah, it is.

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We enjoy and do lunchtigether alonein diff restrnts as these r last days in uni...Two days bak we all frds were sitting in lib we as usual were having chit chat during which we all wr making fun he always took side of a guy who was craxking jokes on me.. Even one or two times i warned him..Later wen we got alone i sd that i want u to b protectv twards me y u took his side fst he ignured bt wen i sd again he got angry n sd that our frds dun knw abt our relatn i cant act as a bf infrnt of them and why r u getting overpossessve u always say we are besties in uni then y cant we joke... Anyways i cooled him down later...

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Means slapping had hapnd before.

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Oh, the slapping, right. But you've since vowed not to do that again, haven't you.

So what are his family going to say when they find out you two are secretly engaged? Might his father try to hold his job to ransom and do you think if that's the case, you and he would to have to think about moving further away from the family?

Other than his behaving to the rules of incognito (and well done for cooling him down), i t sounds like the ending of uni has come in the nick of time from his point of view. How do you feel now you and he are behaving more like a fianced twosome - are you enjoying the increased trust and intimacy?

RE this false impression of his in front of this male friend: whose idea was it originally that you keep the relationship a secret - yours or his? Reason I ask is because that statement of his sounds a bit like him telling you in somewhat bitter fashion that you can't have it both ways and that if keeping it under wraps is something you insist on then he doesn't see why he should have to bust a gut to make it pleasant for you. Agree?

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yup we are enjoying our period of intimacy,lovable ;-) we watched movie in cinema last week had deep intimacy ;-)

He was starting a business of cars but the trailor got an accident his car too much damaged,first time in life probably he told me he was upset

yes it was my idea to remain frds in uni.

his some family members know but not all.his parents dont know.he is waiting for his bro going abroad in a month plus his house which is under construction then he ll tell his parents.AND me on other side want my mother to vist my uni by any reason and then he meets her and convinces her.However i dont know when will she go.

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i dont know how will i come out of this trauma of finishing school life leaving my frds... what should i do after this month? i will miss my frds so much and job phobia another thing ;-( moreover i have no other option becoz i have to do it to support my fmly and brothers study expenditures.I havent told my fiance yet abt that but i have to do it anyway.

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Well, if he's confided in you for the first time about his being upset (rather than bottling it up, only for it to explode over you later/another time) then you owe him a like-for-like reciprocation, meaning, you're going to have to confide in him, right? If you don't/won't then you'll just be tipping the see-saw a full 180 degrees to where he's then Jane to your Tarzan - same problem, switched roles and all the usual symptoms re-starting again.

Anyway, if you two are now properly on your way to adult, married life then shouldn't the pair of you be making friends with other couples in readiness? Where and in what venues do couples tend to hang out in your area? Do you have any bars, clubs, sports centres, pubs, that sort of thing near to you both?

So some family members know already but haven't baulked or tittle-tattled? Well, that's a good sign, then, isn't it. :-)

Why don't you start with a part-time job, where there's scope after a couple of months, once you gain confidence, to be moved up to full-time?... Baby Steps?

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...Or better yet - TWO part-time jobs? Hell, you could if you wanted, have FOUR OR FIVE very part-time jobs 'with scope' - one roughly for each day of the week - and treat it like a sampling of each until you decide which you want longer-term?

First time called crazy

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We dont have hourly jobs here

My mothr is soon going to meet hm may b next week , he z asking me to dicide a very good hotel

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Your region doesn't have any part-time jobs? Que?

And have you confided in boyfriend yet about your job fears, and if so, what does he say?

"My mothr is soon going to meet hm may b next week"

So, starting with the easier parent/a practise-run, eh? Good plan! Let me know how it goes. :-)

First time called crazy

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Here unemplymnt rate is high part time jobs r rare

No he dsnt know i plan to ask him once i get a job lol ;)

Yes looking frward n exctd forr that meeting

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Rare isn't the same as 'don't have', is it. Worth a try?

Good luck with the meeting!

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***Hi I am MEE's friend Maryam I am in 4 year mbbs now...I like my cousin a lot ...he also likes me....when I was in 3 rd year Mbbs his famly sent proposal for me....but my parents said to wait for 2 year....he was already 29 he didn't wait and is now married with someone else....now I feel alone and depressed often as I was v much attach with him.....I have to face that cousin again and again often which I don't want to as it recalls me all those past memories....now guide me how should I behave in front of him..I feel alone and depressed often...

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Thank u soulmate, maryam is my bestie amd looking for an advice

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I'm afraid I don't take requests at the best of times, MEE, and even if I made an exception to that rule just this once, I'm afraid this month's super-busy for me, anyway, allowing too little time already to do much posting, bar here and there with the handful of long-term posters I already have on my plate or with whatever few dilemmas needing only fairly simple advice. So Maryam might have an overly long wait if she waits around for me personally. The best thing to do for now, therefore, is show Maryam how to start her own thread so that she can get a wide range of feedback from all the other advisers, and once my current life load lessens I can then take a look (assuming there'll be anything new or different needing to be added to her thread by then, that is). Sorry about that.

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Yes she has made a separate thread in "emotional" column.But i think i have to be honest.You are being rude if u think that somebody wants to take YOUR advice is a crime because they think YOU can help them,is it such a big deal to help somebody which will only take a bit of your time?... Your atitude reminds me of hospitals in our country where experienced/senior drs leave poor patients on death beds just becoz they think they dont have time and leave very critical patients for junior dr who r incapable of handling difficult situations.Btw my friend is a real time dr but sighs not a mind dr otherwise she could have helped herself and not asking others for help online :( and how about life takes u somewhere where u ask somebody for any sort of help (life takes turna,we never know) and somebody snubs you or asks you to go somewhere else for help?
Anyways i can understand u r busy but i hope u take ur time out even in the long run,because i didnt ever believe u can be so unkind at heart.

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Wow. Nice attempt at emotional blackmail in response to what was a perfectly civil 'sorry, too busy' message featuring zero rudeness, but if it isn't good enough to help you with your stock inability to ever take the other person's point of view and life into account, rather than just you and YOUR needs, then try this: My son has been suffering stomach cramps for the last 8 days, worse than ever today, when he should be in school preparing for leaver exams, with the constipation medication his doctor prescribed on Monday morning having had zero effect, meaning, not only am I more behind with my day-to-day chores than ever, from playing constant nursie on top of everything else, but have to right now - the minute he comes out of his latest visit to the toilet, in fact - take him, as per his GP's instructions just now on the phone (in response, FINALLY, to this morning's request for a call back), to our local hospital's A&E for blood tests and scans to find out what the hell is causing his contractions and rule out a Grumbling Appendix.

What do you think I am - The Queen Of Sheba, having nothing to do, day-in-day-out, except lie around on a velvet chaise-longue eating grapes and occasionally posting on here as my sole diversion and demand? Aside from inordinate busy-ness of late and especially this week, and aside from having to try to find time to read every post and response to monitor for rule-breaking or poor etiquette, I'm not some free-for-all commodity, least of all your personal one, for you to 'pimp out' as you see fit and without even having having *thought* to have provided the kind of courtesy befitting the kind of lengthy time and energy I've put into helping your relationship problems, to pre-ask whether I even WANTED to tend to some friend of yours, let alone whether I might have had time in the first place.

No, instead, whether you realise it or admit it or not, you manipulatively try to commit me to helping, by out-in-the-open shoving your friend at me with zero pre-warning, as some sort of fait accomplis - her telling me 'now guide me', in a manner suggesting she thinks she's talking to a personal servant (- seriously, all that was missing was a summoning click of the fingers! -) when you could quite easily have sent a request more diplomatically via Richard. Instead I had to make my declination likewise here - to put paid to a situation where it seemed like I was simply not answering either of you - which I do, not rudely at all, actually, and get, what? That undeservedly recriminating response back!?

And you talk to me about being rude???

I mean, if you can understand I'm busy then I fail to appreciate what you thought gave you the right to respond as you did, including a further attempt to try to shoehorn me into doing your bidding by basically intimating that if I don't then it must mean I'm 'unkind at heart'.

Shoot first, ask questions later, YET AGAIN, is it? I thought you'd shed that habit? Maybe this time - assuming you feel suitably shamed, now, by what you now know were gross, negative and unfair mis-assumptions about me - you will.

Face it - I was not rude; you just don't like being told No, and so throwing ignorant, without-basis recriminations at the decliner concerned is your next method in line for getting them to back down and agree regardless.

Doesn't work on me, sorry.

Over and out.

First time called crazy

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I will say you are RUDER this time,i cant be dishonest just to please u. And you cant answer just to please me.But see this way lady,i told her that you helped me A LOT and when she read my posts,she was so eager to talk to you.We are humans,destined to help each other,Allah created us this way and connected us by empathy,love and kindness.And to feel each others pain.



I feel sorry for ur kid i wish he gets well soon,i think u should give him time and your role as mom is most important.I will pray for him :( One other reason for me being replying there waa that i am very sensitive and cant see people in pain whether its my frd,or ur son.Some ppl feel for others more and i am that type.But i cant ask ppl to think totally like me or force u or anybody to even guide or help anybody as it is totally ur personal decision.


About my frds words "now guide me" ,i know her from last ten years and soulmate she is a rreally innocnt girl,firstly englsh is
Not our language she used the best words from
Her side to request u,even u cant imagine what sheewanted to say bexause there is a probem of communicatn btwn us,may b u thot she is rude or ordering her but i know her what she meant.She even hardly wrote thee reply even my english is far batter than hee.Our language ia urdu,similar to arabic.Anyways if you think i was emotional blackmailing its ur perception.I cant explain u what i meant.I was just seeing this from my point of view that if smbdy seeks help from me i get super pleased to help them, infact its an honour for Me,i dont feel i am a SERVANT ... And who said That she didnt try on her own for her problems,she has been discussing this problem from a plenty of ppl including me-and she came On this forum finaly now-BUT-- having said that,i will encourage u to take care of the lil pie as he is in a bigger need than me or my frd- i will take care of her you neednt worry.

And whoo is Richard? I seriously dont know,?? and even i didnt know that any other person cant post on a continuing thread?

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MEE, it's not about 'only being honest', nor obvious expectations of receiving a yes, nor my failing to grasp why you recommended me, nor any claimed losses in translation, nor lack of objectivity of perception (when the above documentation speaks for itself, anyway, in terms of chain of actions/method). It's about simple world-wide, adult etiquette:

You may warrant *some* allowances for your youth, but you're not a child. If you want someone to do a friend of yours a favour, it's generally understood to be good manners and a mark of respect to ask them (nicely, tentatively) first - and *privately*, not right in front of the friend. And then you have to accept with good grace their answer, even if that's neither what you or your friend expected nor wanted to hear. If you don't, if you keep trying to push it (even when only out of well-meant over-eagerness) in order to make them override their decision, no matter that they've already given you sound justification as to why not - and *particularly* if your method includes unfounded, unfair slurs on their character - you have to expect that person to react befittingly negatively. So if you don't like hearing someone feeling affronted, try to be extra careful not to cause it. Not rocket-science.

Also, if something(s) prevent one from being able to do something, leaving non-exceptions or exceptions in Situation Normal completely aside, there is no 'decision' involved whatsoever, least of all 'personal'. I think you'll find most other forum moderators would have ignored both requests entirely or at very best said nothing more than one, single sentance, like, 'Sorry, I pick and choose, not take requests'.

Now, other than agreeing to disagree, with no hard feelings, there's little point in furthering this discussion. Thank-you sincerely, though, for your concern for my son (tests still ongoing), and I hope - with supreme confidence, I should add, given the excellent calibre of well-meaning visitors lately - that any responses to your friend's thread will help her majorly. If not (doubtful), then, as moderator before poster, that would be when moral responsibility compelled me to review the responses and step in. But what I still can't say at this stage is 'by when'.

-The Serenity Prayer- (because every adult needs to know and try to abide by it, aetheists included)

God/Allah, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change,
The courage to change the things I can,
And the wisdom to know the difference.


PS: No, two individuals aren't supposed to share a thread nor hand it on like a relay baton. Secondly, Richard is the forum owner, but if after all this time you (as could indicate, possibly others too?) didn't know that fact then he needs to be made aware of it so, thanks, I'll pass that snippet on in case (again, doubtful) he misses it during his 'daily strolls'.

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Yes i was searching if there is any name of owner written on
My thread,i found none, and i dont even know how to contact u personally or how can i contact him

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Members aren't actually supposed to be able to contact me, unless somehow pertinently imperative, but for technical issues, Richard is contactable under Support (top Green banner, right-hand-side).

Anyhoo... kid's on the mend, pressure's mostly off, but I'm still doing mad dashes to play catch-up here, there and everywhere, while I see new threads are queuing up at the rate of knotts, so, again, Maryam-wise - bear with...

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Okay

Good to hear about the kids :)

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I prayd for lil ones, hope they are now fully well?

I gave me teaching demo in fst school yeatrday , kids(boys) of 7 grade were very naughty , but anyways it went well ;) dun know wen will be appointed

Good news, was sleeping at home, wen a surprise valentine bouqet and chocolate fudge cake was sent at my door on 14 feb , my mom recvd and gave me in room ;-) was quiite shocked and felt very hapy;-) he is his city these days.still havent met my mom.In this hard practical life after the crazness of uni life, a gift of sweetnes by a loved one refreshens ur life and makes u forget the troubles of life :-) however he doesnt know i am applying in diff places for jobs.

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Oops, sorry, nearly missed this!

Teaching demo?

Excellent sign from bf. But what's this about his not knowing that you're applying for jobs far from the areas he's pursuing? Did you have some sort of pact to try to get employment in the same districts?

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Teaching demonstration,the employers judge u from that,can u teach, how will u teach kids etc

No nothing like that, no pact,but i dint want him to know that i need job for money (my self respect ah) anyways i told him now that i need job and he was reluctant to allow me for job he said u can not cope with new ppl and specially men , ( he knows i m not fond of doing work outside home) anyways i pleaded him And now he has said that u can do job only if it has a good safe environmnt plus a handsum salary.He s willing to pay my siblings school fee as well but still i need a job.and i am searching for a good one.

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I didn't realise teaching was what you were training for. Nice career choice!

Why would he presume you wouldn't want an actual job at the end of it? What does he think that course was - an alternative to sitting around all day doing needlepoint? :-p And what do you mean, 'allow you'? What is he - your dad? Or do you mean, reluctant to encourage you to go for something you'd need to overcome an anxiety about? What would he rather - you sit with it for the rest of your lives?

Wait up - 'especially men'. There it is. He thinks you're too hot not to get advances left, right and centre if you entered the dual-gendered workplace, which makes him feel insecure. Well, you could get approached by interested males on your way to your corner shop or bus-stop, don't need to enter an office, so he'd better deal with his [wait for it] own anxieties on that score rather than try to hide them behind yours, hadn't he, and ensure you're 'advances-proofed' the RIGHT way - by being the one to keep you happily wooed and cherished. (You win at competitions by being the shiniest, not by tying the ankles of your fellow competitors or hiding away the race trophy so as to remove their incentive in the first place). But anyway, that's just fairly typical of men fairly early on in a relationship that are particularly crazy about their woman. They think just because *they* are convinced you're the greatest womanly thing since sliced bread, so automatically must absolutely every other man on the planet, and that you're utterly powerless when it comes to avoiding or dealing with unwanted advances. Usually it's compounded by guilty conscience, as in, 'I've been a complete prat lately which means if any equally eligible *non*-prat tries it on with her, she might well accept and dispense with me'.

Not sure I like you having to "plead with him" just because he so badly wanted to be the one to pay for your course and now those of your siblings. That's like a bank offering you a personal loan and then creating all these rules and stipulations around what you may or may not spend the money on. It's your choice what you spend the money on and the bank's choice either to approve or decline your application based on your ability and/or what currency you pay it back using, full-stop..that's as far as their say and input goes. So, in part, he's trying to control you (as in keep you from the male competition or any temptation that could change your plans to marry him) by making you feel forever more overly obliged to him and his wallet. But in this case, it's not even a loan, is it... because you didn't ask for it, he offered... making it nothing more than one particular choice on his part out of many over how to show you how considerate and helpful he is, along with what a great provider he would be once you yourself were 'out for the count', outside earning-wise, due to having Mini-MEEs around your ankles. Aka a FAVOUR.

But this is just between you and me. Because really, in reality, if you said what he wanted over whatever you wanted were tough and he could either take it or leave it, there would be absolutely nothing he could do (except sulk until he got used to it). Because he ain't ever going to dump you, that's for sure, not with the incredible amount of investment he's put into you/this relationship. Otherwise (in case of any arguing over it), you could, for example, insist he eat nothing but Mung Beans followed by a jar of dessert baby food every single night, just because you're the one daily doing the cooking, couldn't you. :-p

But anyway, all of that aside, I take it he's being more calm and reasonable during any disagreements/misunderstandings, still?

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Hmm :-) yes overall he behaves very calmly to my point of view.Generally yes.He listens to me as we have worked on it.This time i asked him if he would allow me to go out for earning so may b my mistake or wrong choice of words? To b honest i was hapy when he sd that u shudnt work,u will travel in local buses,work in hot summers,how will u do that,u r not habitual of doing that much work etc,becoz i want him to b the bread winner aftr our marriage and i a housewife.But then i explained that my siblings need me i sd that i ll love if u take on my expenditures but i hav to work for my siblings and home.We can do it together.He then agreed.But said not to sign an agrreemnt in school for one whole year as if we had to marry in an year i ll have to settle where he lives,in other town.

Anyways i did explain him a few days back that i dint like ur statement in which u said that u shudnt teach to o level boys they get attracted and idealise teachers etc in that age, he didnt like my this feedback and said that i only asked u to prefer girls,not ordered u and only when u asked me, do whatever u want to do!!! I calmed him that how i love him and how his statmnt negatively affected me in my way of searching jobs.And i ensured him that i d prefer gals but cant compromise on a good salary just becoz there r boys there.

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"To b honest i was hapy when he sd that u shudnt work,u will travel in local buses,work in hot summers,how will u do that,u r not habitual of doing that much work etc,becoz i want him to b the bread winner aftr our marriage and i a housewife."

Oh, fine, then! You can be a particularly intensive teacher instead - to your own kids (who'll spread it around and about their own peer group) - and include in your curriculum emotional intelligence (full thinking even under-fire)... so that they don't inherit dad's under-par-ness on that score ;-). But, yes, try in future to say 'are you okay with that' so that you don't train him into thinking he's your keeper.

Not to sign an agreement in school for what/to do what?

"Anyways i did explain him a few days back that i dint like ur statement in which u said that u shudnt teach to o level boys they get attracted and idealise teachers etc in that age, he didnt like my this feedback and said that i only asked u to prefer girls,not ordered u"

Laugh Out Loud! Talk about a back-pedal? If it weren't an issue for him - why think to mention it in the first place. Jesus Louises, he's even worried about BOYS!

What about a male pet rabbit - would that be non-threatening enough? ;-D

Going to give you a tip, though, because the way you put it, it sounds like you're not only rising to the bait but being over-assertive. Instead of telling him you didn't like his statement, yadder-yadder, try giving him an equally silly answer... something like, 'Ooh, no, I'd better not do that. It might be enough to turn me lesbian and THEN where would you be (especially as your boobs are rubbish)?!'.

PS: Why aren't you two trying to matchmake Maryam? Doesn't he have any nice friends you and he could introduce her to? Even if just to distract and remind her of all the other, tastier fishies out there?

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Her parents are b strict they wont let us do any match making

Agremnt that u have to do job for one whole yr, u r bound to do that,they keep original documwnts

First time called crazy

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Would they ever have to know Maryam and he didn't meet by chance somewhere?

If a condition of any position is that you commit, intentions-wise at point of signing, to 1 year as a minimum, and he's there saying not to offer to honour that standard, isn't he effectively trying to ensure you find it impossible to get hired until after you two are married?... even though you two being married within a year from job acceptance is - by his own tacit admission - not even guaranteed in terms of the specific When?

I mean, I still appreciate how you'd prefer to be a 'professional' homemaker, whatever, but, shouldn't this be purely your own decision or one reached by 50/50 agreement (the latter assuming you tend to get the same rights of input or vote regarding any decisions of his)?

Or is he trying to ensure you get yourself only a 'throwaway', non-teaching job for now, with the option to start your actual career - if you want to once you've both relocated - still open?

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So sad today. :( he came here for threee days for uni clearance we enjoyd a lot the rains and he met my mom they had good chat. She got satsfyd. Last night we were coming bak from icecream paurlour it was raining heavily he parked car in dark and tried to forcefully kiss me i warned him but he dint stop and kissed me forcefully.He then tried to open my shirt buttons i in an attempt to stop him slapped him forcefully with left hand.I also said "its my mistake to trust u and sit in ur car".He took away the car rashly towards my home.I thoughy may b he minded my words i tried to say sorry to him and hold his arm, he first beat me on bak, i took it as joke becoz as frds we used to b so frank, i again put my hand on his left arm while he was driving, he slapped me this tym on my face not a very forceful one but he did.I just said why did u slap me? :( and began crying ( dint showd him by crying silently and covering my face). After that till reaching home we both stayed quiet.He We had a trip arrangef wid frds nex day but he asked me to tale my uni documnts with myself meaning hinting me that i m not going wid him on trip.he said u ll only sit in this car now wen u ll be legal and will hav trust on me.Then wen he dropped me he came a bit far to see if i have reschd my home.After cming inside i txtd him the routine txt that i have reachd home.Was that a mstak on my part? Becoz my frd says u shudnot hav txtd him else he ll think it doesnr matter to her if smbdy slaps her. What should i do now? I am so sad.. Even i think it would psychologically interfre in me and i wont be able to giv my interview well. He also had to give me my pocket money for the fst tym from this month but now as we are not talking ( till now) i dont expect that as well., even my university documnts clearanc is in process and i ll hav to do thay alone becoz i think he ll go bak to his hometown soon aftr this. My frd said leave him alone he shud feel sorry for wat he did and then ask him to marry u bcoz he cant control hmself and he slapped out of mood swing may be ? I think histry z repeating itself frm wat happnd last tym - wen we werre wid frds- on road, rememba?

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He called me twice today. Asked about me , my mother, and what i did whole day. I told him that i was praying. He sd why? I said " so that my huby be on right path" . He asked what did he do ? I said he beats me , he said wife shouldnt do such acts that he has to do this... I said God knows better who is right and wrong he changed the tpic after this. I also dint pushed the buttons again.

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(Oh, yes, you've got the Monsoons going on right now, haven't you! Tres dramatic, yes.)

So he met your mum, they both got on, that 'released the gate' in his mind and - WHAMMO - he wanted to consummate the relationship finally. A little TOO over-enthusiastically. (Understandably - albeit not acceptably - given what we already know is his problem with boundaries and his pent-up sexual frustration.)

How many times did you have to say "NO - STOP!" before you slapped him (on the face?)?

Define 'beat me on the back'?

Lightly slapped you *where* on the face?

Whatever/whichever mere details, he's behaved like a dick. Worse, actually... like a date-rapist. And then, because you stopped him, he (yawn) felt bad AND THAT MUST BE *YOUR* FAULT, nothing to do with natural, warranted consequences on his side, oh no!

When you TRUST him?! What, now that he's just smashed an X-sized portion of trust and because of it, put you back trust-wise to mere 6-month daters (if that)?!

Nothing is his fault, is it. Nothing is unacceptable if it's him doing it...only if someone else is. Your rights are nothing of the sort. ...Or had you done what in your country and culture could have counted as decidedly 'leading him on'? (Just checking?)

Whichever (again, just detail)...Hmm... it's not about 'mistake'. But I don't think *I* would have felt like texting him (except for Up Yours, you grossly over-entitled boundary-smasher! or something equally flowery). Actually, I wouldn't. I'd have kicked him HARD in the n*ts! However, you can't be held to that reaction because you'd have still been in shock at that point, having had no prior frame of reference for dealing with it, and didn't really know WHAT to do or say.

Kudos to you on the 'praying for him' comment! ('What did he do' - pfff! Tell him I said EFF OFF.)

"he said wife shouldnt do such acts that he has to do this."

EH?!?!??? THAT HE 'HAS TO' DO SUCH THINGS?????

OMG, it just gets worse!

**************

Here's the upshot of what I think:

For the first time, you take your financial reliance on him/he takes it to a new extreme - pocket-money. Next thing you know: his feeling he's got the seal of approval come Green light from your mum to proceed and intensify your relationship sees him basically pouncing on you, ignoring your protests, like a date rapist with zero care, empathy or even sensitivity towards you via a long history being your boyfriend.

I would not recommend marrying this guy. Or what do you imagine his already over-entitled attitude towards you will be like, treatment-wise, once you're the full hundred percent reliant, financially (and in any other ways), on him? Will he whip you with a stick if you forget to do the washing-up? Lock you in the under-stairs cupboard for having forgotten to call him Sir?

START THINKING REALISTICALLY IN THOSE TERMS, BASED ON WHAT HE'S JUST DONE THAT (BE HONEST) YOU THOUGHT HE COULD *NEVER*...*EVER*... DO TO YOU OF ALL PRECIOUS PEOPLE, LET *ALONE* THE DISGUSTING ATTITUDE AFTERWARDS (WHERE'S THE REMORSE?!).

This spoiled, greedy, over-entitled little boy did *not* try to force heavy-petting or intercourse onto you because he was angry and out of control. He got angry (to point of out of control) and tried to forcibly take what is only yours to fully-willingly bestow because of his ONEROUS ATTITUDES AND (from there) THINKING.

IMO, he's capable of being downright abusive - to point of textbook case!

Even 6 months' grief (comprising 1-2 months of acute pain followed by ever-dissipating background pain) would be preferable to a lifetime of being treated like CHATTEL OR SOME MAN'S MANKEY PET DOG THAT NOBODY ELSE WANTS!

*Was* it that he felt the emotional restraints come off once he'd met your mum or was the truth that your mum is quite mild-mannered, leaving him to believe that, with no big scary dad available, you were far easier prey than originally thought?

Methinks you and Maryam getting freed-up at the same time says something. Methinks you two should hit the town together. And I think you should asap get a job. Pick a small, intimate company (and not open-plan). Your commercial-social hang-ups will quickly get easier over time.

A never-ending, personal Hell under the label of Marriage will not.

Sorry, but - what he's done/the way he's just treated you is my dealbreaker both in terms of one-off severity and for the fact the 'negative, drip-drip-collecting bucket' has now just finally overflowed. I'm still here for you if it's now to help you get over him but I am not willing to fix via advice a relationship with a spoiled, abusive baby. Sorry, MEE.

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Beat on bak means just as fun he put a light fist on my bak while he was driving car.

No he slapped me in a light way on cheeks to stop me from touching him.But i got upset bcoz i m so sensitive.He said sorry to me nex day.


See he is not an abuser.I sometimes abuse him verbally but he nevr replies.If he was i would have dumped him.I am an idealist and he is very close to my ideals.He understands me.The only thing that bothered me in him were his mood swings but they r now quite lessened.But his ROMANTiCISM is increasing day by day.He was never going to do sex wid me forcefully on that day but i was angry even why he ws trying to open my shrts/touching my breast :-p ( i mean i really feel shy/also religous cultural factors i dont want that right now :-p ) .He also feeelz we wll be soon getting married aftr he found my mum liked him so he has got extra confident. Hmm my job,well i m finding that too :-)

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I dint understand this "Or is he trying to ensure you get yourself only a 'throwaway', non-teaching job for now, with the option to start your actual career - if you want to once you've both relocated - still open?"


About maryam , no his parents would know in any case.They check her like CID.

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"I said he beats me , he said wife shouldnt do such acts that he HAS TO DO THIS"

HOW MANY TIMES DID YOU TELL HIM - JUST WITH YOUR MOUTH - TO STOP TRYING TO OPEN YOUR SHIRT TO TOUCH YOUR BOOBS?

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Well i was so in hurry to get out of the situation that i sd one or two times when he ws kising me nd wen he tried to open my shrt butns. I slapped him. The reasn was that i was so frightnd of ppl - here in pak there is too much religous intoleranc- ppl do not allow public scenes of afection - if anybdy saw us they could evn take us to jail thats y my reactn was so spontaneous

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So you were kissing and he tried to gain access to your bra and boobs. You said no - what one time or twice? More? Be precise.

Then you slapped his hand away and - then what did he do? Take me though it, step by step, action by action.

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He was forcefully kissing me .i tried to stop him/saying dont do that (once or twice,i dun remembr bcoz i couldnt count at that tym-spec when smbdys kissing u how can u speak more than once, u can just try to speak :-p ) Aftr that he put his hands on my shrt button to open to touch or in case suck my boob, i immediately slapd on his fac wid full force.He looked at me surprisingly. I said " i trusted u and sat wid u in this car thats my mistake" i said that intentionally so that he doesnt repeat to touch or come towards me however i didnt meant that from heart- he became quiet and started car and took it on road to drop me at home . I knew my words would have hurted him (however those were done just to stop him at that moment- ) he is only quiet when he is too sad or in deep thought - i said why are u quiet- he dint reply - i then took his hand in my hand just as a sign of affection or apology or just to xplain him that i dint mean it- he took his hand swiftly and said that dont touch me - i just tried to b cool and make him cool and cut some jokes he was or acted serious he dint respond - then i put my hand on his arms he said i ll slap u if u ll touch me - when i again touched he put that light handed fist on my back which we used to do each other in fun- it dint hurt me physicslly- i said ok beat me but dont be angry- he said just dont touch - i explained him that it was intentnal and wat can i do wid ur romantic emotoons which never stop - he stayd quiet- wen i
again touched his arm he slapped on my face - a light slap but i was surprised - feelings hurt as well owing to my sensitivity - anyways aftr two days when we met in uni , he said that how is the princess, i said which princess in the world gets slapped , nobody in the wrld taught u that u cant slap a woman-he said that i didnt mean that ,i am sorry.


Aftr a few days by chance he read my prsnal diary in whcih i had written that i was crying when he slapped me but dint tell him i just covered my face that tym - he read that and aftrwards he said to me that i am too much worried i have read ur persnal stuf - i just ignored his words becoz i dint want to make that thing a topic .. However a fee days aftr when i was talking to him abt my fathr demise and i missing him on texts he said that u cry everytym for ur dad and always make me worried i said i dun cry i promise he said that "no mater how many times u promise me u can never satisfy me now , i know that u cry and if i ask u to not cry ,u wont stop, infact u ll stop teling me "- i was just linking this part of his convrtsatn wid that text hmm may b he said aftr reading that

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You can say, 'MM! MM-MMMM!', with body-posture to match. All of which is obviously precisely what you did.

Sorry, but that still smacks of date-rape attempt territory to me. Good for you for slapping his face. That right there is when slapping *is* acceptable. And he can't possibly hold that act against you, given the circumstance. Whereas, the same can't be said for him. Plus, what you said was just the plain truth, MEE. You *did* trust that you could sit with him in his car. And so you should have (been able to). Because he's supposed to be your fiance and, as such, welfare-protector both bodily and mentally/emotionally. How is THAT 'protection'?! It isn't. It's him being charged with protecting you from the proverbial monster under the bed but proving the monster under the bed IS HIM!

I personally, however, wouldn't have asked him why he was so quiet. And nor was it your onus to apologise. You're within perfect rights to defend yourself and your honour. He, on the other hand, had NO RIGHT to slap you. He should have slapped himself!

I'd have exited the car right then and there and walked home! Did that really not occur to you somewhere in your mind?

His reaction to that and your taking of his hand, frankly, enrages me. YET AGAIN, his crime towards you gets turned around to become your crime against him. How utterly galling! The only thing he should have said when you asked him, why so quiet - OR WELL BEFORE YOU'D HAD A CHANCE TO SAY A THING - was this: Oh my God, Sweetheart, I am SO SORRY, I don't know WHAT came over me, please-please-please forgive me?!

And you don't need to be a sensitive person to find that behaviour of his untenable, either - per se *and* because of what he's supposed to be to you. So stop blaming yourself - for any of it! Like you said - you thought you could trust him. You've done nothing wrong, NOTHING.

NO...THING!

And then he has the giant cheek to THREATEN you/the relationship (I'm too worried)?!

*HE'S* too worried? WHAT ABOUT YOU?

AND IF YOU WANT TO CRY ANY OR EVERY TIME YOU THINK ABOUT YOUR DAD THEN YOU CAN!

Mee, if you let him get away with this then you'll be signing your consent to his trying it again at some point. I mean - 'How is the princess'? And then two seconds later you're supposed to believe his 'sorry' for having slapped at you (WHAT ABOUT THE REST OF IT, THAT'S THE LEAST OF IT!?) is sincere? This guy doesn't respect you *nearly* enough, if at all! He KNOWS the cultural embargo you're both under - but you more than he - and why. He KNOWS you abide by it and why. He knew never to try it on, let alone that forcefully, to begin with, didn't NEED to be told 'No'!

Why aren't you showing him that nobody treats you like that and telling him he's dumped? If he doesn't like being in a fianced relationship with a princess then clearly he should go find himself a peasant! LIKE HIM!

Sorry, but my earlier final word on the matter stands.

First time called crazy

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Dumping is not the final choice everytime when u r in such a passionate relationship where u both r so deeply in love.i also noted that in this thread , at a point u said " if i would have been in his place i would have left u for suchh behavior" and also at a point u say " You should have dumped him ". i mean what i got from ur mindset is that we both shud look everytimw for dumping each other or in other words if u d be in my or his place u would always think of dumping the partner.So good at leaving exes,right?

Everybody is different.I believe in working for a relation if u want to keep it. And as we all know we all can guide each other according to our perception but noBody can walk in our shoes.However i have noted ur points and i will not let him get away with his any silly act now.In the meantime i met his mother and sister last week.They were nice people and his sis also offered me to have fun/outing with them.She bought jewelery for me from other city.however he had made a comitmnt to meet me at this weekend and he went bak wid fmly without fulfiling comitmnt so i got angry and texted him that i m not talking to u till u come bak n see me :)

First time called crazy

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He is snding me lovely poetries, my mom thinks i am too dominant on him.She likes him a lot.I told her that i wont be angry on him dont worry.She thinks he is kinder than me :)

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I got a job i m tching in a school enjoying my time wid lil angels , he is fully supporting me wid my decision to work and cant thank Allah ever that He gave me the best man in the world.i just wish we get married soon .Life is beautiful if u have beautiful people around. :)

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I am feeling attracted towards his best frd. I first time met him even before our relatn started .He is a very handsome guy a lot similar to my bt but he has green beautiful eyes and i am a very beauty conscious person.I fall for beauty easily.Recently i havent met him from many months may be about 8 months or
More but i couldnt forget his face.My bf loves me to core and my family deeply wants us to marry.I think that there is very lil chance that he ll accept my proposal becoz he is very sincere in his frdshp with my bf.But i am unable to resist myself.i am unable to forget his face.even i have the fear of losing the diamond like bf as well if i get rejectd from his best frd.what should i do in such a situation? I dun wana lose from both sides :-(

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