How do I keep inheritance from boyfriend?

So I’ll be coming into some money this year via an inheritance. It’s not a huge amount but it’s still a lot for me. I’ve been with my boyfriend for 18 months, he doesn’t work. I don’t either due to mental and physical health issues. I’m hoping to start up a little business with the money as well as travel with my daughter and buy things I need, furniture etc My parents keep telling me not to tell my bf, but there’s no way I can keep it a secret, he will see me buying things and going on holiday lol My question is, obviously he’ll know I have some money, I wouldn’t tell him the amount. But is there anything else I can say it is? The reason I ask is because someone mentioned when people hear ‘inheritance’ they see it as free money and they will likely get a look in

Yes unfortunately people reckon that any free money is free money, let alone your inheritance which is YOURS by the way & no one else's. It all depends on what sort of a guy your BF is. If he is a genuine, caring man, he'd be more than happy for you but the fact that your parents are advising you not to tell him is something you need to think hard about in more ways than one. Best of luck with your business venture & don't let your BF get in the way of your dreams.

FckdupLil, he's only a boyfriend, your finances are none of his business. Not one iota. NADA! One, you've only known him less than 2 piddly years (which means you don't know him at all, bar his uppermost surface or what he chooses to say he is/isn't with his mouth), and, two, you're not married so neither are you obliged. So why on earth would he think he were entitled to ANY of your income or even have the foggiest idea of how much you have in your account?? Obviously he's a greedy, take-taking parasite or your parents wouldn't be warning you to keep it secret from him....which you are entitled to do, including lie and say it's a business start-up bank loan - OR JUST LOOK AT HIM BLANKLY AND SAY, Frankly, my dear, that's none of your business. You're licensed to lie in this instance because, if someone whom isn't whatsoever entitled to pry into your most private, personal business, even has the HUGE TEMERITY to to think so, to even dare ASK, then they've made your lying to them IMPERATIVE. Understand what I'm saying? HENCE the well-known saying: Ask me no questions and I'll tell you no lies. Me, I'd just look at him and then say, 'Trunkie want a bun? Who died and made YOU my father?', before chuckling incredulously and sauntering off. He can't MAKE you tell him. So why are you behaving like he could?

He can’t, I think my parents are just worried because he doesn’t work, that he will try and guilt trip me into paying things for him. I have lent him money before now, and he has paid me back, but obviously this is free money I didn’t work for or anything. He is not very good with money, I offer advice on how he can save etc but he don’t

So - whether or not he could make you (good on ya) - what you're saying is: he's guilt-tripped you into paying his way numerous times - hence your generalising with 'things'? ...And, they're worried he's going to do it again, but worse/more impactfully now that you're richer? ...And, that he's paid you back in the past (what - every single time?) because the amounts have been fairly 'petty', thereby do-able? ...Meaning, how would he pay back the increased amounts that, according to your parents, he'd be bound to expect? "Not very good with money": By this, I take it you mean, he spends or fritters it, saving nothing, and, therefore, is always short and always having to rely on you: Bank Of FckdUpLil? Why doesn't he work? If he doesn't work and earn an income then where on earth is he getting the funds to pay you back?? Do you have separate abodes or has he moved in with you (if so - when)? Why did you call yourself FckdUpLil, by the way? In what way do you consider yourself effed-up? Where's the inheritance coming from? Is it a trust fund, started by your parents when you were a kid - or a relative left it for you in their will? Hope those aren't too many questions? Or this one? (Haha, sorry, couldnt resist.) Anyway, look forward to your answers. :)

@Soulmate Lol a lot of questions there! Well he doesn’t work due to physical health issues so he gets benefits. He said he’d like to work again but says as he doesn’t drive and the public transport in his area is not good, he’s limited on jobs. We both live separately. He has borrowed like £60 max and payed back within a couple of weeks. He isn’t nasty manipulative but it’s more a guilt thing, like he’ll say “he’s only got £10 to last him a week”. The inheritance was left in a Will for me from my uncle who died last year. Why do I consider myself effed up? Lots of reasons really, and not all bad. At the time when making an account that’s how I felt i suppose. Thanks for your reply

Hey FDLil (naah, you ain't effed-up, you're coping fine, don't worry), Haha, you obviously haven't read your namesake's thread (Lily31) or you'd know, those questions were quite few for me. So he's on Disability. What - and you're a jet-setting executive? NO. You're on benefits too! You are not obliged to support a man unless there are very good reasons for it. He sounds like he's a Social Parasite (albeit mild at this early point). Look at all those obstacles to his working. He sounds like Henry from the old rhyme 'There's a hole in my bucket, Dear Liza, Dear Liza' (google). How does any of that make him your responsibility, anyway? Can't he live within his means and leave any generosity on your part entirely up to you (i.e. treating him to a meal out/night at the pub/take-away). Why is he living ABOVE his earnings? Answer: Bank of Lil. You're going to have to put your foot down...'This unfairness has been continuing too long, with you doing too little to improve matters; I cannot afford to support another grown adult so you're going to have to tighten your belt and live within your means from now on or you'll ruin me'. And if you're not even living together, that just makes it worse. How does he treat you and behave towards you in all other areas. And know that they don't have to be overtly nasty; they can just keep using you like a facility in a way that is not only unacceptable in a mere romantic DATERS situation, but bound to toxify the dynamic whether you or he know it or not. Is that what he wants? ....CUZ THA'SS WHADD'L 'APPEN! So is THAT what he wants? (Let's guilt him back and box him into a corner whether either he admits he cares only about your facility or about you as his partner.) NO NORMAL HEALTHY MAN WOULD ALLOW THAT. HIS PRIDE WOULD SUFFER IF HE HAD TO BORROW MONEY FROM HIS GIRLFRIEND EVEN ONCE, TWICE MAX. HE WOULD ASK *ANYONE* RATHER THAN HIS GIRLFRIEND. Okay? And FYI, that 'guilt thing' IS nasty and manipulative; it affects your wellbeing then actual psyche, BADLY...UNDER your own radar. IGNORE the surface behaviour and chat (Nice Enough Guy) - the NOT niceness is in his ACTIONS-ACTIONS-ACTIONS, especially the sustained and pervasive. The guy's not healthy, his psychology is not working right. Unless he's got no arms and fingers - he should be investigating govt-backed training schemes, like... - how is he on a computer? So how does he treat you (ACTIONS/LACK OF ACTIONS-wise)? And bear in mind: if one can't cope with a partner, including putting their rightful foot down about inappropriate behaviour, and has to post on a forum, basically, how do I protect mine-and-only-my money from my MERE, not even live-in, boyfriend, then, the relationship or its set-up is NOT NORMAL. Were normal problems and niggles going on, if he were a normal bloke, you'd be able to handle him and wouldn't have needed to come here. You shouldn't HAVE to protect your money - and yourself from being unrightfully, undeservedly made to feel bad - in a proper, romantic relationship where Love, Companionship and (at your stage) Moral Support is the only point. By doing this as a routine, he's marring and risking the relationship. If you HADN'T come here - at some inevitable point, this set-up itself WOULD have bothered you...you'd have finally exploded and ended it. The GOOD news is, you can change his behaviour, simply by changing yours. (I can help.) We do it gradually and subtly (counter-manipulate). Yupferit? If so....Now that I know he's a 'Nice Guy' above-table with Iffy and Inappropriate ongoing Actions under-the-table (spells Covert Narc or Narc-Sociopath), please consider this: How many other "good friends" or girlfriends are likewise lending him money every month that you wouldn't/couldn't have a single, solitary clue about? What if that's why he has no incentive to get off his arse, even to do a job from home? And why he has no incentive to end the (presumable) torture of being prevented by useless transports links by moving digs? What's he spending his money ON? What's he buying? Whom is he NOT paying back when he is seen to pay YOU back? And did he have knowledge quite soon into the 'relationship' that you would be in-line to receive an inheritance? How long have you been dating, etc? Tell me everything and let's give this a really good frisk (be as lengthy as you like! - I can't talk, haha!). HOPEFULLY, you're right. But that still doesn't explain or excuse his male-abnormal attitude and this inappropriate dynamic which, at the least, needs serious un-contorting before it dies anyway/regardless. Roger - Over? :) (Your response re the married man was brill, btw. You're not effed-up, you just FEEL it, that's 'all'.)

I don't want to scare you off, though: we could do with respondents like yourself (and it's excellent for building your confidence and self-esteem to know you're providing an actual lifeline in some cases). So don't be shy - just say if you're not ready yet to discuss him to that level or at all/any further, and I'll leave you free to keep responding until you say you're ready...or even if you don't. Is that a plan, Stan(etta)? :)

No time-pressure, either - your thread, your pace. :)

Oh, wait - I've just realised you've posted again but in a new thread! FYI, you're supposed to keep the one, original post. So I'll paste it in here, since it IS a reply of sorts to the above, but I have to freeze your new thread (with links to this): _________________________________________________________________________________________ https://www.peoplesproblems.org/showtopic/13692/breaking-up BREAKING-UP FKEDUPLIL - May 8 2024 at 12:00 Member since Apr 2024 "Hi. So I’m struggling with breaking up with my boyfriend, we’ve been together a year and half, he’s lovely but I’m not in love with him and there are a few other issues too, I told him last weekend so he knows how I feel. He has been good to me, like when I had to move he helped so much, and I appreciated it. So the guilt of all that and other things, like my autistic teen daughter is finally comfortable with him, and she gets on well with his daughter when they are together. She doesn’t really have any friends so me taking this away is upsetting for me. I will be trying to get her out and into hobbies soon that hopefully she’ll make friends there. I just feel like I can’t be with someone if I can’t give them the love they deserve. It’s hard also because I love his company, we get on great, but it feels too much like a friendship more than a relationship 😞" ____________________________________________________________________________________________ And NOW I appreciate why you're torn. Okay. This puts a different light on it all. I'll get back to you as soon as I can - and others can reply to this update in here. (Well done for having had a talk with him. How did he handle it?)

Hi again Soulmate. Yeh he was a bit upset. What happened leading up to that was this, all that week I was in pain with kidney stones, I ended up having to go hospital to get checked out and they almost kept me in. He came with me and we was up there a long time. The next two nights while he stayed over I made the dinner, now I say dinner I got easy food (pizza/pasta bake) as I knew I didn’t feel like standing around making dinner. He didn’t once offer to help. Now he doesn’t normally anyway, but the fact he knew I’d been in pain all week I was so pissed off. If it was him, I’d not let him lift a finger while in pain. So on the 3rd morning I told him I wanted him to go home. I told him why, and he thought I was wrong! I stood my ground and told him no I’m not, he basically says I should have asked him. What is he ,12?? And then he asked if there was anything else, and that’s when I confessed that I didn’t think I was in love with him. I asked him to give me space, that was almost 2 weeks ago, and I’m suppose to be going to his tomorrow to talk about it.

Just woke up to get a drink and spotted your reply. Short response for now: 1. OMFG, you're dating mine and my UK friend's ex!..and about a million others'. (Not literally, but - OH YES HE *IS*, MALIGNANT!) (Explain more tomorrow.) 2. Phone him and act your socks off (for your daughter's sake). See if you can buy more time - another week. It'll give you and I a chance to work out some sort of plan. Tell him, you need (say this phrase verbatim - ) 'one more week'...the reason being, you tell him, because you got quite a shock to find out you had Kidney Stones, which came hot on the heels of not just a tiny bit of traumatisation from "the sustained, writhing agony". ERGO, until you're over that, you 'can't sure whether you're feeling this way simply because of that, or whether what you said was true - or quite possibly bit of both - you don't know because, obviously, you're not a trauma specialist. You just know your feelings are very up-in-the-air at the moment, like they've been put through a blender'. This leaves your option open when it comes to EASING your daughter into a new scene whilst NOT stripping her of her routine, background confidence foundation (her friendship with his daughter). He ("Narcissist - predator senses") has sensed your confusion/uncertainty towards him (they always do; I advise not even THINKING about it/anything you don't want them to know, when in the same room as them - I'M DEADLY SERIOUS), ergo has commenced the Devalue stage ("Narcissistic Cycle Of Abuse: Idealize, Devalue, Fake/Real Discard (depending on whether they have another fan/lover to catch them if you keep yourself dumped). You could equally call it - first treat you well (coming with you) to crank you up (raising your sense of value, confidence, hope, making you vulnerable via the feeling of Gratitude)....before letting you crash to the ground (expecting you to cook or do ANYTHING buh-puh-fuh-fuh-WTF?! BLOODY SNAP! FOLLOWING AN OPERATION FOR A, NOT JUS- sorry, not just Hernia but Strangulated Hernia - I was rushed into theatre, could have died quite shortly if not! I'm completely over him and all past Narcs/Spaths, BUT, for some reason, NEVER CEASE to be shocked each and every (bloody) time (haha), so I won't get me started - I'm just giving you a parallel to show that ultimately, they all behave exactly the bloody SAME under the same bloody circumstances; Google The Narcissist's Playbook, you'll see.) 2. If you want, you could even add that you do, however, have 'a counselling session' booked (and leave it at that, no more info, not even who/where etc., just reply, 'Not ready yet, keep you posted'.) Let's disappoint and destablize HIM and put HIM on tenterhooks, shall we? (Google "Out-Narc-ing the Narc"). By saying 'a' counselling session, this leaves you a further option/side-alley, should you wish to take it, which is this: 'Counsellor spotted a number of things from my past, says this traumatic episode has triggered the old stuff back to the surface and so he and I need to finally dig that up and chuck it in the bin, first. So I've gotta have a couple more. Will keep keeping you up-to-date. (LIE) Love you, speak soon.' You fail to get over yourself as one whom normally doesn't lie (where do you think your daughter got that truth-wiring from?), and lie - you're done for and I can't help you. It's HIS fault you've gone off him...he kicked the love out of you (like I warned, little realising you were "there" already). I mean, define not nasty. What's not nasty about making someone feel responsible for another grown adult and OBLIGED to loan them money - which itself, via the fact you (cough) know he (cough) needs you to, makes you feel bad, followed by feeling bad on levels you aren't even aware of, but the one you are: makes you feel INCAPABLE OF REFUSING LEST YOU WANT TO BE SEEN AS A RIGHT...COW. You're not a cow if you tell someone No, or that once was enough so no more. You're just normal. Boyfriends aren't supposed to borrow off their gfs. ESPECIALLY WHEN SHE'S ON BENEFITS AND A SINGLE MOTHER! So then there's the Guilts for being aware on that deeper level, that you instead at the time could have spent ON YOUR BABY. ...lots more going on inside. Bottom line: you don't want to but if you don't, you'll feel like a bad person. Indeed - what is he - 12? Answer: funnily enough, that IS the (resting) age of an N-Spath (pissed-off age, 2, 3, 4)....so that's a bit shpookay...mind you, so is me waking up in the night and coming straight to my puter....same wavelengths maybe? Last time, I think was with poster Jae, months back). 3. You DEFINITELY are not effed-up. YOU HANDLED THAT COMPLETELY CORRECTLY - LIKE A PRO! (...Bar the piddly 2-weeks, but, that just means 99% instead of 100 - boo-hoo lol). And that's why I know you can pull this off. ;) Aspies.....if only they all knew.... fantastic mimics....obsessive about whatever they're into... equals....fantastic actors and actresses - EVEN BETTER THAN BLOODY NARCS! There's probably a lot you don't know about Asperger's in relation to Narcs. Even if you're a carrier - what I call Cuspie. (We're gonna need a bigger boat) (- name the film). Manana - afternoon or evening, I'll pigging MAKE a window! (Got loads of other newbies waiting, too. No rest for the self/other-defending-counter-wicked.)

IOW, I'm bloody impressed, Modom!

I would just like to thank you with your replies, I’m sure you have better things to be doing lol I appreciate it though. Do you really believe he is a narcissist? I’m really not sure I believe that myself, yes he can be manipulative, as he has shown this but that doesn’t mean he is a narc? I’ll be back later, to write more

Back again, can’t sleep as usual. I was thinking about when I first met him, I thought he was great, over time I thought “could I do better?” Yes there probably was better out there, but I felt I didn’t deserve it. I thought I’d met who I deserved to be with. He doesn’t work, neither do I, he’s a procrastinator, so am I. Plus I’m in my 40s now, I don’t have a huge choice of men lol my confidence is on the floor right now, which I am slowly trying to fix.

"Do you really believe he is a narcissist? I’m really not sure I believe that myself, yes he can be manipulative, as he has shown this but that doesn’t mean he is a narc? I’ll be back later, to write more" Pant-pant - here I am! And, no, not better things, just practical and friend things that won't wait (I'm doing up my villa in Spain and it's at that age where a lot of things need replacing/fixing as well as enhancing...and over here, finding/ordering/receiving/arranging is.....................soooooooooooooooooooooooooooo.....................................slowwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwzzzzzzzzzz aaaand THEN SUDDENLY NOW-NOW-NOW!!! Still, musn't grumble, keeps me fit (sob)). Anyhoo... You'll probably have to read this a number of times to digest it: ____________________________________________________________________________ Do I really? Put it this way: If not, then he's doing a fantastic impression of one (but why would anyone). As you'll see explained on your web-travels, their (corrupted) psyches and life in an oxygen-tent of Delusion makes their behaviour based on their unique REASONS for such (once you look *under* that table, with the right torch), too distinct, rigid...."scripted". ("Narcs - Hiding in plain sight" / "- snakes hiding in the long grass" /"- wolf in sheep's clothing" (google)) After reading up on it properly, even a (inquisitive, 'Secret Squirrel' type of) child of 8 could identify one. ...Well, except for your stupid-in-a-clever-way Coverts...albeit, my kid did, so - yeah - 8., albeit NOT IF THEY WERE 'SPIKED', DRUGGED-UP, FROM A LOVE-BOMBING (*Priming) CAMPAIGN still in-play. (Hence your Paedophilia victims.) It doesn't matter what age you are, gender, how intelligent (we fall in-love with our hearts), usually strong, sassy....any of that. Morally Upstanding, hard-working/giving, with Empathy - you're at risk at some point in your life. And you don't have to be pre-primed, either: it just helps the particularly bored and lazy ones if you come to the table already still more primed than not from a prior narc; co-dependent; in a hurry to avoid grieving by toute-suite filling the ex's side of the bed; down on your luck; in transition, socially; new to the area; too busy, exhausted, distracted from over-work to notice the early Red flags; already dangerously starved of love, attention and affection (whereby if their approach is cheesy, you're the 'beggar that can't be choosy'......vulnerable and needful for whatever reasons. Less work for them. However, those veteran maestros who have something to prove (e.g. one DID get away, thereby challenging their warped belief systems) or whom have just grown too arrogant (nspaths, usually), opt to go after a real challenge. Even Domestic Crime Unit Officers get tricked into a relationship or marriage with one. It takes time for enough evidence jigsaw pieces to fall into place - and NOT being constantly in Fight Or Flight whereby your iQ drops drastically or shuts off (so that in threatening/dangerous situations, you'll react reflexively rather than risk harm by hesitating to think and possibly end up Freezing like a rabbit in the headlights. (This experience teaches you to re-learn to trust your instincts. E.g. "If it was him, I’d not let him lift a finger while in pain.", i.e. I would NEVER treat my lover like that in that situation! And nor would I...and nor would any healthy person capable of love who genuinely loved the other. We couldn't.) We beans have a very limited ranges of actions per intentions/aims, available - simple example: the guy's just sneezed, without time to cover his mouth, because (a) the room's dusty, (b) it's a nervous condition, (c) he's coming down with a cold, (d) he faked it for a laugh to see see if you'd be fooled, (e) someone put sneezing-powder on his clothes, (f) he have an allergy to cats/dogs/your perfume... You go by what you know is normal behaviour and reactions in that situation and context. So it's too easy to come up with reasons and explanations that apply only to a normal person, to view a Narc, particularly a Covert or Spath still in Covert mode (until they feel safe to let it all start to hang out), as if they're a normal, normally-lovely/ok person, going through a really bad moment or (later down the line -) phase....their past (real or BS) trauma coming back to bite them, excusetera, excusetera, excusetera (just made-up that word - spread it round for me?)....and if only you can CONVINCE them how much you love them, then surely the guy you fell in-love with will return. And the more you want original-him to, the more you miss original-him, the more you plump for normal-guy reasons, hopeful that you'll come out of it together. It doesn't occur to you yet, that the reason could be, (g) he's got Covid and wants to take that (his pathological perception-) "smug" look off your face by bringing you down a peg or 10 in infecting you and all who sail in you. Neither does it occur to you that you might not be the only person he asks to loan him...and (sorry) with an nSpath, low-functioning (pretending to match you in social status/class), it usually IS a petty amount - 20 quid. But not when timesed by who-knows-how-many. I mean, have you never asked yourself WHY he only asks for 20 or so, when having to ask is a fairly regular occurrence/need, so why not ask for X hundred the ONCE, and pay you back monthly, perhaps with a bit of interest or, as that or plain gratitude, like, COOKING WHEN YOU'RE INCAPACITATED? (And why didn't you feel capable of expressing your hurt and outrage at the time? You're not (google) "walking on eggshells" from a chronic lack of confidence and trust in the relationship/him, are you?) So, nope, one's Prince/Princess is not ever coming back - bar a few love-bomb-ettes (which they too soon bore of, meaning, it shrinks a bit more each time) whenever they sense you're too close to your line in the sand and about to blow/majorly confront/leave. "He" doesn't exist and never did. He's mainly or completely (depending on severity) a character, who fashioned himself to ("like magic!") fit your bill and needs almost EXACTLY, including using your love-language (they basically copy and mirror you to the extent where, unbeknownst to you, you are your own lover.....Now there's a mind-bender, eh). As more and more time and drip-drip trauma goes on, you suddenly notice they're no longer anything LIKE you....and then, OPPOSITE to you. Example: If you're a smoker, a Narc Covert/Spath will even take up smoking and pretend they're a smoker too..., only to drop it once they've safely 'got their feet under your table') and nag you to death (or, stage-dependent - forbid you to smoke "or else".......I know (cuckoo!)...their over-over-entitlement and arrogance is shocking. They're not even qualified to be anyone's boss! The higher-functioning 'mere' Covert IS employable, however...tends to be their one-and-only source of life stability - unless you're it.) And even psychiatrists get conned here and there so. It's an evil Lottery with these walking products of a sick society. BUT....Aspies/Cuspies, Higher-Functioning, or once self-adjusted/moulded adults, more like two-thirds NT, one third Autistic, are particularly lovely as a partner, which neither NTs nor most Aspies realise) (...I've probably just started a global stampede hahaha!), which makes them more of a target. ...A bad phase..... PFF! Going through a bad phase is never any excuse, nor was ever another word for a (secretly) shockingly giant, nasty, uncaring, childish, lazy, neglectful, tiny or zero-hearted, disinterested, arrogant, superior, pompous, exasperating, simultaneously, hurtful-&-infurating, boundary-smashing, taboo-smashing A*sehole. Plus moments and phases aren't never-ending with no signs of improvement...which is usually when, subconsciously, you think: Hang on a minute...?! PS: When it came to accompanying you to the hospital (out in public) - did he have to be asked to do that, as well? They're not injured, they're crippled and hiding it, especially during Love/Nice-Bombing..are never going to get out of that chair and want to superglue you into it with them....UNDERNEATH them (human cushion, anyone?). Or keep you in yours if you start to heal and try to stand (push you over, reinjure you back into it). Convincing you from The Off that they're normal, healthy, capable, functional, EMPLOYABLE, is the first and biggest con of all. You're finding out early. They're only helpful and, to quote you, good to you, for as long as it takes to catch you and then it's REVERSE drip-drip-drip...and suddenly they can't as much as pee on you if you were on-fire and are letting you down even more than before until it becomes the new norm (if you don't get out) because your sick of complaining and seeing no change (bar maybe a fortnight or so just to shut you up). Research question: does he having any really weird/repulsive physical habits? Back to that night after the hospital: People with the slightest bit of investment in, and empathy towards you, or anyone in your place (like you said on behalf of yourself- ), wouldn't/just couldn't do (fail to do) or be that way, even towards a stranger, especially not at a time like that - an opportunity, normally, to spoil you. It's akin to the 'devoted husband and new father-to-be' at the maternity hospital, and as soon as you get home with baby, not lifting a finger to help, despite she's (haha, was about to type '/he's' and then I remembered, men can't have babies, rofl!) (sorry, it's Sat night and I'm still up) been through the greatest trauma a woman can ever go through and was a difficult, long-drawn-out birth to-boot. We wouldn't just FEEL like a cold-hearted/sadistic cow - we'd BE one! A normal-healthy might perhaps THINK, 'uhh, do I have to?'. But it would be fleeting because in reality they wouldn't DREAM of doing it/failing to! It's called Morals, Empathy, Protectiveness, Social Duty/Responsibility, Compassion, ...HUMANITY. His "Reveal" of what's behind the mask, via in particular this above-table 'flash', may be coming slowly, incrementally, ...but, from recognising that all-too-common 'scene' (plus the rest) - it's coming...Unless you roll over, never complain, put on a Pinny and chain yourself simultaneously to the kitchen sink and bedpost. Oh, and slowly emotionally starve. Once they've got you and relax, you will never again get cooperation, support, loyalty, or anything a lover normally provides, from a Covert Narc/Spath in long-con hooking mode. They steadily starve you so that if/when they need to stop you from deciding to end it, all they need do is throw you a few crumbs. Crumb-Throwers, Push-You-Pull-Me merchants, Flakes, "your other kid", Mr 'How many times do you have to be told?', and Sabotagers, are their other-other middle names. And yet if YOU drop a single ball, all Hell breaks loose - maybe straight away or allowed to fester and grow into revenge for another time....like, prime example, playing dumb and making you cook just after a shock and hospital admission & operation? So your timing, coming here, is good. You're unlikely to 'go back to sleep' and have to go through ANOTHER and ANOTHER Narc Cycle of Abuse (Covert style). BASICALLY, a Covert is the seemingly shy, quiet, but secretly spiteful little cowardly weasley kid at school, usually an Introvert, who'd pinch you from behind in the crowded assembly hall for no sodding reason (in fact, something you didn't even do or intend or realise or which wouldn't have bothered a normal kid), so that when you turn, you can't tell who it was...now in a grown adult's body. Google "Plausible Deniability" (wasn't meee?!, and/or, prove it!) (you can't). And PS I forgot to add earlier, re. the cranking-you-higher before letting you drop, aka setting you up for a fall, *once he got you home*: well-practised Narcs are mentally lazy, aka 'energy-over-efficient' thus lovers of the BOGOF ('buy one (action+result), get one free'), so there was this, too: A hospital is OUTSIDE...full of other people, potential witnesses...who CARE as well as can spot dodgy behaviour and might have a quiet word with you/start hinting/querying. Coverts/Spaths warming-up, ensure whenever you're with other people, especially your loved-ones, they look like the loving, supportive...perfect partner. That way, come the day you realise Narcissistic or formal NPD is what they are and try to get moral support/advice/tell your doctor, you won't be believed or even entertained: "What - Mr Wonderful-Squeaky-clean-Perfect - from what I've seen all this time, he's an ANGEL...what ARE you TALKING about!?", which then fits with the "Narc Slander Campaign" that they might well have begun in the early days..."caring" but loaded comments about you. It's part of (google) "the Narc Isolation campaign / why Narcs isolate their victims", or "why narcissist treats strangers better than you". That whole incident is an old chestnut and giant Hallmark. There's a third reason as well: so that other blokes can't hit on you and steal his Golden Goose. (Feed him a lot, do you? Exactly how much money or hassle are you saving him?) Covert Narcs, ESPECIALLY Spaths once safe (thus secretly cockier than ever), behave to everyone else beautifully, and you, increasingly (drip-drip-dripdripdrip...) like a worthless piece of beep, not worth taking care of, even when incapacitated. It's to off-balance and Devalue you, make you feel that you're neither loveable nor worth nurturing and protecting, even when you need that VERY ELEMENTARY relationship feature. So (to take the right to try to fix) 'there must be something wrong with YOU' (nada - truth is: the opposite). Think about it: he went from South in public, straight to North at home (he's not worried about what your daughter thinks), but in a (what on a normal person would be called) Passive-Agressive or Passive way. Nope...'Covert-Aggressive'. (Passive-Aggression is another thing entirely and not usually aimed at someone else.) Furthermoree, with deep Coverts, it's more or equally about what they FAIL or REFUSE or whoops-FORGET to do/remember/have occur to them (you should of asked). They're the type have to be nagged to do the washing-up and then whoops-smash your favourite crockery so that you never ask them again. They get a real kick out of wrong-footing and disappointing you; it feeds their delusion that they're a superior specie. Also, whilst I'm at it: if you tell any Malignant not to ever do X, they'll do it, either because you're due a punishment/revenge or just because you dared tell the almighty them what to do. I call it, painting a Bullseye on yourself. (Research question while I think of it: Is his upper body quite fit and muscly but his legs skinny, per se or in-proportion? And has he been letting himself go, physically, as well, since the "I love you"s? And is he just TOO darned good in bed?) Almost a decade ago, I got my final jigsaw piece over the fact that a 'close' female 'friend' I'd known since school was a Covert when, in response to 'Why didn't you tell me at the time?' (having slept with her, according to lying-her, psycho-monster of an ex) (she was the monster, and social predators aren't afraid of their actually innocent prey (exes) any more than a lion is, a gazelle; plus it had been too long to still be under his spell; she'd basically just fancied a sh*g).....and noted she hadn't volunteered the info, I'd had to winkle it out of her....she replied this: "Well...Because you didn't ASK" Me: Since when was I telepathic? Her: ........nervous little 'heh-heh-heh'.....(shrugged, tried to look cute, turned to busy herself with something) If I had a pound for every Narc, in whatever role, who's said that (because they've been cornered, caught red-handed) - followed, either by rearing-up to distract me from my enquiry, or whoops-dropping something so it smashed, failing to remember to turn up, inappropriately late/absent - or claiming they HAD told me (like I hadn't been present myself on that occasion!).... my villa would be done-up by now...and my yacht. (Not really, being rich as actually pretty sh*t.) She'd been fine for decades, btw. Then suddenly....acid-drip-drip-drip-drip-dripdripdripdrip-TSUNAMI! (Invasion of the Body-Snatchers - "Who the eff are you and what have you done with my (not perfect, bit cool, but) lovely-enough friend?" Next thing I know, my supposedly morally decent, respectable friend has been fired and arrested for stealing at her place of work: an old people's home (vulnerable, needy, forgetful people). Again, there's a difference between being desperate enough to be tempted for a second, and actually going through with that mere temptation. It's called, I Am An Adult. Narcs are kids...can get into or start trouble, can't get out of it. She was only part-time, could have got a second job rather than steal. Could have asked me or any of her friends. But - Nah....working's too much like hard work, plus asking nicely is making yourself what they first and foremost cannot stand: vulnerable, thereby NOT superior, and ruining their all-vital, false image. It can also be simply that their situation changes ergo you, the mere facility-bringer come Enabler (google) - your free services are no longer necessary (or because they've found better) and you can eff-off now, whatever-your-name is. Or they start an argument based on something tenuous or a simple misunderstanding and, not giving you a chance to clear it up, dump you on the spot, immediately blocking you (and telling everyone you're the Narc) (which you can't be - you've got an Aspie mini-me, and adult Aspies can't tolerate delusions, pretense, pretentiousness, unfairness, injustice, bad manners, meanness....you name it...anything that veers from the natural. And why would they when they worked so much harder than everyone else their whole life just to fit in despite simultaneously having to cope with sensory overload, brain overload, and all the things NTs can take for granted as soon as they pop out of the womb. Hard working is an Aspie's middle-name and, btw, check-out, and read to your daughter, the article I pasted in Jae's thread re. how Aspies and their work ethic have been earmarked as the next big commercial thing...the perfect employee if you take the effort to accommodate them (e.g. no strip-lighting and loudly ticking clocks).). Back to narcs and this long-term fake friend: Tricking you into funding them/saving them money outside your own awareness is one thing (Covert). Beyond that, actually stealing/conning is a Covert morphing into Sociopathic Narc territory (including helping themselves to your stuff to point of misappropriating - and, with a bit of situation-engineering, even your car if you let them). If WE were that desperate (not even saying that was her reason; never found out) - we'd turn to a friend. I knew nothing, save that that's what happened. She at first gave me HER version (a mistake) but then couldn't as the truth became clearer, at which point she failed to turn up for a BBQ at mine for another friend's birthday celebration, and ghosted me (ran away from her shame). Inappropriate Pride and Fake Facade/Persona meant far more to her than keeping lifelong friends (I wasn't the only one). Me-Me-Me, You Don't Matter, I mostly hate you, am seethingly jealous of you, you irritate me to uck, but don't you dare leave me. NSpaths can keep the Prince/Princess mask on for about 2 years or so. Coverts are the ones that can go for bloody decades before peeling or ripping their mask off to show you the sadistic monster inside. ...And, missus...letting you even STAND in the bloody kitchen WAS a flash of Sadism. (Try to convince me how it wasn't, go on.) Covert Malig. Narcs are well-known for flaking on or abandoning you in your hour of dire need. E.g. find out you've got Cancer and they're off - poof! They're the type, espec. Spaths, who 'pop out for the morning paper' and never return. They'll also argue against or deny black & white evidence right in front of both your noses (e.g. getting funny with you via text) - known as, "Denying that the sky is Blue". (..."Then she caught me in the shower / It wasn't me! / , caught me wotsiting on the wotsit (can't remember the lyrics right now)/It wasn't me!") With my Fiend, it was simply that I'd never got that close with her before said period, plus had never been in her crosshairs before (she'd been getting increasingly funny with me in the couple of years prior). Berbom. My turn. They just need a secret victim/emotional-puking toilet/mummy/free housekeeper, cook, bottle-washer, nanny, lackey...Everyday Slave whose shackles and chains are psychological and powerful. By purging via you, their human toilet, they can keep better control of their fake-charming self in public, you see, which for Coverts is about falsely perfect image, and for conning, nicking Spaths, about trustworthy image (so that they can con, or woo/warm-up as your emergency or eventual replacement, anyone from your circle. ....and let's be honest, normal-healthy humans will do ANYTHING for Love, won't they. (Sure, but in future, you'll know you have to be more aware/alert (NOT float away with the Honeymoon fairies), more discerning, know your Narc onions enough to self-protect or better yet, prevent, be in a good place in your life, everything like clockwork, and make that initial test-drive period COMPREHENSIVE...all road surfaces, all weathers, climates, both hands on the wheel, no running on Auto-Pilot...) _________________________ Re accepting this (potentially) early warning of what he is/aligns with, behaviourally and attitudinally: I realise you're naturally incredulous because it's only very recently that he's started - repeat, merely starting - to bring his true nature/attidues/behaviour/neglectfulness up from under, so - here you go: to explain the reasons why he went from supportive-60 to non-supportive-Nought in 'six seconds' (...unless he's an electric AI-bot who ran out of charge??): (And Pre-S: realise that some Narcs, particularly your Classic/Benign, are unaware of WHY how they behave works to get people chasing and pandering and getting severely addicted to them (even against will), whereas the longer/better-practised (veterans) have made the links...hence Malice Aforethought. They're the worst because it's like having your partner accidentally, rancidly burp in your face due to some medical condition, and the other half of the time doing it deliberately to pee you off and get a reaction/get you back. Playing Dumb like that - having no qualms, no embarrassment, no shame, ensuring their neglectful arrow hits SPOT-ON (funny, that), is a speciality. They're also the over-teasers and over-ticklers.)) ...These are what come up when you type "do narcissists expect you to read their mind" https://www.google.com/search?q=do+narcissists+expect+you+to+read+their+mind&client=firefox-b-d&sca_esv=359d6b2fe139ffab&sxsrf=ADLYWIKNizsGGV9MGo7pqltj1R1YUIFgpQ%3A1715457007716&ei=78s_ZrelK-OD9u8PhqUZ&oq=narcissists+-+expecting+you+to+read+their+&gs_lp=Egxnd3Mtd2l6LXNlcnAiKm5hcmNpc3Npc3RzIC0gZXhwZWN0aW5nIHlvdSB0byByZWFkIHRoZWlyICoCCAAyBhAAGBYYHjILEAAYgAQYhgMYigUyCxAAGIAEGIYDGIoFMgsQABiABBiGAxiKBTILEAAYgAQYhgMYigUyCxAAGIAEGIYDGIoFMggQABiABBiiBDIIEAAYogQYiQUyCBAAGIAEGKIESJQwUPwNWKwacAF4AJABAJgBhQKgAYsRqgEFMC43LjS4AQHIAQD4AQGYAgygAqUSwgIOEAAYgAQYsAMYhgMYigXCAgsQABiABBiwAxiiBJgDAIgGAZAGBZIHBTEuNC43oAesWA&sclient=gws-wiz-serp _____________________________ It's as if they expect you to be a psychic, ready to decode their every unspoken desire. This expectation often leads to frustration and confusion for those dealing with narcissists. Imagine constantly walking on eggshells, unsure of what will set them off or make them happy.Jan 6, 2024 Narcissists Expect You To Read Their Minds - Medium Medium https://medium.com › narcissists-expect-you-to-read-the... _____________________________ Why do narcissists expect you to read their mind? ... Quora https://www.quora.com › Why-do-narcissists-expect-yo... The narcissist wants YOU to think you are the problem and have issues communicating. It's also projection. Narcissists will accuse YOU of what ... I feel like my narcissist ex always expected me to ... 5 answers Aug 20, 2018 Did you ever felt that the Narcissist was reading your ... 11 answers Apr 27, 2018 Can a narcissist read your mind? - Quora 9 answers Jul 8, 2021 Can a narcissist really read your mind? Some think ... 5 answers Apr 13, 2019 More results from http://www.quora.com (SM: Note, THEIR BEING telepathic (not!) relates to how they seem to know when to try to "Hoover" you after fake-Discarding you (to tear you down a peg or 10), or you ending it with them, and is a separate issue with a perfectly rational explanation (which is very basically, they've done this before (times a million), it's all they do, like an actor only ever playing one to three stage characters their entire career hence knowing their stageplay and script like it's second-nature, thereby knowing the timing of the grieving stages you're going through, and when (and how, per stage) to strike, that's all. Here's a survivor from Quora who seems to have started to grasp the abovementioned attitude of, 'I'd rather you were (back-forth) convinced I must be mentally retarded than evil/mad (i.e. than know what I'm up to or why, and have to do X'). ...Yeah. Dumb when it suits them, cleverly conniving, duplicitous and superior the rest of the time, and always perfectly normal when others are around...funny that. Google "Narc - constantly moving the goalposts".) ((my comments/elaborations in double brackets) ********************************************** Jacquie Wells · Follow Narcissistic Abuse Survivor. Learning life's lessons2y Originally Answered: Why do narcissists expect you to read their mind? Narcissists expect you to anticipate their every need, to devote your life to their happiness. ((Popular Meme: 'Narcissists expect you to give up everything to be their Nothing'.)) They want your focus on pleasing them. In doing so, you ((unknowingly)) position yourself to be let down, disappointed, deminished ((sic - diminished)), and manipulated. A narc can easily cause you to emotionally break down and get you to think you are going crazy this way. (("- Cognitive Dissonance": he loves me, he loves me not, he loves me, he hates me, he'd never do that, he just did...it must be me, reading and taking things the wrong way..." PS: happily, Aspies have elephantine memories, rich in detail, so can't be fooled as easily as NTs: ..."I clearly remember you promising faithfully not to forget to bring the milk home this time, because it was last Tuesday, about Ten-to-Nine, and you were stood right there, about to open the front door, wearing your blue shirt and stripy tie, briefcase in your left hand, ...and you said (quoting verbatim): 'Christ, have we run out already? What do you want - Full-cream or Semi-skimmed?'....so you're WRONG, I did NOT forget to ask you, and you KNOW I didn't!"...that sort of thing. Me, I just say: You're forgetting I WAS THERE. (PS: Covert Narc joke: Trying to understand a Covert is like trying to smell the Colour 9.)) The Narcissist likes partners who believe all their lies, don't ask questions, accepts (sic) all the blame the narc actually deserves. The Narcissist wants extreme loyalty, to be treated like a king (you will never be considered a queen though). The Narcissist wants everyone focused on how to please them, look up to them as if they are the epitome of awesome. When your mind is focused on pleasing someone else, you won't want to question or create unhappiness. You won't shame the narc, cause negativity or drama for them. The narc can, at will, cause happiness or harm to the person falling all over themselves to keep peace. We walk carefully, we are hyper aware of their needs as we sacrifice our own needs. ((Mainly because you have neither the time, energy, nor motivation any more)). The narc wants us invested in them, so that they have total control over us. BUT, the narcissist DOES NOT want anyone reading their mind and knowing their secrets. To read their mind is to know their truth, their reality, the abused ((OR ALLEGEDLY ABUSED!)) inner child who hides behind bravado. They want people to serve the one their masks represent. They want their fantasy believed and catered to. It makes their life easier if they are not constantly having to prove their fake persona, decide what that character might want or feel at any given time. That fake person doesn't have to be consistent. For shear ((sic - sheer)) ((sorry - might be kids reading)) pleasure the narc can turn a happy moment into agony and chaos for the person trying to please the narc at any cost ((google "Why Narcs ruin special/important occasions")). It's abusive thinking, abusive behavior on the part of the narcissist. A cat and mouse game, manipulation, taunting, and terrorism. It's how Stolkholm Syndrome can begin, it's how trauma bonding ((google "NPD - Trauma-Bonding and Intermittent Reinforcement")) , and gaslighting take hold on the partner of a narcissist. It's the fantasy they want played, a narcissist does not want their mind read. They want their words obeyed. Good luck. Not ever again for me. God bless. 1.2K views View 10 upvotes ((Cheers, Jacquie - well put!)) _____________________________ Narcissists expects you to read their minds Reddit · r/ManagedByNarcissists 20+ comments · 1 year ago Skip to main content Narcissists expects you to read their minds : r/ManagedByNarcissists ... In some other cases, a narcissistic boss will use ... Is Anyone Else Expected to Be a Mind Reader? - Reddit May 21, 2014 Why do narcs want you to read their mind all the time? - Reddit Nov 26, 2020 Does anyone else's nParent expect you to read their mind? Nov 16, 2023 Did your nex always expect you to read their mind? - Reddit Dec 23, 2023 More results from http://www.reddit.com _____________________________ ...and so on and so forth. How's that for a condensed crash-course (for your stage of play, anyway)? Sorry to bombard you. Again, take your sweet time...read things more than once to really get it 'in there'... and really let your mind join the dots based on what I've just outlined and what you find on the web (sleeping more, so that you 'dream', which speeds up your processing (dreams are flashes of it)). Also, still go ahead and do your first reply before commenting on this one. I appreciate it's extra-hard to believe it could be true when you're this early-on in the (er) production. You might not be awake enough; after all, you only just got your first, real jolt of crushing disappointment/betrayal. You might need to 'come round' properly, still. Even if I'm wrong, at least you can eliminate narcissism or outright NPD from the enquiry, PLUS, be genned-up in case you (or your daughter) cross paths with one in the future. USUALLY what happens - and why it's said Narcs come in Threes (or is it Trees - certainly NSpaths will c*m inside anyone or anything!) (har-dee-har) is when the ex-spouse was one type of Narc, you then didn't finish de-sliming (-priming) before getting a boyfriend, hence he's another of a different type, just milder or less outwardly aggressive (after which, you naturally feel like being single for much longer and end up with a normal-healthy). If it's indisputably too soon, you end up with, more severe (Spath/NPD-AsPD) - and after that (yikes), N-Psychopath (also clinically labelled NPD-AsPD, confusingly). Sorry for any repetitions. It's late (er - early).

Oh, I didh't realise you'd done two! "Back again, can’t sleep as usual." Because your mind will be whizzing (your Emotional In-Tray - AND Pending - are heaving! And this is about survival so - food, sleep, whatever, can wait (the mind can't tell the diff between physical and psychological danger; to it, it's all the same...which is true...which is why the severe are called (by clinicians!), Slow Murderers/Serial-Killers......"Sleeping With The Enemy" (bit difficult). Even without that, Aspies/Cuspies are known to have problems with sleep. (Are you and daughter Night Owls?) As you're not working, try to sleep in the day or take as many 20 to 40-min naps as you can (you get to see more of your processing dreams in the day...tend to be more vivid and memorable, too). Drink more water and eat more animal/bird and fish fat than usual (they're what your brain runs on)....which is great news if you adore roasted, crispy chicken, duck, lamb or pork skin (phwooar!) and bacon rinds. Mineral water's even better but don't drink too much or it gives you puffy eye-bags (sodium). Also stroll in the woods if you can (oxygen-rich due to the trees, plus the colour Green is highly calming, even works on ADHD kids) Eating-wise, if you can't face it - sip broth/soups, milk, real juice, and forage bits and bobs, small mouthfuls, from the fridge. Or just proper, high-cocoa-content chocolate, garden peas (raw are gorgeous, pod included) and milk (cocoa/milkshake/Nesquick) or ice-cream. A way to sleep and re-charge without actually sleeping, is to lie on the sofa or in the bath, eyes closed, preferably, listening to classical or talk radio. Or doing Sudoku or crosswords. It brings your left-brained thinking (Spock) to the fore, whereby your right-brain (Kirk) can take a break or long nap (or just shut the uck up for five minutes!). But writing it down (this case, here - your secret, interactive 'blog') and being able to hear (read) yourself back, above all else, works like magic. It's literally GETTING IT OUT, toxins included....Rogerian Talk Therapy is still the original and best. Or, just the ongoing/ever-growing and re-edited rap sheet. Being angry, in THESE cases, is GOOD, it speeds up your healing/recovery AND strengthens you, as well. It also let's your inner animal out (at last!), which, trust me, if you have even just ASD traits, is FAR bigger, stronger and scarier than a narc. When Narcs see Aspies finally 'lose it', they don't feel clever and satisfied like normally with NTs, they are FREAKED-OUT and tend to literally run out of the house. Because Aspies paste Narcs over the walls using something particularly painful: straight-forward, unbridled TRUTH, which if forced to hear (especially the way Aspies spell it out), can put a Narc out of action for a long time (which gives other fresh or long-waiting victims-to-be a chance to join their own dots and get away unscathed). (Silly boy...) "I was thinking about when I first met him," Starting the 'tapes' from the very beginning? How typically logical and orderly. :) "I thought he was great," Yup. "over time I thought “could I do better?”" Yup. (And YES - by miles!) "Yes there probably was better out there," Yup. "but I felt I didn’t deserve it." (SWERVE - SCREEECH!!!) On what basis? "I thought I’d met who I deserved to be with." And now you know better. Not least because - If it had been him - *you* would have cooked for him (etc). So the evidence shows crystal-clearly that he isn't remotely in your league, that you are in a much higher one and should pick/accept from it. "He doesn’t work, neither do I, he’s a procrastinator, so am I." You're a procrastinator? OMG, someone call the Police, quick! (You won't be by the end of this.) "Plus I’m in my 40s now," Someone call the local Nursing Home, quick! (Stop bragging.) "I don’t have a huge choice of men lol" You effing do. What do you think happens to all the Nice men that got snapped up? Whom do you think male lovelies (espec those with Aspie traits) get mostly snapped-up BY? They're escaping or getting unjustly tortured and Discarded as we speak (with plenty of them coming on here - explore other Relationship threads and you'll see). My confidence is on the floor right now," THAT'S the problem. The rest are self-limiting beliefs, myths, and Narc propaganda (after all, if there are no good men left because they're all happily married or got snapped-up early, then it's better (isn't, actually) to STAY with your damaged one. See how that works? (Funny, considering how the rest of the time they'd have us believe they're all retards who couldn't run a bath, so can't be blamed, eh.) "which I am slowly trying to fix." Without procrastination. In fact, the opposite. (Funny, that!) Here's the trouble with you: HIM.

Here you go - the more subtle signs, including your post-op experience. Google "why coverts give with one hand and take away with the other" (thereby spoiling or even cancelling the nice act out). Some extracts - ((my comments)): _________________________________ https://www.verywellmind.com/understanding-the-covert-narcissist-4584587 " Covert narcissists can be difficult to recognize at the outset of a relationship. Many people have fallen victim to the manipulative behaviors of a covert narcissist without realizing what has happened until they are already in emotional pain. ((...or find the love has somehow left them...been kicked-out of them UNDER their radar)) ((In fact, you can try googling "Coverts - under-the-table-itis")) It might be more accurate to suggest that the extroverted (overt) narcissist would be a lot easier to see coming than the introverted (covert) narcissist. In relationships, covert narcissists cause hurt due to a sense of a lack of partnership or reciprocity in the relationship..." ((TICK!)) "In addition to looking for the red flags of a narcissist, it is also important to be able to recognize the more subtle behaviors of a covert narcissist. Being aware of these traits can help empower you, helping you to recognize and better navigate potentially unhealthy relationships and interactions." "The overt narcissist will demand admiration and attention, where the covert narcissist will use softer tactics ((failure to do, not taking the initiative as if suddenly socially inept)) to meet those same goals. The covert narcissist will be much more likely to constantly seek reassurance about their talents, skills, and accomplishments, looking for others to feed that same need for self-importance..." ((usually by putting themselves down in front of you so you feel socially-obliged to disagree)) "... Shaming is a tactic that narcissists may use to secure their sense of an elevated position in relation to others. The overt (extroverted) narcissist might be more obvious in their approach to gaining leverage, such as explicitly putting you down, being rude, criticizing you, and being sarcastic.6 The introverted, covert narcissist may have a more gentle approach to explain why something is your fault ((you should have said - as if you needed him to read your mind when cooking/getting in supper for YOU is a no-brainer to everyone else in that situation)) and they are not to blame. They might even pretend to be a victim of your behavior or engage in emotional abuse to put themselves in a position to receive reassurance and praise from you.7 Whether overt or covert, the goal is to make the other person feel small." ********* PS: while I remember - IMPORTANT: If he asks for another 'sub' but this time a significant amount - PLAY INCAPABLE. Make up some school expense or something. This is in-case he's a Spath. They gain your loaning trust by frequently borrowing petty amounts which they pay back in full, on-time, every single time but theeeeeeen - whammo! - can I borrow X Hundred Quid?...which - if they pay that back too - next time the REAL sting will come. (Just ensuring you proceed with utmost caution; you don't need to be rich to be a target, just richer than THEM.)) ********* "Although they are not always sneaky, some covert narcissists ((the Malignants/severe)) can take joy in creating confusion. They may not engage in blaming ((yours did)) or shaming, but instead, causing people to question their perceptions and second-guess themselves. (('maybe it's me, maybe I'm expecting too much or more than a 'mere' man' is capable of' (NOPE). Wish our top veteran advisor Manalone was around at the mo. - he'd convince ya (I'm gender unknown on here, see).)) "This is another way to create leverage between them and another person. A covert narcissist needs to use tactics like this to elevate themselves and maintain power in the interaction. If they can get you to question your perceptions, it allows them the opportunity to manipulate and exploit you more. " " Procrastination and Disregard Because their need for self-importance reigns supreme, covert narcissists will do whatever they need to do in order to keep the focus on themselves. So, where an extroverted narcissist ((or a firmly-established, now over-cocky Covert, behind-doors)) will blatantly push you aside ((sometimes physically)) or manipulate you to accomplish their goal, the covert narcissist is a professional at not acknowledging you at all. It is not a coincidence that narcissists, in general, tend to gravitate toward interacting with caring and compassionate people. The covert narcissist recognizes those opportunities for manipulation as well. ((Like your birthday - or any time you're vulnerable/'open'. My narc ex-spouse, for example, actually got a birthday gift spot-on for-once (a useful ornament). It wasn't expensive but I'm not materialistic, I just like aesthetics, so I was thrilled and gave it pride of place. He couldn't have that (curses - foiled!) so a month later, promptly bought the exact same gift for his brother's friend. Lovely, eh? I suspect he'd bought more than one of the item at the time. Either that or (or additionally), because I was thrilled, and he liked the GRATITUDE AND COMPLIMENTS, wanted that approbation again so went back to the same shop...neither is good.)) They have no problem letting you know that you are not important. ((anything to make you feel small...so they can feel tall (finally) up against you. They're over-competitive, which you're not supposed to be with your partner. It's all Highly Inappropriate, all of it...letting you down, flaking on you, betraying you, being passively disloyal, like never taking your side, never having your back despite you have theirs...)) " Giving With a Goal In general, narcissists are not givers. They find it difficult to put energy into anything that doesn't serve them in some way.1 A covert narcissist might present themselves in a way that looks like they are giving, but their giving behavior always has the intent of getting something in return. A simple, everyday example could be something like putting a tip in the jar at your local coffee shop. A covert narcissist would be much more likely to put their tip in the jar when they know the barista is looking, in order to help facilitate some kind of interaction that allows them to be praised for giving. The intent of giving for a covert narcissist is always more about them and less about those to whom they are giving. Emotional Neglect Narcissists are inept at building and nurturing emotional bonds with others. The covert narcissist is no different. So, although they may appear kinder and less obnoxious than their extroverted counterpart, they are not emotionally accessible or responsive either. ((and seem to have zero initiative when other people aren't present)) You will likely not receive many compliments from a covert narcissist. ((I literally got NONE during that 20 years)) They are always focused on staying elevated to maintain their sense of self-importance, so it is easy to understand how a covert narcissist would find it difficult ((irksome)) to compliment you ((eg if company pays you one)). There is usually little regard for your talents or abilities. ((or whatever you excel in, you're suddenly shite at and they, suddenly the world-leading expert - with zero basis/substantiation whatsoever!)) Just as with an overt narcissist, you will likely find yourself doing most of the heavy emotional lifting in a relationship with a covert narcissist. ((- Yes?)) Although the covert narcissist is more likely to appear emotionally accessible, it tends to be a performance and is usually done with intent to exploit or eventually leave the other person feeling small through disregard, blaming, or shaming. Since one of the hallmark traits of narcissistic personality disorder is lack of empathy, the covert narcissist is not going to be emotionally responsive to their partner in a healthy way.5 Recap Covert narcissists often behave in passive-aggressive ((- covert/hidden-aggressive)) ways. They disregard others while exaggerating their own importance. ((MAKE MY SUPPER, WOMAN!)) They also blame, shame, and ignore the feelings and needs of other people." ((Key phrase: failing to do -v- always doing the bare minimum -v- playing dumb to get out of it (or an apology) -v- taking with one hand etc.)) "Examples of Covert Narcissist Behavior To spot the signs of a covert narcissist, it can be helpful to look at how narcissistic traits may emerge in different settings. In the workplace, covert narcissism may look like: Treating colleagues with superiority and condescension Creating a public image that is completely different than private behaviors ((TICK!)) Making unreasonable demands ((- TICK!, this case via failure to sort supper and TICK! re asking for subs from you)) on co-workers and subordinates Belittling and blaming others for mistakes ((TICK! - you shoulda said/asked / why?...don't you know how to treat your loved-ones at your age?..are you actually only 5?)) Gossiping about others in the workplace Expressing rage and then denying their anger ((you haven't got there yet)) What Do Covert Narcissists Do in Relationships? In other relationships, such as those with partners, parents, siblings, or other family members, covert narcissists might do any of the following: Display a lack of empathy for the feelings, thoughts, and needs of others ((TICK!)) Use guilt trips and shame to control others ((TICK x 2!)) Expect others to care for them or solve their problems ((- TICK x 2)) Gaslighting behaviors, such as being critical but making it sound like it is coming from a place of concern ((TICK! - shoulda asked)) Take advantage of other people's vulnerabilities ((TICK!...can't get worst than post-operative and emotionally-knackered, eh.)) Dismiss or deny other people's feelings, emotions, or experiences ((ditto)) Respond to others with passive-aggressive behaviors ((ditto)) " ((See how they abuse you with a whole BAGFUL of tricks, mixed up or all multi-faceted?)) "How to Deal With a Covert Narcissist You may currently be in a personal relationship with a covert narcissist, whether it be a family member, co-worker, or significant other. Although you cannot control what a narcissist does, you can control how you behave and interact with them ((e.g. No WAY can I cook tonight; I shouldn't even be on my feet! - off you scoot to get us all a takeaway, you, or you'll have to have supper at yours and daughter can make herself a sandwich/cereal'. And once he's gone - order in from your takeaway for just the two of you (cheaper))). There are steps that you can take to protect yourself from covert narcissistic abuse..... " ((The article continues)) _________________________________ Why it's too difficult at first to leave them? Well, one of the reasons anyway. Because in order to leave Monstrous-Them, you also have to leave your 'Lovely Guy' or even Soulmate. If he hadn't been completely effed-up, however it happened, to point of dysfunction in any human relationship (the closer-up, the worse it is), in a lot of cases, the guy could well have been. And that's what makes it all so sad. But that's aside from the 'just within the Dealbreaker margins' tactic I outlined above. Plus, I reiterate: you're early-in so it hasn't all escalated to MOST of the time, rather than here and there. Ensure your daughter knows why how he behaved that evening was NOT what men who say they love you normally do, meaning (keeping it simple), your guy obviously isn't reared/programmed right. Explain and warn about everything once she's about 13 or starts asking you questions about it. So that she won't be susceptible to becoming a victim and will defend her healthy standards and herself, every time. Give her this magic mantra: Don't tell me - SHOW ME! Thoughts?

Don’t tell me, show me, yes that is very powerful! Btw I didn’t have an operation that day, I’m now waiting for the hospital to get back to me so I can have another X-ray and see how my kidney stones are doing, hopefully gone, or at least not causing an obstruction anymore! But nonetheless, yes I shouldn’t have been cooking those nights, especially with a perfectly capable man in the house. Reading through all your replies, which I will again. Maybe I’m completely in denial, I think he is a big lazy idiot, who yes does seem to have some manipulative tendencies, but I still don’t see him as a narcissist Covert/Overt. He cries and very emotional about a lot of things, he is even a feminist. He hates the way a lot of men are, he was bought up in a house where the women cooked, cleaned etc but has always said, he believes it should be a partnership. Which is funny really lol When I told him the next day to leave, he said he wanted to get my curtain rods up, help with this/that. (I’ve moved twice in 6 months, not my fault, but I finally got a council place) and he knows I struggle to get stuff done, due to health, physical reasons. Now I’m telling him to go, he says he wanted to get things done today! Lol I have no idea how true that is, I guess I never will. I was looking at my pros and cons list about him, yes I have one of those lol I also wrote down about how one week he stayed, it was Valentine’s Day, I wanted to treat him to a meal out as a thank you/ valentines treat (thanks for helping me move). I paid for the meal, the drinks, and parking! He never offered for drinks or parking. He also never offered any money for petrol or food that week, and I took him, picked up his daughter, took him so he could buy food and then home. I wouldn’t normally have minded, only he bought his daughter this huge teddy for £10 and I thought, that could have helped me for petrol. You clearly have a lot of knowledge in the Narc stuff, I’m not saying you are wrong (still trying to find out myself) but I think narc is thrown around a lot these days. Whether he is one or not, I am thinking of ending it as I want to just think about me and my daughter, she’s 16 next month, left school this year due to serious struggles and mental health. And I really want to better myself, lose weight, get some confidence and try and be a better mum and person.

Oh strange memory, when I moved into my place I’m in now, it has a wet room, so no bath just a shower and it’s big enough for two people. Anyway we was talking one day and said we should have a shower together, nudge nudge wink wink, then he turned around and said that for a joke he’d probably pee on me!! Like I’m sorry what now?! He seemed to think it was the funniest thing, and I’m like, you better not even think about that! He mentioned it a couple of times and again I said no. It’s just so weird, I think he might be in to that sort of thing, but fine talk to me about it, don’t joke and threaten to pee on me just because you think it’s funny. I don’t know if this makes any difference, but he is bi curious too, we have both done things with the same sex. He definitely has a ‘camp’ way about him too sometimes, like his mannerisms, which does kind of bother me, which is also why I feel I shouldn’t be with him. He says he isn’t attracted to men, but he’s done stuff with them. And even when we talked about threesomes, (not actually doing it, just talk) but he said he’d prefer mmf. I’m just waffling on now haha Yes I’m a night owl, I suffer bad insomnia too

Sorry I`m late! Ok - all read and noted and - agree! Re In Denial: No, it's just he's the type uses the "inept" ruse. Hence spouts pro-partnership/feminist attitudes while behaving like the complete opposite: an (inedible) "chocolate teapot". I think you need to order (2nd hand, Amazon et al) Sandra L Brown's "How To Identify a Dangerous Man *Before* You Get Involved" for the fact she's identified every single type and describes their day-to-day 'functioning'. I've read it (obvs). And yours is in there (as a well-worn style of Covert-Vulnerable...'I'm so sensitive, look at me cry all the time'.). May as well be sat at the table, stuffing his face with ice-cream while saying, 'I don't like ice-cream, wouldn't touch the stuff'. Being in Denial for a while is a mental self-protection mechanism (to protect you from Despair in one hit), so it's not a bad thing if you wake up gradually. Re 'I guess I'll never know': What helps, though, is if they do what yours just did: Oh-oh - suddenly it's all OFFERING to do those man-about-the-house things you've had to nag them endlessly over, and utterly RARING to go! Funny, that. (TICK!) They do X 'for you' only when it's worth THEIR while (i.e. to avoid being chucked) - and there's your proof. (Realising they always could have been that helpful/normal - WITHOUT an ultimatum or it being Crunch Time - is what speeds-up their 'kicking the love out of you' (producing even greater resentment on realising the dupe). As for Valentine's Day: TICK! (Parasite) And - no. YOU bought his daughter a Teddy! (See how it's working for him now?) All together now!...."Every-thinggg I dooooo.......Ah dooo it for-or MEEEEEEEEEE". "You clearly have a lot of knowledge in the Narc stuff, I’m not saying you are wrong (still trying to find out myself) but I think narc is thrown around a lot these days. Whether he is one or not, I am thinking of ending it as I want to just think about me and my daughter, she’s 16 next month, left school this year due to serious struggles and mental health. And I really want to better myself, lose weight, get some confidence and try and be a better mum and person." I have zero to do with the people who throw 'Narc' around, think they're experts just because they've read up on it or been through it the once, but, yup, I can appreciate I'm just a stranger on a forum so that's why you must - MUST - read Sandra's book - to see him (and all the others) for yourself. AND to understand the damage their passivity and passive-aggressiveness causes you (and daughter). It really is worth reading - AND ESPECIALLY WITH DAUGHTER! It'll make her Narc-proof in one hit. And will help with any bonding you're bound to have lost thanks to him taking up all your attention and time. But anyway - labels aside - I feel ya! Good Mum Gold Star on your sensible forehead - Thlup! I advise you keep keeping this thread going because, believe me - now you've seen he always WAS perfectly capable and energetic (saving it for other people he hadn't hooked as a fan yet, probably...Swat Narcs - particularly Spaths - Do) - you're suddenly going to be getting more and more "Haaaang on a cotton pickin minute?!" moments suddenly popping into your brain. See Thea's thread (or Heisenberg's) (or was it with a 'u'?)to see what I mean. (* That's the bit that makes romantic-partner-victims seeth the most because they realise it was all - ALL OF IT - done knowingly and deliberately....lazy, over-entitled, disloyal, non-supportive, non-cooperative, spitefully cruel or downright sadistic (in petty-not-petty ways)..... ANTI-relationship, ANTI-your-happiness.) NOT a good role model for your daughter to be imprinted with so - from one parent to another: get HER that book. But you read it first by yourself so you can explain it to her as you go and so you can have the 'luxury' of having your reaction (you can have it here if you like).) PS: "due to serious struggles and mental health." - in what ways? Has he been secretly working on her or spaghettifying her mind as well (on top of your divorce)? PPS: "And I really want to better myself, lose weight, get some confidence and try and be a better mum and person." Once the monkey's off your back and out of your mind - it's actually easy. :) All those things you prevaricated and procrastinated over because they daunted and filled you with dread, suddenly are easy-peasy-lemon-squeezy and you end up wondering why they seemed like such a big deal. You start to tackle them because you suddenly feel like it! I can help with that, too, if you want. I know a fantastically easy way to lose weight. What's happened is this: whether in the background or not - he's been hogging your processors...sapping your mental energy. The over-eating is for the countering Dopamine rush, you trying to compensate for his drip-drip damage to your mood. Either victims can't eat or they overeat (in your case it means you have an emotional 'relationship' with food. My diet caters to that and gets round it (say the word). OH! Just realised you've done a second post: "Oh strange memory, when I moved into my place I’m in now, it has a wet room, so no bath just a shower and it’s big enough for two people. Anyway we was talking one day and said we should have a shower together, nudge nudge wink wink, then he turned around and said that for a joke he’d probably pee on me!! Like I’m sorry what now?!" OH MY GOD - you won't believe this but - here, are you dating one of my (quickly)-exes?!? FFR (hopefully won't need it), the (very dry and unimpressed) response is: Do I LOOK like a human toilet?! But yeah. So he's addicted to Porn like the rest of his type, then, clearly. HUGE Red Flag but - blah-blah-flag-yeah...When you're IN a situation and it's from left-field, etc., you think they're just joking/teasing. NOPE. TESTING. To see what and how much they could get away with generally AND to see if you get upset (whereupon he would add it to his jar of Magic Maggots for use at any time). And that was a Sociopathic Reveal/Tell if ever I saw one. And PS: they're anti-social in BOTH senses of the word: anti-society AND have weird and repulsive personal habits (Spaths, I mean). "He seemed to think it was the funniest thing," I'd have said - Only if I can play-r*pe you up the bum-hole beforehand with my Loofah (and watched him 'make like a goldfish' and drop the subject forever...because, you see, 'they can dish it but they can't take it' is ONE HUNDRED PERCENT TRUE). "and I’m like, you better not even think about that! He mentioned it a couple of times and again I said no." Yeah - see? You say no but still it's push-push-push, nag-nag-nag, wear-you-down, wear-you-down. You've been exploited and starved (bar crumbs) but I think it's fairer to say, when it comes to coercing/bullying/manipulating - you haven't been. Not in any deep way. You've just constantly been FENDING IT OFF, HEADING IT OFF AT THE PASS. Fair statement? You must be knnnnnnnnnnnnnACKERED by now?! Try this one, then: "Ever say that or anything that digusting again and I'll shave your head in the night". Again, like I keep telling everyone here - Do NOT reward rudeness with politeness and propriety - make their shite boomerang around ONTO THEM. And then it is not worth THEIR while to push you....although all that means, is they find an alternative and sneakier way because, of course, they're mal-programmed/-wired like that. But it makes YOU feel better so - WELL DONE for that feisty comeback as well (Thlup!). "It’s just so weird," No - HE is. As aside from weird/odd/"off" - Spaths are actually debauched and sleazy scum-bums pretending (very convincingly during the hooking stage) to be in your league, your class, with your background, your respectability, (health, etc., etc.)... But that was an ucking powerful "Ping-In". ....You thought at the time (yup)...But now you realise. NEW CONTEXT...THE CORRECT LIGHT SHONE ON IT ALL (and I do mean all). Brace for many more, as I say. ". I think he might be in to that sort of thing," HAHAHAHAHA - YA THINK? "but fine talk to me about it, don’t joke and threaten to pee on me just because you think it’s funny." (Yeah, you don't know who you're f***ing with, Evil Forrest!) (Haha, sorry.) Talk to you? Why would he do that? Who talks to their (now - according to his ucked pairbonding/interpersonal programme shunt) No. 1 enemy before planning an Ambush? NSpaths LOVE the Ambush. Anyway... Dirty-Disgusting-Debauched - TICK! Yup, he's a Narcissistic Spath...aka lazy idiot of a slob whom seemingly missed the queue for energy and initiative (etc etc)....yet strangely, WASN'T this bad in the beginning. Google "Why Narcissistic Sociopaths can't seem to hold down a job". "I don’t know if this makes any difference, but he is bi curious too, we have both done things with the same sex." Nah - YOU are/were. He is JUST LIKE YOU, WHAT WERE THE CHANCES!?..."Malignant Narcissist - Omnisexuality". Basically means they don't care WHAT they sh*g (or where/when/how). There's no value to it (NSpaths were usually sexually abused as kids as well as grew up in a rough area in a rough and narcissistic family.) "He definitely has a ‘camp’ way about him too sometimes," So did all of mine (basically - once I realised what they were, I used them as test guinneapigs (insert evil world-dominating cackle and white cat)...which is how I know so much. Study alone? Nah. Experience alone. Nah. BOTH - TOGETHER - Yah. Admit it - there is the minute and 'ethereal' stuff neither you nor I could ever find the words to explain, as well as the stuff we can. "like his mannerisms, which does kind of bother me," My last (type NSpath and every other bloody co-morbidity on top) would cough like the Granny character from Catherine Tate (youtube). I realised I'd 'painted a Narc bullseye' on my backside when, all-of-a-sudden, he had a much worse, *permanent* cough (Don't Do That Please, gets you - Eff-you, you don't tell ME what to do! - and - Ah-haaaah - hate it, eh?!.... "which is also why I feel I shouldn’t be with him." Uh-huh. I wonder if your daughter will have any "second-look" moments to report to you after he's left and it's completely safe? She'll have to see you not allowing him to contact or hoover-attempt afterwards, though, to do that. "He says he isn’t attracted to men, but he’s done stuff with them." Uh-huh. Google something like, 'Are all Narcissistic Sociopaths (or Covert Narcs) secretly gay'. He might well be. You could just be "Window Dressing"...it's very common (remember, recently, about Philip Schofield...and his brother's careless breadcrumb-trail as led to Philip's ousting? Surprisingly more common than you think). Either they're pretending they're straight because you are, or gay because you are, or bi because you are.... they're just disgusting, low-down animals...which you'll see when the mask comes off when you end it. DO IT OUT-OF-RANGE, HAVE A WITNESS. This is the one instance where it is GOOD to dump them by text or (if you're strong enough) by text. You can Boomerang them: "Normally I would do this face-to-face but I'm so resolute, that I don't want to put myself in a situation where you might talk me round. It wouldn't stick, anyway, so would be pointless, ergo, this will avoid wasting both our time.". (Or him finally hitting you - Google 'Dumping a Narcissist-Sociopath - Safety List' or some such.) OR you can say it's to avoid upsetting your daughter unnecessarily. "And even when we talked about threesomes, (not actually doing it, just talk) but he said he’d prefer mmf. I’m just waffling on now haha" You're processing - so KEEP waffling, this is good! "Yes I’m a night owl, I suffer bad insomnia too" Noted. It's either because you (handily) have some *healthy*-Pychopathic traits (explains the fending-off and sassy comebacks) OR it's because your inner animal KNOWS he's a 'mentally dangerous' (which makes suddenly getting aggressive but a small leap), predator. So you can't relax until HE'S fallen to sleep, which can be out of 'fear' OR just you being sensible and clever (you). You're doing great! :)

"Like I’m sorry what now?!" That - by the way - had me in fits! :D I don't know why.... I'll think about it. Even reading it again has put me back into the gaffaws! I'm-sorry-WHAT-NOW?! HAHAHHAHAHAHAHHA!!

Pssst re healthy-psycho traits (like your surgeons, firemen, police, etc. have - that and a good dollop of HF Asperger's - aka Supernova Empaths aka Narc-Squishers) - another (inarguable) reason I think so: Because you - or your inner animal (that sort of shit is her area), didn't go into Freeze. It/You went IMMEDIATELY into Fight mode. Yeah, baby.... You're like Jae, aren't you. And Nav. Kind of knew it was anywhere from abnormal to abusive and that he was pants, but, not ready to do anything about it yet so just fended, tolerated (commented under your breath a lot, too, I'm betting) because, ultimately, you were only bothered in PRINCIPAL, rather than emotionally upset. AND INTRIGUED. The cooking in incident upset you but that was because you'd had a huge fright (could have been Cancer for all you knew, eh....that's what kidney-stone victims usually think at first). And even then it wasn't a lot. You realise from the intro that I offer mentoring/training? (flutters eyelashes invitingly)

PS: Phone a broker - or phone your insurance company and ask for a recommendation for a Pensions & Investments Broker. Get one of their reps round (they should do house visits) (especially if you offer tea & biscuits or even a light lunch) to talk to you about Govvernment-Backed "Kick-Out" ISAs, aka Kick-Out Plans. I turned 7k into 25k in under 6 years - KID YOU NOT! And all I did was write a cheque and sign a contract, and then three times on-the-trot said, 'Put all of it, including the profit, into another one'. And then I actually sort-of FORGET about it...until it was time to come to Spain. If you have to withdraw the money, say for an emergency, you can, any time you like, and all you lose is a couple of hundred, big deal. And there's no income tax to pay. Banks and their piddly Interest, schmanks and their schmiddly etc... Although the big banks like Barclays and Lloyds run their own or in conjunction with the govt. too. You basically can't lose. And THAT way, you might recoup 'Wee' Willy Winky's costs, eh! Minimum amount is 3k. Might be less now, though, thanks to the economic crises (plural). Leave this idea til later, though, and continue with the 'aaang on a cotton pickin' minutes.

Oh - forgot to incude WTF. She's sassy, too (just needs her confidence to continue coming back now that she knows what's what). Check out her thread and read my first and second-latest replies (as I've quoted her in) to see her "mere " long-term, "platonic" "friend" having for years blurred the lines and now pushing the lines for all she's worth (getting inappropriately flirtly and suggestive, and now speaking to her in ways you'd do only with a lover): With NSpaths, if you ARE in a sexual r/ship with them, and even if the sex is out-of-this-world (a main hook), the sex once they've 'got you' always-always starts to get weird as well as mechanical (and then meaningless for you too). And they avoid eye-contact - have you noticed? Make stupid excuses if you ask, like, 'Because I'm not wearing my glasses', when you know for a fact that they're Nearsighted, not Far, because they put them on to watch the telly from across the room practically every night. Normally, you'd spot that but because there's too much else going on - the stuff you notice/realise AND all the stuff you don't have a clue about but your mind's still trying to work-out/reconcile with reality (e.g. he could be unemployed because he's too busy being a petty crook)...it doesn't occur to you. Not at the time, anyway. https://www.peoplesproblems.org/showtopic/13611/jealous-of-best-friend#jumptobottom

Lil, just letting you know RomanBlock has responded to us. Your turn! :) See if you can see what I saw (marjory daw) in terms of her 'FWB's' subtle-but-glaring contradictions. It IS missable, isn't it, the fact his story doesn't stand up under logical scrutiny. Especially if one is just too RELIEVED after 72 non-stop hours of massive worry and dread (that Mr Constantly Reliably Contacting HAD to have had an accident) to think and see straight. I had one fail to turn up (Match dot com...more just for the experience), giving me the excuse the next day via Matchmail (his light had been on for hours) that his mother had died! I replied, 'Do you always feel like chatting-up women whenever your Mum has died'. (Word-Salad-style *owned*)

Hi Soulmate. It’s been a crazy time recently. I broke up with him 2 weeks ago! I was really sad at first, still get my moments i must admit, i even found a secret i love you xxx behind my magnetic white board earlier and it made me sad, he liked to put little post-it notes in places I’d later find with i love you on. I won’t Lie i do miss him sometimes but I’m trying to keep myself busy. I joined a weight loss group last week, lost 5lb this week! Yay, I’m back to my art. I packed up his stuff went to his, we sat down and he basically blamed me for everything bad in the relationship. And sat there like he was perfect or something! That’s what really hurt. He was telling me about how i need help, i mean yes i do, i struggle a lot. I felt like he threw a lot back in my face, all my issues and struggles I’ve had, i felt like he was picking at every little thing. Still it’s over now, back to being single once again, probably another 12 years before I meet someone else lol Tbh i really want to try and work on myself, which i am starting to already, i just feel lonely but I’ll be ok i suppose

Did you???? Wow! Got my contractor here today and I'm playing assistant but, soon as he's gone, I'll have a read and respond! Can't wait. Wow, I was right - you're special, you are. And I saw ya first! :D

PS just between you and I (haha): https://www.peoplesproblems.org/showtopic/13704/question-about-money-matters-in-my-family .....*Squish!* ;) (Banning is for wimps, haha)

Hey again - so sorry, am still playing catch-up! "It’s been a crazy time recently." Yeah, for me, too. "I broke up with him 2 weeks ago!" I love how your self-discipline and intent to do right by your daughter, far outweighs having 'a partner' and s*x-life. Because I KNOW you're a deep attacher and how it would have felt a lot like going, One-Two-Three-jumping off a cliff. That proves you're Top Shelf, my love. That stuff comes out in your vibes so - lose weight for you and to get your self-comfort and -confidence back. A lot of REAL men *love* squishy, curvy bits, and just want a kind heart, and find you more and more attractive as and because they're falling in-love with you. Chemistry is more important than physical looks. I reckon that in addition to cutting-down on food, you'll start to shed an awful lot anyway, naturally. Because when you know you're with a predator (which even just a parasite like a tick, is; they don't have to be aggressive about it - just, be sucking you dry) there is also (my theory) the puffer-fish effect on the victim. They're already knackered so not as on-the-ball as normal but are NOT anyone's victim, normally, so subconsciously try to compensate for lack of energy by, e.g., making themselves bigger AND HEAVIER to have a greater physical-presence and impact, as a deterrent (just in-case), that says - Try it pal - I can always knock you over and sit on you. Basically you can SENSE that in addition, they have it in them to get aggressive (OR get revenge on you later when you're least expecting it - and direly need help/cooperation) so it's in a way like a suit of armour in preparation (while you're still recovering from your marriage break-up, say). " I was really sad at first, still get my moments i must admit," Of course you were/are. It's like giving up drinking too much alcohol. Had its plus-points...for a slow-mo Serial Killer. (;D) "i even found a secret i love you xxx behind my magnetic white board earlier and it made me sad, he liked to put little post-it notes in places I’d later find with i love you on." 1. So did mine. So do many. Like the s*x, the sentiments got too repetitive, like he was rotating them from a 'menu' (script)...became meaningless and mechanical after a while. So I could tell it had all been contrived from the start. That's common, too. Because it's just lies written down (blah-blah-blah), BUT being on a physical thing (paper), it tricks your mind into seeing it as an 'expensive' ACTION. (They're self- and other-destructive type of thick but they ain't actually stupid.) 2. Why do you suppose you found it - only after he'd gone - BEHIND YOUR WHITEBOARD? Obviously it was poking out whereby you noticed it? (Click-whirr-click-whirr - come on, gal, you can do it, lol). "I won’t Lie i do miss him sometimes but I’m trying to keep myself busy." See? Still acting like a Pro Recoverer/self-healer. You always knew what had to be done, and that you were more than capable of achieving with that iron will of yours. You just couldn't because you had a really heavy monkey on your back. You try imagining going about your daily life FOR-REAL with a live, heavy, constantly wriggly and chaos/mess-causing monkey sat on your back, hanging from your neck and constantly hogging your attention. His type ("Mammas Boy") make you so. incredibly. exhausted and lethargic all the time. They don't know how to make healthies fall in-love with them, except during the Love-Bombing, which is done in such a way that what's really happening is, you're falling first into Infatuation (the door to) THEN ADDICTION (the dungeon). So I love how you sense that and logically, therefore, intend to De-Tox. Your instincts and wisdom are fab, missus. Just fab. "I joined a weight loss group last week, lost 5lb this week! Yay, I’m back to my art. " BLOODY NORA! That's nearly half a Stone! Excellent Sprint-Start, modom! Bear in mind this is a 1300m long-distance race, not the 100m Sprint, so you will slow into a steady jog soon, aka Plateau (and then have another fast push/spurt on the last leg when you see the chequered flag/finish-line). So don't be disappointed or think it's something you've done. But that's an incredible first lap, AND all-too-indicative that from here, winning that race is pretty-much just a formality. I know how you can avoid plateau-ing as well. Again, just ask. "I packed up his stuff went to his, we sat down and he basically blamed me for everything bad in the relationship." THEEERE IT IS - YEP! (TICK!) Bully attempting to convince his poor victim that it's all HER fault he emotionally raped her because she had the temerity to go outside at night in a short skirt - or in your case, JUST "A" SKIRT. Or just because you BREATHED. ...Or that the rape wasn't the problem - your, the unwitting victim's - reaction to it was. And/Or because you're Mummy (generous-minded plus self-critical plus sense of over-responsibility due to your very powerful Mummy programme having been made to run alongside the Pairbonding one, so open to considering it). It's like Narc cheaters who say the had no choice but to cheat because you were this/that/this/that.... Oh yeah? 'SO *END* IT, DEAR HENRY, DEAR HENRY, DEAR HENRY, SO *END* IT, DEAR HENRY, DEAR HENRY, (cut-the-CRAP!)' (I'd put on his gravestone: '...Excuses, excuses'. Haha) Nah...they're not going to do that normal-healthy-functional Decent Thing and end the relationship that they only now claim they hate-hate-hated. They're Narcs - delusional and self-aggrandizing thus superior...What they want in life is to have their cake and eat it....his case, continuing to gain and receive the perks of an adopted son (that you never signed-up for and could never afford). " And sat there like he was perfect or something! That’s what really hurt." It's infuriating. Too galling. The more justice-loving you are, the more it makes you want to scream. But it's just evil-kid waffle of the bluff variety ("Din't hurt! :p") (No, but it's stuffed you up, Little Lazy Lord Fontleroy...plus it DID hurt your sick, shrivelled airbag of a puny ego). They all try that. My response was always, 'Well in that case I'm doing you a huge favour as much as myself. Keys, please'. "He was telling me about how i need help," HAHA, HAHA, HAHA, HAHA!! (TICK!) " i mean yes i do, i struggle a lot." No, I suspect he meant, mentally. No? (But - 'Yeah...whatever Too Tired n Timid Trevor') "I felt like he threw a lot back in my face, all my issues and struggles I’ve had, i felt like he was picking at every little thing." You felt like because he did. Meme: Anything you say to a Narcissist WILL be taken down and used against you at a later date. (TICK!) Still it’s over now, back to being single once again, probably another 12 years before I meet someone else lol Tbh i really want to try and work on myself, which i am starting to already, i just feel lonely but I’ll be ok i suppose" Yep, he's a Spath-Narc parasite who sticks at playing Tiny Tim (evil version) while taking swipes at you, first for years with razors and, now that he's REALLY pissed-off, with a machete. Poor wickle Tim-Tim, awwwwww, it's not HIS fault? He didn't need to change his initial poor-wee-mild-mannered Covert approach. Why? BECAUSE YOU'RE A BLOODY LOVELY MOTHER (who probably could have handled 4 kids) WHO RESPONDS TO BABY SOUNDS AND CRIES because she's still got a lot of mothering urges inside her. He went through the Pity Meee, Mummyyyy Door, whoops-knocked your 'baby' out of her pram and climbed into it, trying to look all cute and helpless, whereby your real kid had to stand on the stroller platform at the back (which was probably a bit much for her little legs). If ever you gave her your individed attention, did he immediately under-the-table try to wrest it back onto him? He is beyond not qualified whatsoever as any grown adult's worthwhile, mutually-enhancing romantic partner. He is ANTI-qualified. Meme: Coverts...you don't see them coming but you certainly see them going. How true is that, now, eh? Go over it again in more detail at some point - if you like? I'm sure your readers would be interested and it's RARE you get the nitty-gritty real-time insights (except from victim-survivors). Meantime: Please play and replay and please listen: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXAdAa4ZuuY (If YOU like -) Keep this thread going so that I can help/cheerlead you along the entire Recovery Into Thriving path and so that other victims in your boat but not stage, will see Life After The (whatever type) Narc can only get better (ref. Lily31 - 'Parents Split Up' thread). It's SO vital for giving them the hope and courage needed for daring to One-Two-Three-Jump off that cliff. Because what victims don't know is: that, what with LaLa Land (where you're held captive) being OPPOSITES Land - when the victim jumps, they fall a tiny bit at first but then suddenly start to fall UP - increasingly. It's the Narc that falls up very briefly but then down-down and Splat....unless they find another sucker double-quick. NSpaths, in particular, being OVER-over arrogant by then, commonly under-estimate their victims, just because they were howevermuch on their knees at the time. Diff is - *you* got UP...and turns out, are exceptionally tall. :) Honestly...if you knew the TORMENT most other victims struggle with and AGES it can take before they can dare do what you wasted no time in doing - you'd be VERRRY proud and downright in awe of yourself. Definitely keep playing Respondent if you want. You know too much (tee-hee). :)

PS: (Everybody pay attention!) ****************************** "He was telling me about how i need help," If he DID mean it literally (i.e. tried to manipulate you via the dependency he'd underhandedly created and made habit), the this is how this bit works: No, you DIDN'T need help (you're what I call a MumDad - both parents-in-one-body) You just needed SUPPORT He ADVERTISED as Support But too quickly ceased then never again delivered it (just useless crumbs and post-it-notes - and getting the Perks stuff, like just playing, with your daughter) But because you also now had THREE people in your family to take care of NOW YOU NEEDED HELP. Go on - kick yerself, haha. So simple yet overlookable, isn't it? But you don't have TIME OR HEADSPACE to sit and background work that out. Because they have you too focused then worried about wtf's wrong with them and how to get the Grade A guy back (as well as all the other surface shite/problems/negatives/temporary handicaps they've caused). They don't call Addiction, including Human Toxin-On-Legs, Monkey On Your Back for nothing. You needed support but instead got sat on. So (everyone) you say: I DID need help, but only because I got with you. (Keys, please.)

Here - what did your parents say? Were they delighted?